Is Punk all that bad?

Moogtron III wrote: Dick Heath wrote: spo1977 wrote: The Damned is great punk. Check out Machine Gun Ettiquette, Black Album, Strawberries, Phantasmagoria. Is it prog? no, but who cares? Captain Sensible is on record as a devoted Soft Machine fan And he makes some great music himself. Like his 1989 album Revolution Now! with even a 15 minute - epic! One of the many cross-fertilizations between prog and punk.

What about on the Damned Black Album they did a 17 minute epic called curtain call but honestly i didnt really enjoy maybe if i gave it more time but i think machine gun ettiquette is one of the best albums of all time and definetly the best early british punk album imo that album has more psyhc influences like early Soft Machine,Love,The Doors amd other boys i love that album you gys should check it out if you havent already

Hey guys, Punk was created as a reaction against Prog', all their official sites  bash Prog', they are against anything lñonger han three minutes or three chords.

I never saw a prog', blues, jazz or pop site wasting their space in writting against the other genres. Yes in forums there's a lot of that, but never in an official site.

When Dinosaurs Roamed The Earth... Know thine enemy. While Glam at least was proving some light relief from bands who had grown massive like the Stones, Who and Led Zeppelin there were an even more pretentious wave of bands who espoused the view that rock was serious and who were dominating the serious weekly music papers. Prog-Rock was  mostly listened to by grubby polytechnic students who wore flares and dufflecoats and never had any girlfriends and who would sit cross-legged at gigs on the floor bonged out of their brains. They would gather in bedsits drinking coffee out of chipped mugs and ponder the meaning of the universe while listening to Yes, Van Der Graaf Generator, Camel, Gentle Giant, Caravan, Greenslade and a thousand others. These people knew what they wanted ..lots of windswept guitar histrionics, gushing key boards, lyrics full of mystical allusions and song titles bearing no relation to the music and almost as long as the music itself ! As you read these you can see why punk had to happen. Weighed own by the weight of its own pretensions the scene was set for someone to point out that the emperor in fact had no clothes on. Read on and learn the horrible truth..........

Hey Richard Hell And Devo were great in there day maybe if u would actually listen to some of this music before judging it you would no i think the average prog fan could enjoy Richard Hells Blank Generation theres some great guitar playing going on there the same goes for Devo they were higly influenced by Captain Beefheart,Zappa,Krafwerk and others i wouldnt really call them punk though and for there fashion sence who cares there clothes were kind of funny and werent spousto be taken seriously well actually i think there was some sort of social commentary going on there with there concept of de evolution but im not getting into that Rick Wakeman wore stupid clothes too but u probbably love him (im not dissing wakeman)

You don't get me Hemispheres, I can't care less how they dress or how stupid they are, I don't even care about Punk to be honest, I'm just saying that in their OFFICIAL web page they say how ridiculous costumes used Gabriel and Wakeman, How vulgar was ELP (????) and that all progheads are dirty hippies who use drugs all day.

But if I worship a stupid (literaly stupid sub normal) talentless drugadict as Sid, or others who  use stupid costumes as Devo, or a poser like Richard Hell,  I wouldn't open my mouth to criticize other genres.

I love Genesis early concerts, so I would be at least stupid to criticize artists fom other genres who have theatrical shows, that's why I never say a word about Punk, as I said don't even care about hem until they mess with us.

In our forum people (including me) joke and even talk crap about SOME artists of other genres (Or even of our own genre as Phil Collins), but you'll never see in the Prog Archives home an article against other genre, go to GEPR, they don't even mention Punk, go to Progressor, the same thing, check any site from the Progressive Rock Webring and you'll see that Punk is simply ignored, so why can't this guys leave us alone?

Why in hell do they need to print 4 pages insulting Progressive Rock, when we don't even mention them?

If you remember I was the first one who criticized our members who irrupted in a Punk forum to talk crap about them, but honestly this guys provoke us.

Iván

walrus333 wrote: Um we do talk about punk some this thread for example

Yep Walrus, but I was referring top official web sites, this is a forum, we can't control (and I wish we will never) what people write (Not even about Prog), we find ELP bashers, Genesis haters, etc.

So it's normal to talk about Punk, Pop or Rap in a forum, but no Progressive OFFICIAL WEB SITE (Like Prog Archives home page) takes position criticizing any genre.

I don't ask Punk web sites to praise prog (wouldn't care if they did), I onluy ask them to ignore as as our OFFICIAL WEB SITES do.

Cheers

Iván

Hemispheres wrote:

as much as that article was just plain stupid there had to be something about prog and we actually do have something about punk on the official website the history of prog mentions it but not in a negative way really

100% Agree with you, any serious web site that talks about Prog' history has to talk about punk, mentioning that it started as a reaction against the so elaborated and complex Prog, and probably decribe which are the main characteristics of early Punk in comparison with Prog, but without falling in cheap insults.

It's part of ourhistory and we can't hide it.

But it woould be wrong to write 4 pages about the worst Punk bands describing all their addictions and their idiocy (Because they have their own share of it), How Sid was member of a band without being able to play a single note and how those posers called The Sex Pistols kept him because it was good for their image. .

Just a centered unpassionate description. But this guys make 4 pages (Out of 9) justto insult Prog', Genesis, Yes, ELP, JethroTull, The Who (For the Rock Opera and Conceptual albums) and of course Rick Wakeman and King Crimson, that's plain stupid, and my post was to prove that fact only.

Cheers

Iván

BTW: I used to like some Devo when a kid because there was no way I coud watch Prog' during those years in Perú execpt in one TV program called Disco Club (Disco as a translation of Record to Spanish, not about the dance genre) this program used to play a lot of Classic Rock, a little of  Prog (Maybe one song each 4 programs, I even saw the whole Yessongs for the first time in a 1 hour special, because the normal program lasted 30 minutes), some STYX, Klaatu, etc, but mostly  New Wave and Punk,

So I got used to Devo, Richard Hell, The Police, Blondie (More crappy Pop than Punk to be honest, (Even though this site claims she's a punkette) until I got tired of them (And new programs arrrived with some Prog on them).

Rashikal wrote: how the heck was animals punk!?

Musically: Hell no.

Lyrically: Though sophisticated, it is full of spite and hatred.

Dick Heath wrote: Personally, have actively followed prog from the very start and heard the music get very jaded/pretentious towards the end of the first 8 to 10 years and wish to f**k that the likes of Jon Anderson would start to write about some semblance of reality (enough for me to be really pissed off with Yes albums from Topographic rubbish), punk was most welcome. The writing not! Hurray from the Strangers, Souxsie & The Banshees, the Sex Pistols, the Police, XTC, Squeeze etc.

Very good band.

Wow....that's a little broad. Punk...that covers alot. I don't like most punk. Especailly pop-punk (IMO one of the worst genres out there) like Good Charlotte, Simple Plan, Blink 182, My Chemical Romance....... Hardcore Punk, Skater Punk, and some regular is cool with me.

I don't like "old school punk" vocals that make me want to beat my head in, and running around basically saying I am  anti-everything.

That's what else gets me, the idea of punk (as with almost all genres) is used up. Punk fashion is becoming acceptable and mainstream  isn't that  against the idea of punk? Eh wehatever, bascailly  punk.......not that good.

Dick Heath wrote: ivan_2068 wrote: Iván songs about not being able to find work, being brought up in slums, their conditions - not dimwitted fairy stories, or about spiritualism that only wealth and leisure time seemed to permit. As the Clash said, what relevance were lyrics of Yes, when you were impoverished and you want to speak out about your conditions? Prog was predominately middle class, psychedelia was middle class, (when reggae was working class). Check your history: Jon Savage's England's Dreaming is a good start point for the music and sociology of punk.

its the main reason i much prefer jethro tull and pink floyd over other prog bands like yes. ian anderson and rodger waters are two of the greatest songwriters in rock music.ever. songs that are deep but have a definite message- my god, thick as a brick, time, dogs, sheep etc.