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Ivan_Melgar_M 
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 Posted: October 28 2004 at 23:00 |
Certif1ed wrote:
 Ivan - I assume you know that Collins didn't play on Trespass either (your posts imply otherwise...) |
Now you're having problems with your reading?
I quote myself on October 27:
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But still I don't see Trespass as continuity of sound of FGTTR, the first Genesis album is piano based, full of simple and shorter tunes, catchy lyrics, it has Konathan King's signature, Trespass is absolutely different.
Yes Collins and Hackett are not in the band yet, but Phillips has a very similar atmospheric sound to Hackett's and Mayhew wasn't a bad drummer, not good as Collins but there are few in the level of Collins. |
No comments, I was clear in that point.
Certif1ed wrote:
| The lyrics are deeper on Trespass, but thematically, they are very similar - the same words and imagery keep cropping up - and they are obviously written by the same person |
Obviously, the Genesis lyrics are mainly written by Peter Gabriel up to The Lamb, but the theme is completely different:
Looking for Someone is about the search of life meaning (somehow in the vein of ).
White Mountain is based in a novel by Jack London (White Fang)
Visions of Angels is a complex lyric about life meaning and the pass of time.
Stagnation is a track about Thomas S. Eiselberg, a very rich man, who was wise enough to spend all his fortunes in burying himself many miles beneath the ground. As the only surviving member of the human race, he inherited the whole world.
Dusk is pure poetry again a bit in the style of Jon Anderson's lyrics.
The Knife is an ultra violent song about a messianic leader and very complex also.
This are not the lyrics from cute songs, is something deeper.
Certif1ed wrote:
| The piano-driven sound is still there, Banks being the central pillar of Genesis that he always has been, but on Trespass, it's simply lower in the mix. |
Now you're the one who didn't got the point (as I did before) FGTTR is mainly a piano based album, very melodic. In Trespass they add massive organ and, mellotron, also with some piano.
Iván
Edited by ivan_2068
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James Lee
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 05:18 |
hehe...you said "massive organ" 
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Certif1ed
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 05:46 |
ivan_2068 wrote:
Certif1ed wrote:
| Ivan - I assume you know that Collins didn't play on Trespass either (your posts imply otherwise...) |
Now you're having problems with your reading?
I quote myself on October 27:
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But still I don't see Trespass as continuity of sound of FGTTR, the first Genesis album is piano based, full of simple and shorter tunes, catchy lyrics, it has Konathan King's signature, Trespass is absolutely different.
Yes Collins and Hackett are not in the band yet, but Phillips has a very similar atmospheric sound to Hackett's and Mayhew wasn't a bad drummer, not good as Collins but there are few in the level of Collins. |
Well yes, I suppose I must be having problems with my reading - you only mention FGTR and Trespass, and you only compare Mayhew to Collins. Am I alone in drawing this conclusion fromwhat you have written? (Possibly!)
No comments, I was clear in that point.
Certif1ed wrote:
| The lyrics are deeper on Trespass, but thematically, they are very similar - the same words and imagery keep cropping up - and they are obviously written by the same person |
Obviously, the Genesis lyrics are mainly written by Peter Gabriel up to The Lamb, but the theme is completely different:
I also said "I don't mean obviously as in reading the credits on the album, I mean a simple scan of the lyrics makes certain points jump out at me."
Looking for Someone is about the search of life meaning (somehow in the vein of ). Yes, and this theme crops up all over FGTR!
White Mountain is based in a novel by Jack London (White Fang)
Visions of Angels is a complex lyric about life meaning and the pass of time. FGTR themes again.
Stagnation is a track about Thomas S. Eiselberg, a very rich man, who was wise enough to spend all his fortunes in burying himself many miles beneath the ground. As the only surviving member of the human race, he inherited the whole world.
Dusk is pure poetry again a bit in the style of Jon Anderson's lyrics.
Hmm. Not sure about "pure poetry" - it's very good, mind...
The Knife is an ultra violent song about a messianic leader and very complex also.
This are not the lyrics from cute songs, is something deeper.
I think there's more depth to many of the lyrics of FGTR than you realise, Ivan...
Certif1ed wrote:
| The piano-driven sound is still there, Banks being the central pillar of Genesis that he always has been, but on Trespass, it's simply lower in the mix. |
Now you're the one who didn't got the point (as I did before) FGTTR is mainly a piano based album, very melodic. In Trespass they add massive organ and, mellotron, also with some piano.
This could toss backwards and forwards for ever, but I'm very happy to hear the piano as a driving instrument on both albums - yes, on Trespass the role is less, but it remains (for me) a concrete link between the two albums. There are some organ moments on FGTR too - although King seems to have slapped strings all over the place.
Iván
sigod makes the very interesting point that Trespass has King Crimson influences in many places. I noticed that when I had a re-listen earlier this week. |
Edited by Certif1ed
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Reed Lover
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 06:59 |
^
Just a few observations here:
Because persons with paranoid personality disorder are hyperalert, they notice any slight and may take offense where none is intended. As a result, they tend to be defensive and antagonistic. When they are at fault, they cannot accept blame, not even mild criticism. Yet they are highly critical of others. Other people may say that these individuals make "mountains out of molehills
In addition to being argumentative and uncompromising, the people with paranoid personality disorder are often emotionally cut off from other people. They appear cold and, in fact, often avoid becoming intimate with others. They pride themselves on their rationality and objectivity. People with a paranoid outlook on life rarely come to the attention of clinicians--it is not in their nature to seek help. Many presumably function competently in society. They may seek out social niches in which a moralistic and punitive style is acceptable, or at least tolerated to a certain degree.
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Velvetclown
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:01 |
Sounds Gay to me 
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James Lee
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:02 |
^ whereas mentally healthy people avoid online forums like the plague
...still chuckling about "massive organ".
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Velvetclown
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:06 |
mentally healthy ???????????? Never been that 
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Reed Lover
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:08 |
Velvetclown wrote:
mentally healthy ???????????? Never been that |
You big,slavering maniac you!
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Velvetclown
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:09 |
Where did you find my pic, you ballet dancer you ???? 
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James Lee
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:15 |
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you should see a doctor about that thing on your nose.
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Pixel Pirate
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Joined: September 11 2004
Location: Norway
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 07:34 |
This forum has turned very silly lately hasn't it? Oh,well,when in Rome. How do goldfish go into business? They start on a small scale.
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Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
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Certif1ed
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 08:03 |
Reed Lover wrote:
^
Just a few observations here:
Because persons with paranoid personality disorder I am NOT PARANOID!!! are hyperalert, What do you mean? they notice any slight and may take offense where none is intended Hey - what are you trying to say, buddy? Who are you calling offensive? You want to make something of it?. As a result, they tend to be defensive and antagonistic Look, Buster, I am NOT antagonistic.... When they are at fault, they cannot accept blame, not even mild criticism Who said I'm at fault? It wasn't me.... Yet they are highly critical of others It must be you, then.... Other people may say that these individuals make "mountains out of molehills You can't make a mountain out of a molehill - there isn't enough earth for a start. Plus you need to take into consideration the amount of time in millenia it takes for mountains to form - the geological implcations alone make this an impossible task. Mind you, if moles grew proportionally we wouldn't need to build large, expensive and air-polluting machines to excavate tunnels any more - we could just capture some and train them to do the work for us. That would be a bit of a nightmare in the back garden though - Jasper Carrot would probably die of a heart attack! Anyway, mountains aren't made of earth, they're made of rock. With snow on top. And a nice, pointy peak.
In addition to being argumentative and uncompromising I am not argumentative or uncompromising..., the people with paranoid personality disorder are often emotionally cut off from other people. They appear cold brrr - is it me, or is it a bit nippy in here? and, in fact, often avoid becoming intimate with others. I love you...  Oh. No - I don't in fact. I just got carried away with the argument that you started... They pride themselves on their rationality and objectivity. And that's a fact. Logically, I shouldn't even be responding to this post, but there are so many flaws in your argument that I thought I would just educate you. You can thank me later in the usual way. People with a paranoid outlook on life rarely come to the attention of clinicians- Don't tell my shrink I'm here... he doesn't know I do this. Oh, I forgot - I don't have a shrink... -it is not in their nature to seek help. Hey, I don't need your help... I don't need anyone's help... Many presumably function competently in society I have at least two friends. I think. Better check on that - one moved to America 3 years ago, and I haven't spoken to the other for 4 years. But then there's that guy I met in the service station on the M25 last summer.... They may seek out social niches in which a moralistic and punitive style is acceptable, or at least tolerated to a certain degree Phew - at least on ProgArchives I'm safe....
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Reed Lover
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 08:35 |
Certif1ed wrote:
Reed Lover wrote:
But then there's that guy I met in the service station on the M25 last summer....
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I knew it- you're Alan Partridge aren't you?
Back of the net!!!!
My hero!
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Pixel Pirate
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Location: Norway
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 08:40 |
Flatley,my dear,I don't riverdance.
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Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
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ShrinkingViolet
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Location: Scotland
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Points: 433
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 11:32 |
Personally I want to say the following :
PROG AINT DEAD
PROG SHALL NOT CEASE TO EXIST
Prog will only come to an end when we give in and stop listening to it. I do not want it to be all mainstream like, I just want the young adolecents of today to be able to see what it is like as you all did or some of you anyway. They are missing out on something great , if they don't like it ..fine, but at least they ought to have a decent chance to decide if the like it or not. Provide an alternative choice.
To those pestimistic followers..get a grip..i read someone say on this thread that prog was dead and it belonged to the 70's or whatever  now that,,joke or not made me upset.what the hell was that attitude all about,its a stupid idiotic comment i think. **girlie wrath**
I am not prepared to let the music I love die at some point in the future...something has to be done to get it out to the next generation.
Oh and 'bout the Collins Pop boy, he's prob an okish drummer but thats it...he ruined Genesis!! once Gabriel left and Hackett that was it...
Love n Peace.
Shrinking Violet...Oi ! and also to throw it in, If you haven't tried MOSTLY AUTUMN i suggest you go and get some of their stuff, this is one band i'd like to see survive in the near future.
~Jen~
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 12:05 |
First to Reed: There's no antagonism between Certif1ed and me, we are only a couple of stubborn old farts that love to discuss.
Massive Organ  : I accept this one James, my English command is not perfect.
And again to Reed Lover, I'm not paranoid!!!!!!!!!!, but I have to leave because the CIA, Interpol and Mossad want to read my brain waves, everybody is following me
Iván
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Peter
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 12:59 |
 Ivan and Cert (Reed too):
Ha! FUNNY guys! Way to go!
Cert, your responses to Reed's "paranoia post" were particularly funny.
Hello, is this the right room for an argument? 
I told you once. 
No you didn't.
Yes I did, just then.
(etc., etc!)
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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richardh
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Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 15:43 |
You are all mad.
But I like it 
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Certif1ed
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 15:57 |
Reed Lover wrote:
Certif1ed wrote:
Reed Lover wrote:
But then there's that guy I met in the service station on the M25 last summer....
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I knew it- you're Alan Partridge aren't you? |
I don't know what you mean by that - although, funnily enough, it reminds me of when I met Sir Cliff Richard - or Cliff, as I normally call him. Actually, in private, I call him Cliffy Bunny Wunny Snuggleskin, but I think I'd better not tell him that to his face... look, forget I just said that, will you? I'll pay you...
Anyway, I met Sir Cliff in Woolworths just the other day... well, when I say 'met', he was already in there signing his latest book, and when I got to the front of the queue 6 hours later, I said "Sir Cliff, your royal highness, this is such an honour - I've got all your records and been to all your concerts, oh, this is fantastic..." I don't remember him actually saying anything back to me, but he did smile very nicely at me just before I passed out...
Er... did I ever tell you I once met Burt Bacharach?
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Reed Lover
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Posted: October 29 2004 at 18:14 |
No-thank God!
Are you actually telling me you dont know who Alan Partridge is?
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