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Last great Canterbury related album?

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Rick1 View Drop Down
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    Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:16
I read somewhere that National Health's 'Of Queues and Cures' was the last, great Canterbury album of the 1970s.  I want to put that one to the test with the learned membership of Prog Archives.  

Edited by Rick1 - July 22 2020 at 01:52
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:21
I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rick1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:25
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.

I continue to be a fan of the scene up until the present day (my last pre-lockdown gig was the excellent Soft Machine).  I have seen many of these musicians post-1970s but their recorded output tends to be patchy and sporadic - much as I love them and I keep returning to their 70s prime.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:36
Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.

I continue to be a fan of the scene up until the present day (my last pre-lockdown gig was the excellent Soft Machine).  I have seen many of these musicians post-1970s but their recorded output tends to be patchy and sporadic - much as I love them and I keep returning to their 70s prime.


Well, the output may be patchy and sporadic (with many), but that doesn't mean that there haven't been great Canterbury Scene and CS related albums throughout the decades. For a big name in the Canterbury Scene, I've loved a lot of Robert Wyatt's albums throughout the years. By the way expect some of your choices to be picked on as to whether they are Canterbury scene related enough to warrant representation.

Edited by Logan - July 22 2020 at 01:41
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rick1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:41
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.

I continue to be a fan of the scene up until the present day (my last pre-lockdown gig was the excellent Soft Machine).  I have seen many of these musicians post-1970s but their recorded output tends to be patchy and sporadic - much as I love them and I keep returning to their 70s prime.


Well, the output may be patchy and sporadic (with many), but that doesn't mean that there haven't been great Canterbury Scene and CS related albums throughout the decades. For a big name in the Canterbury Scene, I've loved a lot of Robert Wyatt's albums throughout the years.

I am a Wyatt fan too (along with Ratledge, one of the key members of the scene I have not seen live) but I also tried to give the poll some integration with the late 70s timeframe.  Maybe I should create an alternative poll to capture post 70s output...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:51
Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.

I continue to be a fan of the scene up until the present day (my last pre-lockdown gig was the excellent Soft Machine).  I have seen many of these musicians post-1970s but their recorded output tends to be patchy and sporadic - much as I love them and I keep returning to their 70s prime.


Well, the output may be patchy and sporadic (with many), but that doesn't mean that there haven't been great Canterbury Scene and CS related albums throughout the decades. For a big name in the Canterbury Scene, I've loved a lot of Robert Wyatt's albums throughout the years.


I am a Wyatt fan too (along with Ratledge, one of the key members of the scene I have not seen live) but I also tried to give the poll some integration with the late 70s timeframe.  Maybe I should create an alternative poll to capture post 70s output...


Or edit your initial post to make your intent clear since neither the title nor your opening post seem to indicate this late 70s timeframe. When you say "Last great Canterbury related album?" that indicates the latest possible album that could be considered great. I would totally disagree with what you read somewhere -- the "I read somewhere that National Health's 'Of Queues and Cures' was the last, great Canterbury album". I'd be interested to know the source if you can recall, and if it's someone whose opinion should matter to me or is a respected authority. I read lots of things that I feel have low merit, and claims that are not backed up well with strong research or good arguments.



Edited by Logan - July 22 2020 at 01:52
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rick1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:56
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.

I continue to be a fan of the scene up until the present day (my last pre-lockdown gig was the excellent Soft Machine).  I have seen many of these musicians post-1970s but their recorded output tends to be patchy and sporadic - much as I love them and I keep returning to their 70s prime.


Well, the output may be patchy and sporadic (with many), but that doesn't mean that there haven't been great Canterbury Scene and CS related albums throughout the decades. For a big name in the Canterbury Scene, I've loved a lot of Robert Wyatt's albums throughout the years.


I am a Wyatt fan too (along with Ratledge, one of the key members of the scene I have not seen live) but I also tried to give the poll some integration with the late 70s timeframe.  Maybe I should create an alternative poll to capture post 70s output...


Or edit your initial post to make your intent clear since neither the title nor your opening post seem to indicate this late 70s timeframe. When you say "Last great Canterbury related album?" that indicates the latest possible album that could be considered great. I would totally disagree with what you read somewhere -- the "I read somewhere that National Health's 'Of Queues and Cures' was the last, great Canterbury album". I'd be interested to know the source if you can recall, and if it's someone whose opinion should matter to me or is a respected authority. I read lots of things that I feel have low merit, and claims that are not backed up well with strong research or good arguments.


Edit made.  The quote came from either the Bill Martin or the Paul Stump books.  Both scholarly and authoritative (and published in the 90s).  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Man With Hat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 01:57
HC
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:01
Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I would have to disagree with the premise, I think that were many great Canterbury Scene related albums that came later than all of these, and I think that the Canterbury Sound is still going strong.

I continue to be a fan of the scene up until the present day (my last pre-lockdown gig was the excellent Soft Machine).  I have seen many of these musicians post-1970s but their recorded output tends to be patchy and sporadic - much as I love them and I keep returning to their 70s prime.


Well, the output may be patchy and sporadic (with many), but that doesn't mean that there haven't been great Canterbury Scene and CS related albums throughout the decades. For a big name in the Canterbury Scene, I've loved a lot of Robert Wyatt's albums throughout the years.


I am a Wyatt fan too (along with Ratledge, one of the key members of the scene I have not seen live) but I also tried to give the poll some integration with the late 70s timeframe.  Maybe I should create an alternative poll to capture post 70s output...


Or edit your initial post to make your intent clear since neither the title nor your opening post seem to indicate this late 70s timeframe. When you say "Last great Canterbury related album?" that indicates the latest possible album that could be considered great. I would totally disagree with what you read somewhere -- the "I read somewhere that National Health's 'Of Queues and Cures' was the last, great Canterbury album". I'd be interested to know the source if you can recall, and if it's someone whose opinion should matter to me or is a respected authority. I read lots of things that I feel have low merit, and claims that are not backed up well with strong research or good arguments.



Edit made.  The quote came from either the Bill Martin or the Paul Stump books.  Both scholarly and authoritative (and published in the 90s).  


Maybe those books have needed updating too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:06
I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Rick1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:13
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm

That first album is often considered related due to Bruford and Holdsworth...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:16
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm


I guess that's what he means by related. I find the UK, the Camel (despite having Richard Sinclair on the album), the Henry Cow (I consider early Henry Cow to be Canterbury Sound related at least) additions to be unusual choices -- especially when choosing to make such a short list.

Edited by Logan - July 22 2020 at 02:17
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:18
Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm

That first album is often considered related due to Bruford and Holdsworth...
Okay, thanks for the info. Thumbs Up 
 
I was tempted to vote for Camel's "Breathless", because that's the only album I've actually listened to in the poll, but maybe I'll give U.K's debut album a listen first before I cast my vote. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:20
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm


I guess that's what he means by related. I find the UK, the Camel (despite having Richard Sinclair on the album), the Henry Cow (I consider early Henry Cow to be Canterbury Sound related at least) additions to be unusual choices -- especially when choosing to make such a short list.
 
I've always considered Camel to be a Guildford Scene band. Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:21
^ That makes a lot more sense.

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm


That first album is often considered related due to Bruford and Holdsworth...

Okay, thanks for the info. Thumbs Up 
 
I was tempted to vote for Camel's "Breathless", because that's the only album I've actually listened to in the poll, but maybe I'll give U.K's debut album a listen first before I cast my vote. Smile


Or listen to the ones generally considered to be Canterbury Scene even if you don't generally like Canterbury Scene/ Sound music. Just a thought.

Edited by Logan - July 22 2020 at 02:22
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Trane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:25
I can see Rick1's point of ending the poll at the close of the 70's.


Originally posted by Man With Hat Man With Hat wrote:

HC


If Leg End clearly sounds  Canterburyesque, WC certainly doesn't at all. It's a near-pure RIO (ala UZ & AZ) album, IMHO.

Not sure Camel should've been included either (UK, I can see why)

=====================

As for my choice, I hesitate between Heap and Queues.

(It might've been useful to state the date of release, though)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:29
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

^ That makes a lot more sense.

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


I didn't know the band U.K were part of the Canterbury Scene. Ermm


That first album is often considered related due to Bruford and Holdsworth...

Okay, thanks for the info. Thumbs Up 
 
I was tempted to vote for Camel's "Breathless", because that's the only album I've actually listened to in the poll, but maybe I'll give U.K's debut album a listen first before I cast my vote. Smile


Or listen to the ones generally considered to be Canterbury Scene even if you don't generally like Canterbury Scene/ Sound music. Just a thought.
 
I have a strong feeling that I'll like National Health's second album when I eventually get around to listening to it, because I reviewed their debut album recently and gave it four stars. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:33
I wouldn;t have minded, it was just that the 70s timeframe was never mentioned. I still don't think that last great Canterbury Scene or Canterbury Scene related album came out in the late 70s, and I would question certain additions.

I'm actually confused now with the edits, did the book claim that "National Health's 'Of Queues and Cures' was the last, great Canterbury album" as originally stated or that it was "the last, great Canterbury album of the 1970s."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rick1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:40
Lol!  I have opened a hornet's nest with this one...I expected nothing else from the good folk of Prog Archives.  I tend to use Calyx - Aymeric Leroy's excellent Canterbury website - as a reference point for what is considered Canterbury related so my choices are conditioned by that.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2020 at 02:54
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

The first step on the road to wisdom is the recognition of one's own ignorance.
 
I think I'm recognising my own ignorance when it comes to Canterbury Scene music, so maybe that makes me wiser. Wink
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