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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 15:19
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

[QUOTE=Easy Money]Re SteveG: "... because no European trusted the Russian government as far as they could throw them."

Very true. I have never known an East European with a positive view of the Russian government, the Russian people sure, but not their aggressive government.


I disagree.  The USSR (Russia) had just freed all the Eastern European countries. All of those Eastern European Countries set free! 
The USA, Germany, France, promised Russia that in return....NATO would not advance one inch east!  
You could argue that USA, Germany, and France kept their word.  They did not advance an inch. They advanced over a thousand miles east, gobbling up all the Eastern European Countries.  Who broke their word?  Russia or NATO?  Clearly, America/ NATO.  America has funded NATO over 6.5 Trillion dollars. America runs NATO. 

Since the USSR broke up...who has bombed more countries and killed more people?  America or Russia?  America by a long shot. It's not even close. 

  


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[QUOTE] Did America level entire cities like Russia did in Syria? And what is with this false equivalency? Putin aims to level the entire country of Ukraine and kill millions if he has to. Is America worse than that? If you think so than perhaps the US is not for you.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 15:27
"Perhaps Russia is a better home for you"

Very 1950s... McCarthyism never went away. "The Grapes of Wrath" is on tonight on TCM. "Anyone who wants a nickel raise is a Red?"

The US will implode from within thanks to its people, their acquiescence, and false equivalencies, forgetting about the endless wars (all based on lies) just in the past 20 years.. I guess brown countries don't count.. Even if millions die because of fake WMDs. There's over a handful of brown countries invaded by the US/NATO

I also notice not a single complaint about THESE refugees, but the media taught their sheep well. Just learn to socially ostracize any dissent, and you're in the money. Having said that, I'm not a fan of the left-wingers who work/ed on RT and serve as apologists.. You are anti-war consistently, or just a shill.

What also has sickened me are the right-winged Democrats (well, they're all right-winged) who tell the "opposition" that they don't deserve to drive cars if they can't afford gasoline. Funny how they care so much about Ukrainian soldiers, but not American soldiers, who make up a majority of the 1-3 million homeless, but we constantly have billions and billions for other countries, only provoking the situation, adding numbers to the bloodshed to win political points.


Edited by MortSahlFan - March 22 2022 at 15:29
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 15:52
Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Because of non-stop media propaganda, 35% of Americans would be willing to brave a nuclear war to save Ukraine.  Do the 35% of Americans know Russia has 6400 nuclear weapons?  Do they have any idea of what nuclear war means?  

https://occidentaldissent.com/2022/03/17/poll-watch-35-of-americans-favor-military-intervention-in-ukraine/

PS: In the video-  FOX news's Hannity accuses the Russians of bombing a theater filled with civilians.  It's been a week since the Theater was hit in Mariupol. I have not seen any film footage of people pulling living or deceased people out of the Theater.  Camera's everywhere, but no film footage. There are people in Mariupol who claim that the Azov Battlion blew up the theater to encourage America/NATO to join the war.  Would self-proclaimed NAZI's do such a thing?  Would a Nazi battalion (responsible for over 13,000 deaths in the Donbas) blow up a theater?  If you don't think so...Tell me why the Nazi's wouldn't.

35% huh... wow that's an impressive and completely meaningless number.   Stop quoting useless, fluctuating stats and polls.   They are not scientific, not conclusive, and will changed based on the question, the moment, the population.

And again with Nazis ?   I don't think you grasp the Nazi angle in all this--  Nazis are everywhere, sometimes real ones, sometimes just a few morons on the street or online who like to wear high boots and shaved heads.   The best thing to do to Nazis is to kick them hard in the testicles and if they show up again, have some good lawyers bankrupt and harass them.   The Ukraine has fascists like we all do, sadly.   Sometimes they do bad stuff, sometimes they're blamed for doing bad stuff.   What about that don't you understand ?


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 15:53
Originally posted by MortSahlFan MortSahlFan wrote:

"Perhaps Russia is a better home for you"

Very 1950s... McCarthyism never went away. "The Grapes of Wrath" is on tonight on TCM. "Anyone who wants a nickel raise is a Red?"

The US will implode from within thanks to its people, their acquiescence, and false equivalencies, forgetting about the endless wars (all based on lies) just in the past 20 years.. I guess brown countries don't count.. Even if millions die because of fake WMDs. There's over a handful of brown countries invaded by the US/NATO

I also notice not a single complaint about THESE refugees, but the media taught their sheep well. Just learn to socially ostracize any dissent, and you're in the money. Having said that, I'm not a fan of the left-wingers who work/ed on RT and serve as apologists.. You are anti-war consistently, or just a shill.

What also has sickened me are the right-winged Democrats (well, they're all right-winged) who tell the "opposition" that they don't deserve to drive cars if they can't afford gasoline. Funny how they care so much about Ukrainian soldiers, but not American soldiers, who make up a majority of the 1-3 million homeless, but we constantly have billions and billions for other countries, only provoking the situation, adding numbers to the bloodshed to win political points.

Thread title: Reflections on the (sic) Russia's Invasion of Ukraine . 

Why talk about the Ethiopian/Eritrean/Somalian/Darfur crisis (A NATO plot) ? Or tensions between Colombia vs Venezuela (surely a NATO plot) ? Armenia vs Azerbaijan (Nato again) or my neighbour playing loud music after 11.00pm, (yup.....NATO). 
Anti-Christ= NATO, Satan= NATO Lucifer= NATO
Facebook, Google, Microsoft, Apple, Perrier, Nestle, Monsanto, GM, McDonald's, etc..... All NATO fronts. 
Israel=NATO, EU= NATO, Congo=NATO, must be the Belgian connection. 
What else.....Hunger = NATO, Poverty= NATO, Erectile problems= NATO, Cancer= NATO, stroke= NATO.
Racism=NATO (all white supremacists), Bigotry= NATO  

and our all-time favourite , FAKE NEWS= NATO 



Edited by tszirmay - March 22 2022 at 15:54
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 15:59
Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Re SteveG: "... because no European trusted the Russian government as far as they could throw them."

Very true. I have never known an East European with a positive view of the Russian government, the Russian people sure, but not their aggressive government.

I disagree.  The USSR (Russia) had just freed all the Eastern European countries. All of those Eastern European Countries set free! 
The USA, Germany, France, promised Russia that in return....NATO would not advance one inch east!  
You could argue that USA, Germany, and France kept their word.  They did not advance an inch. They advanced over a thousand miles east, gobbling up all the Eastern European Countries.  Who broke their word?  Russia or NATO?  Clearly, America/ NATO.  America has funded NATO over 6.5 Trillion dollars. America runs NATO. 

Since the USSR broke up...who has bombed more countries and killed more people?  America or Russia?  America by a long shot. It's not even close. 

  



This from my historian friend Val (whose father was KGB, BTW, so very good credentials) : READY , CINDY? 
It is strange that the children of all "great patriots" prefer to live in NATO/West countries.
- Stalin's daughter - lived and died in the USA for decades.
- Son of Khrushchev - a US citizen.
- Where are Putin's daughters? They are not visible in Russia.
- Deputy Pehtin. With son in USA.
- Minister of Transport of the Moscow region - Katsyva. With son in USA.
- Children of Deputy Zhelesnyak - lives in Switzerland.
- Children of Astakhov. One in France, the other in England.
- Children and grandchildren of the "main patriot of Russia" head of the Russian Federation Vladimir Yakunin live outside the country - in England and Switzerland.
- The daughter of the Minister of Foreign Affairs Sergei Lavrov Ekaterina lives and studies in the USA.
- Son - Vice Speaker of the State Duma A. Zhukova lived and studied in London for a long time.
- The daughter of the Vice Speaker of the State Duma Sergei Andenko studies and lives in Germany.
- The eldest son of Vice Prime Minister Dmitry Kozak - Alexey lives abroad and does construction business.
— The younger brother of Alexey Kozak, Alexander, works for Credit Suisse.
- The eldest son of Deputy Remezkov, Stepan, recently graduated from Valley Forge Military College in Pennsylvania (year of education costs 1 million 295 761 rubles. ). His youngest daughter lives in Vienna, where she practices gymnastics. Masha Remezkova represented the Austrian national team(!!! ) at children's competitions in Ljubljana.
- Daughter of Deputy V. Fetisova - Anastasia, grew up and studied in the USA. Nastya never learned to write and read in Russian.
- The daughter of Svetlana Nesterova, a deputy of the State Duma from the faction "United Russia" - lives in England.
- The main fighter for "traditional Orthodox values" E. Nikolai's son of Misulina studied in Oxford, received a diploma and moved to live on a permanent basis in tolerant Belgium, where same-sex marriages are allowed.
- Daughter of deputy Vorontsov Anna lives in Italy, she moved from Germany.
- The one-Russian Elena Rakhova, famous for being a Leningrad resident, who lived less than 120 days in the blockade, called her daughter "unfaithful" who lives in the USA.
- The daughter of the ex-speaker of the GD, one of the founders of the party "United Russia", Boris Gryzlov, Eugenia lives in Tallinn. And even recently got Estonian citizenship.
- The son of former Minister of Education Andrei Fursenko lives on a permanent basis in the USA.
- Son of V. Nikolova (grandson of Molotov), president of the Foundation "Politika" - a US citizen.


Edited by tszirmay - March 22 2022 at 16:05
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 16:13
Originally posted by tszirmay tszirmay wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Re SteveG: "... because no European trusted the Russian government as far as they could throw them."

Very true. I have never known an East European with a positive view of the Russian government, the Russian people sure, but not their aggressive government.


I disagree.  The USSR (Russia) had just freed all the Eastern European countries. All of those Eastern European Countries set free! 
The USA, Germany, France, promised Russia that in return....NATO would not advance one inch east!  
You could argue that USA, Germany, and France kept their word.  They did not advance an inch. They advanced over a thousand miles east, gobbling up all the Eastern European Countries.  Who broke their word?  Russia or NATO?  Clearly, America/ NATO.  America has funded NATO over 6.5 Trillion dollars. America runs NATO. 

Since the USSR broke up...who has bombed more countries and killed more people?  America or Russia?  America by a long shot. It's not even close. 

  






This from my historian friend Val (whose father was KGB, BTW, so very....
Brilliant.

Edited by SteveG - March 22 2022 at 16:17
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 16:21
Originally posted by MortSahlFan MortSahlFan wrote:

"Perhaps Russia is a better home for you"

Very 1950s... McCarthyism never went away. "The Grapes of Wrath" is on tonight on TCM. "Anyone who wants a nickel raise is a Red?"

The US will implode from within thanks to its people, their acquiescence, and false equivalencies, forgetting about the endless wars (all based on lies) just in the past 20 years.. I guess brown countries don't count.. Even if millions die because of fake WMDs. There's over a handful of brown countries invaded by the US/NATO

I also notice not a single complaint about THESE refugees, but the media taught their sheep well. Just learn to socially ostracize any dissent, and you're in the money. Having said that, I'm not a fan of the left-wingers who work/ed on RT and serve as apologists.. You are anti-war consistently, or just a shill.

What also has sickened me are the right-winged Democrats (well, they're all right-winged) who tell the "opposition" that they don't deserve to drive cars if they can't afford gasoline. Funny how they care so much about Ukrainian soldiers, but not American soldiers, who make up a majority of the 1-3 million homeless, but we constantly have billions and billions for other countries, only provoking the situation, adding numbers to the bloodshed to win political points.

I'm just curious. My father was a member of the Communing Party in America and was black listed for his convictions. What personal experience's do you have of that era?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 16:45
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Because of non-stop media propaganda, 35% of Americans would be willing to brave a nuclear war to save Ukraine.  Do the 35% of Americans know Russia has 6400 nuclear weapons?  Do they have any idea of what nuclear war means?  

https://occidentaldissent.com/2022/03/17/poll-watch-35-of-americans-favor-military-intervention-in-ukraine/

PS: In the video-  FOX news's Hannity accuses the Russians of bombing a theater filled with civilians.  It's been a week since the Theater was hit in Mariupol. I have not seen any film footage of people pulling living or deceased people out of the Theater.  Camera's everywhere, but no film footage. There are people in Mariupol who claim that the Azov Battlion blew up the theater to encourage America/NATO to join the war.  Would self-proclaimed NAZI's do such a thing?  Would a Nazi battalion (responsible for over 13,000 deaths in the Donbas) blow up a theater?  If you don't think so...Tell me why the Nazi's wouldn't. 


35% huh... wow that's an impressive and completely meaningless number.   Stop quoting useless, fluctuating stats and polls.   They are not scientific, not conclusive, and will changed based on the question, the moment, the population.

And again with Nazis ?   I don't think you grasp the Nazi angle in all this--  Nazis are everywhere, sometimes real ones, sometimes just a few morons on the street or online who like to wear high boots and shaved heads.   The best thing to do to Nazis is to kick them hard in the testicles and if they show up again, have some good lawyers bankrupt and harass them.   The Ukraine has fascists like we all do, sadly.   Sometimes they do bad stuff, sometimes they're blamed for doing bad stuff.   What about that don't you understand ?




I don't understand why stats and polls upset and offend you, Mr. Atavachron.  Everybody knows polls are not conclusive. Just like everybody knows 2+2=4.  It goes without saying. In 2016, all the polls predicted a Hillary Clinton Presidential victory.  If I had known polls upset you, I would have never posted a poll.  Perhaps you should warn everybody about polls? You are right, Polls are not conclusive. 

I don't understand why you see Nazis everywhere. How long have you been seeing Nazis, Mr. Atavachron? Have you kicked them hard in the testicles?  I don't know where you live, Mr. Atavachron, but I've never met a real Nazi.  My grandfather fought the Nazi's in WW II.  The Russians fought real Nazi's in WW-II. The Russian's lost 27 million lives defending the world against the Nazis.  The Nazi's in Ukraine brag about being real Nazi's. They're the real deal. They've been murdering people in Ukraine for over a decade. They've killed 13,000 Donbas Ukrainians.   





Edited by omphaloskepsis - March 22 2022 at 16:59
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 16:47
Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Re SteveG: "... because no European trusted the Russian government as far as they could throw them."

Very true. I have never known an East European with a positive view of the Russian government, the Russian people sure, but not their aggressive government.

I disagree.  The USSR (Russia) had just freed all the Eastern European countries. All of those Eastern European Countries set free! 
The USA, Germany, France, promised Russia that in return....NATO would not advance one inch east!  
You could argue that USA, Germany, and France kept their word.  They did not advance an inch. They advanced over a thousand miles east, gobbling up all the Eastern European Countries.  Who broke their word?  Russia or NATO?  Clearly, America/ NATO.  America has funded NATO over 6.5 Trillion dollars. America runs NATO. 

Since the USSR broke up...who has bombed more countries and killed more people?  America or Russia?  America by a long shot. It's not even close. 

 
FACT CHECKING : Soviet troops left Szekesfhervar in Hungary in 1991 , they had arrived to "liberate" in late 44. Similar dates for Poland and Romania. 

The USSR collapsed due to the Estonian Communist party officials , who unearthed the Molotov Ribbentrop Pact"s hitherto secret protocols that divided the areas to be mutually conquered , namely half of Poland and the Baltic States would fall under Soviet dominion. The Molo-Tropp Pact and therefore its secret protocols became null and void the day Nazi Germany attacked the USSR.  Gorbachev had no choice but to accept this argument as it was a legal premise that cannot be argued. Here is a lovely video on the matter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYD6ouVHXbo

This thread is about two countries 1- Russia 2- Ukraine . NATO , clearly to everyone except you and Lorenzo , has not budged an INCH or a millimetre if you prefer . Big smile
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 16:56
Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Because of non-stop media propaganda, 35% of Americans would be willing to brave a nuclear war to save Ukraine.  Do the 35% of Americans know Russia has 6400 nuclear weapons?  Do they have any idea of what nuclear war means?  
https://occidentaldissent.com/2022/03/17/poll-watch-35-of-americans-favor-military-intervention-in-ukraine/
PS: In the video-  FOX news's Hannity accuses the Russians of bombing a theater filled with civilians.  It's been a week since the Theater was hit in Mariupol. I have not seen any film footage of people pulling living or deceased people out of the Theater.  Camera's everywhere, but no film footage. There are people in Mariupol who claim that the Azov Battlion blew up the theater to encourage America/NATO to join the war.  Would self-proclaimed NAZI's do such a thing?  Would a Nazi battalion (responsible for over 13,000 deaths in the Donbas) blow up a theater?  If you don't think so...Tell me why the Nazi's wouldn't.

35% huh... wow that's an impressive and completely meaningless number.   Stop quoting useless, fluctuating stats and polls.   They are not scientific, not conclusive, and will changed based on the question, the moment, the population.

And again with Nazis ?   I don't think you grasp the Nazi angle in all this--  Nazis are everywhere, sometimes real ones, sometimes just a few morons on the street or online who like to wear high boots and shaved heads.   The best thing to do to Nazis is to kick them hard in the testicles and if they show up again, have some good lawyers bankrupt and harass them.   The Ukraine has fascists like we all do, sadly.   Sometimes they do bad stuff, sometimes they're blamed for doing bad stuff.   What about that don't you understand ?
I don't understand why stats and polls upset and offend you, Mr. Atavachron.  Everybody knows polls are not conclusive. Just like everybody knows 2+2=4.  It goes without saying. In 2016, all the polls predicted a Hillary Clinton Presidential victory.  If I had known polls upset you, I would have never posted a poll.  Perhaps you should warn everybody about polls? Your right...Polls are not conclusive. 

I don't understand why you see Nazis everywhere. How long have you been seeing Nazis, Mr. Atavachron? Have you kicked them hard in the testicles?  I don't know where you live, Mr. Atavachron, but I've never met a real Nazi.  My grandfather fought the Nazi's in WW II.  The Russians fought real Nazi's in WW-II. The Russian's lost 27 million lives defending the world against the Nazis.  The Nazi's in Ukraine brag about being real Nazi's. They're the real deal. They've been murdering people in Ukraine for over a decade. They've killed 13,000 Donbas Ukrainians.  

Yes, Nazis are everywhere.   Mostly they're a cowardly, superstitious lot, but make no mistake: they quietly reside in all our countries and cities, pretending to be "normal citizens", smiling and smiling and and being devils surreptitiously in the darkness.

Oh yes, they are here, corrupting communities & institutions, waiting until some psychotic let's them go public and even hold high office.  

And no I've never kicked a Nazi in the testicles but considering most of them are punk-ass little rodents who need a crowd around them to feel tough, I'd love to.   Why, do you know any ?


"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 17:07
 

I don't understand why you see Nazis everywhere. How long have you been seeing Nazis, Mr. Atavachron? Have you kicked them hard in the testicles?  I don't know where you live, Mr. Atavachron, but I've never met a real Nazi.  My grandfather fought the Nazi's in WW II.  The Russians fought real Nazi's in WW-II. The Russian's lost 27 million lives defending the world against the Nazis.  The Nazi's in Ukraine brag about being real Nazi's. They're the real deal. They've been murdering people in Ukraine for over a decade. They've killed 13,000 Donbas Ukrainians.   [/QUOTE]



Yes, Nazis are everywhere.   Mostly they're a cowardly, superstitious lot, but make no mistake: they quietly reside in all our countries and cities, pretending to be "normal citizens", smiling and smiling and and being devils surreptitiously in the darkness.

Oh yes, they are here, corrupting communities & institutions, waiting until some psychotic let's them go public and even hold high office.  

And no I've never kicked a Nazi in the testicles but considering most of them are punk-ass little rodents who need a crowd around them to feel tough, I'd love to.   Why, do you know any ?


[/QUOTE]

No, I don't know any Nazi's. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 17:32
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 17:33
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 17:34
There are lots of deralments and fake propagandas in this thread. I think we basically need to cool ourselves down and back to prog discussion.

Please let me take criticism lying down, thanks mates.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2022 at 17:34
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