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oliverstoned 
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Joined: March 26 2004
Location: France
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Points: 6308
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 Posted: July 01 2005 at 05:32 |
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Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!!
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MikeEnRegalia
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Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
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Points: 21121
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 05:50 |
 oliverstoned wrote:
Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!! |
You remind me of the teacher in "The Wall", or the screaming mother in "Joe's Garage".
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Snow Dog
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Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
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Points: 32995
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 06:29 |
oliverstoned wrote:
Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!! |
I don't get it. Whats "teenage" about Metallica?
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oliverstoned
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Joined: March 26 2004
Location: France
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Points: 6308
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 07:06 |
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I can do nothing for you anymore...
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goose
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 20 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 4097
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 07:09 |
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Is there any difference between metal being called teenage music and fifty years ago rock being called teenage music?
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MikeEnRegalia
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Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
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Points: 21121
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 07:16 |
oliverstoned wrote:
I can do nothing for you anymore... |
I hope so ... I want my mind to remain open.
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Snow Dog
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Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
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Points: 32995
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 07:19 |
oliverstoned wrote:
I can do nothing for you anymore... |
I don't need you to do anything for me, neither does anyone here! You don't like Heavy Metal......So?.....And you're point is? You obviously feel superior to people who like this type of music, but you're not!.......I am though!
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Manunkind
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 02 2005
Location: Poland
Status: Offline
Points: 2373
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 08:17 |
oliverstoned wrote:
Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!! |
Plenty of people wouldn't even call some of the stuff you seem to listen to (psychadelic, kraut) "music". At best they'd say that it is full of boring, pointless solos, the songs have no structure and that the lyrics are drivel. At worst they'd just say it's worthless noise.
Not that I'm one of them. I have limited means of checking out this stuff, but for the most part what I've heard I like. Gong, Amon Dull, a little Can here and there... I wouldn't have even tried if I shared your attitude. Fortunately, the Dalai Lama encourages having an open mind and an open heart, and this relates to music as well. His advice has never failed me.
So if you want to keep arguing whether MoP is "true" prog, argue it out with the Dalai Lama  .
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"In war there is no time to teach or learn Zen. Carry a strong stick. Bash your attackers." - Zen Master Ikkyu Sojun
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sideways
Forum Groupie
Joined: June 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 93
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 11:05 |
oliverstoned wrote:
Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!! |
Well, from my experience, there was no Metal when I was a teenager. My Mom and Dad always referred to my groups at the time as "Teenage garbage music" Lets see...who were those bands?
Led Zeppelin
Pink Floyd
ELP
you get the idea
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"Who would wish this on our people?..And proclaim that his will be done" Sacrificed Sons - Dream Theater
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glass house
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 16 2005
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 4986
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 11:39 |
Irony: Put Metallica in the Archives just as meshuggah ( still amazed about that. ).
Master is one of the classics of heavy music. Nothing prog about that.
Disposable heroes is a gigantic piece of music.
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Certif1ed
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Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 7559
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Posted: July 01 2005 at 15:12 |
oliverstoned wrote:
Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!! |
Master may be 19 years old, but it's fans must be in their 30s or 40s by now...
And what ARE Meshuggah doing in the archives 
If that's prog, I'm giving up my day job as a Ballerina in the Bolshoi.
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glass house
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Joined: June 16 2005
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 4986
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Posted: July 03 2005 at 16:43 |
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To Certified Who HAS decided that Meshuggah are in the archives ????
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IDDQD
Forum Groupie
Joined: May 20 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 40
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Posted: July 03 2005 at 18:41 |
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For Progressive Speed Metal, check out Watchtower, Coroner, and Rigor Mortis.
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Bj-1
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Joined: June 04 2005
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Posted: July 04 2005 at 15:30 |
Certif1ed wrote:
Bj-1 wrote:
Certif1ed wrote:
It's the first prog metal album
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I have to diagree with you. Slayer's "Hell Awaits" came out one year earlier than Master Of Puppets, and that album is very progressive and complex at times. But i think "And Justice For all" is even more progressive than both.
P.S.- Master of Puppets is an awesome album
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The main difference between "Hell Awaits" and "Master..." is that "Hell Awaits" sticks purely to a thrash metal format and style and makes no attempt to be anything other than a thrash metal album, albeit a quite incredible one despite the awful production.
The same argument could be taken to "Kill 'Em All" - which blew away everything that had previously described metal in the past.
Metallica redefined metal 5 times, once with each album up to the self titled "black" album.
"Master Of Puppets" was the lynchpin - the album that gave rise to the music we now call prog metal. "...And Justice For All" took it to the next level, although I feel there's too much "complexity for complexity's sake" (given that complexity is relative). Both albums have been plundered to death by so-called progressive metal bands.
I say so-called, because Metallica WERE progressive - they sounded like no-one before them and added subtleties and insights to metal that few had attempted before them. Budgie and Diamond Head are the obvious influences - but Metallica did not simply nick their riffs, instead, they covered songs from the bands in their own style. Something modern "prog metal" bands could learn from.
Megadeth were even more progressive, it's true, but, like Slayer, didn't really venture outside of the metal arena - at least, not on the early albums.
Slayer could in no way be considered Prog, IMO - they never tried to reach outside of the metal "box" - more they developed their own style of thrash metal to it's ultimate extremities, in Reign In Blood (an absolute killer of an album). Progressive != Prog Rock.
I'm not sure of the inclusion of Metallica in the archives - but the first 4 albums should certainly have honourary places. Even "Kill 'Em All" has pseudo-prog-metal classics like "Jump In The Fire", "The Four Horsemen", "Seek And Destroy" and "Metal Militia".
The closed-minded will probably hear nothing but repetitive riffs in those tracks - but I call for the comparison with Hawkwind, who used repetitive riffs in order to bring about a hypnotic state. For me, "Kill 'Em All" achieves something very similar. The next three albums all progress that style several levels each.
That's why Metallica were not only progressive, but true Progressive Metal in every sense.
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But what about Iron Maiden's 'Powerslave'? That one is even more progressive than 'Master..', and it came out 2 years before it. I think Powerslave is one of the very first Prog metal albums.
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RIO/AVANT/ZEUHL - The best thing you can get with yer pants on!
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
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Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21121
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Posted: July 04 2005 at 15:37 |
Bj-1 wrote:
But what about Iron Maiden's 'Powerslave'? That one is even more progressive than 'Master..', and it came out 2 years before it. I think Powerslave is one of the very first Prog metal albums.
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I don't think it's progressive. It's my favourite Iron Maiden (even before Number Of The Beast), but I fail to see how it is progressive. I created an interesting poll, maybe you want to vote there to bring the subject up again (just search for "maritime" in the prog polls).
I don't think that every piece of "interesting" music has to be included in the archives.
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TheProgtologist
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Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: May 23 2005
Location: Baltimore,Md US
Status: Offline
Points: 27802
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Posted: July 04 2005 at 18:57 |
oliverstoned wrote:
Please, one time for all, stop polluting this forum with your teenage "music"!!! |
One of the most important things about music that you don't seem to understand it there are no age limits or boundaries.Anyone can listen to anything,music is timeless and ageless.You have a very closed mind.
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Certif1ed
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Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 7559
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Posted: July 05 2005 at 03:13 |
glass house wrote:
To Certified Who HAS decided that Meshuggah are in the archives ???? |
I wish I knew - it's a complete mystery to me.
I listened to Catch 33 several times, and while it's interesting, and the band experiment on one or two progressive levels, the music certainly isn't prog rock by any stretch of the imagination - or am I just being harsh?
I've just located a copy of I, and will listen to more of their music to see if I've got it wrong somehow, as I never berate a band without listening deeply and analytically to their music first.
On Iron Maiden; while they were progressive for a metal band - and one of my favourite bands in the early 1980s until Metallica came along - Master Of Puppets goes way beyond anything Maiden, or indeed any other metal band ever did in terms of progressiveness, IMO.
As one example, the sheer variety and (relative) complexity of the music is quite staggering; everything from slow rock tempo to out and out thrash (Orion and Damage Inc. respectively) to powerful self-referential music (Battery). What Metallica did with the thrash genre on that album is mind-blowing when you consider what went before in metal; they unleashed the potentials which others have since exploited.
While Maiden's offering was admittedly way ahead of the game, Metallica's music rewrote the rules of the game and stomped on the old ones. You simply won't find anything like Master that gives it a precedent, apart from, maybe, Ride The Lightning.
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