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Kotro 
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 16 2004
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 2815
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 Topic: ProgArchives.com - what's in a name...
Posted: June 23 2008 at 05:21 |
... Long Live ArtRockArchives.com!
Far from me to call any shots regarding this matter, but this last inclusion of Bowie once more reminded me of how misleading and in need of update the name of our site is. This is not suggestion that the name be changed, though - personally I would never get used to it, plus I don't want to invoque the wrath of our members. Its just meant to open up a discussion on the merits or demerits of having a website named after a musical genre that then links to severall artists of different musical genres, some quite far from the classic definition of progressive rock. Surely I am not the only one finding this bit misleading... 
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Bigger on the inside.
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GentleGiant
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 09 2006
Location: PantagrueLand
Status: Offline
Points: 445
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 05:35 |
Maybe a new name : ProgRelatedArchives.com (the old progarchives is dead from 1-2 years) only in the few minds still exist. 
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BeGiantForADay
"This British band is just the cup of tea for aficionados who demand virtuosity,progress and originality in their mix."
http://rateyourmusic.com/~GentleG
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21483
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 05:35 |
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the name is only misleading if you disregard the genre labels ...
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:25 |
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hahahhah... oh goodie
PA's might be dead... but it and it's posters didn't fail us this time.
munch munch munch...
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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russellk
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 28 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 782
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:28 |
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Sigh. David Bowie has been added in PROG-RELATED. That means he is related to prog, and not primarily prog himself. Related, right? Related. I am related to my uncle, but I am not my father. I am only related. I share some of the same heritage.
The bottom line: the addition of an artist you don't approve of does not diminish the artists you consider prog.
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Raff
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 29 2005
Location: None
Status: Offline
Points: 24429
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:29 |
I just wonder about one thing.. Which part of RELATED is so difficult to understand?
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Drew
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 20 2005
Location: California
Status: Offline
Points: 12600
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:31 |
Start another site and we'll compare 
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Raff
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 29 2005
Location: None
Status: Offline
Points: 24429
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:31 |
 GentleGiant wrote:
Maybe a new name : ProgRelatedArchives.com (the old progarchives is dead from 1-2 years) only in the few minds still exist. |
Sorry for the double post, but now I've really had it... If you are so disappointed, why do you keep posting here? Last time I looked, posting on this site hadn't been made mandatory  ...
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:31 |
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now if it is an issue of whether we should be having PR additions here.... take that up with M@X.. I'm sure he'd give a sh*t what you all have to say
as far as PR addtions go.... Bowie was a no brainer... if you have any knowledge of him or his music.. you'd know that to be true.
Edited by micky - June 23 2008 at 06:31
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11420
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:34 |
Kotro wrote:
... Long Live ArtRockArchives.com!
Far from me to call any shots regarding this matter, but this last inclusion of Bowie once more reminded me of how misleading and in need of update the name of our site is. This is not suggestion that the name be changed, though - personally I would never get used to it, plus I don't want to invoque the wrath of our members. Its just meant to open up a discussion on the merits or demerits of having a website named after a musical genre that then links to severall artists of different musical genres, some quite far from the classic definition of progressive rock. Surely I am not the only one finding this bit misleading... |
I do have to agree with the broad slant of this post and as much as I love (some) of Bowie's work and would concede that say, 'Scary Monsters' - 'Outside' and at a pinch, - 'Low' could be considered 'proggy' his inclusion must be the ultimate 'Apres moi le deluge'  Contrary to what they themselves might think, I do have a lot of sympathy and admiration for the admin team who have the arduous task of attempting to keep 'PA' within some sort of manageable parameters. As you would expect this must be a very difficult undertaking, but with the plethora of metal related bands plus the latest inclusions of Roy Harper (prog dope !?) and now the thin white Duke it's like my old gran used to say: You can't put the poo back in the puppy......  Suggested new name for the site: Everything bar the kitchen sink (pending approval) Archives
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Raff
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 29 2005
Location: None
Status: Offline
Points: 24429
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:36 |
micky wrote:
now if it is an issue of whether we should be having PR additions here.... take that up with M@X.. I'm sure he'd give a sh*t what you all have to say
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Exactly. I've been telling people for a long time to address a petition to our owners in order to remove PP and PR, if they are so offensive to them. Of course, it's much easier to complain than to take action... However, I won't stand and see people insulted as I was on several occasions in the past because no one has the guts to address the question directly. You disagree with those categories? Do something, instead of picking on people who add bands or artists LEGITIMATELY.
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russellk
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 28 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 782
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:36 |
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So, Mr Lemming, you consider three of his albums 'proggy', yet don't think Bowie is prog-related?
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:39 |
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forgetting of course.... just what IS prog... for that ... he could have.. in fact WAS going to be added in a fully prog sub.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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russellk
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 28 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 782
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:40 |
micky wrote:
forgetting of course.... just what IS prog... for that ... he could have.. in fact WAS going to be added in a fully prog sub.
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And that wouldn't have been a problem. This site is avowedly comprehensive, which means it is inclusive.
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:44 |
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he addition was handled by a score of collabs and in the end... we felt the Bowie was so eclectic and so progressive that he didn't fit any of the subs... and with an artist of his stature.. that was a must.. so he went into PR where he had been accepted by the management. He was accepted by the management.. and many of the site's collabs... instead of bitching people.. .maybe it might do well to explore his music.. and find out why so many were completely in favor of his addition.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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russellk
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 28 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 782
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:47 |
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I count at least three albums from his first period, much of his second period and two or three albums from his latter days that ought to be of real interest to prog fans. Added to this, his music was instrumental in shaping much experimental and prog rock. Great to see him here, thanks to the collabs.
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:50 |
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^ exactly... this was not some fanboy fav addtion flimsily done up on the case of an album or two... but over many years of work.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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fuxi
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 2461
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:55 |
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I must admit Admin are doing an excellent job. Remember the storm of protest when Black Sabbath were accepted? I certainly felt like protesting myself! Anyway, suitable reasons why BS ought to be on ProgArchives were duly provided, and does this mean our site is now being swamped by gonzoid Hard Rock? Of course not! Symphonic Prog, Space Rock, Italian Prog etc. still rule the roost – as well as, admittedly, Prog Metal. I really see no need to complain about a drop in standards.
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ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11420
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 07:06 |
russellk wrote:
So, Mr Lemming, you consider three of his albums 'proggy', yet don't think Bowie is prog-related?
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I think that 'prog related' is in danger of being used as a 'catch-all' genre with which to appease the lobbyists from those quarters of the traditional rock community who wish to see their favorite artists included in 'PA' Yes, you are right I do think that some of Bowie's work is 'proggy' but might it perhaps not be better to appraise this 'prog related' genre on an album by album basis ? e.g. as much as the Beatles catalogue from say 67-70 is important to prog, what some people on PA object to is having to wade through reviews of the fab four's merseybeat 3 minute pop song albums from an earlier period. (They ain't remotely relevant) I am sure there are loads of other examples of bands and artists who 'dabbled' in prog territory for a short period (e.g. Beach Boys, Zombies, Easybeats etc) and this work should of course be included on PA but only if the album(s) in question are deemed admissible by the admin team. How hard is that ?
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 07:39 |
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For me it's really just a simple matter of enjoying the stuff you like, ignoring the stuff you don't, trying things you don't know anything about that intrigue you.
Granted, the flood of reviews that will be pouring out the next few days will be rather hard to ignore. You'll find plenty around here who find enough of his output prog enough for his inclusion.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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ProgArchives.com - what's in a name...
