So why do so many of you hate ELP?

Simple - I don't like their music. 

One of the biggest problems I have is this "Virtuosic keyboards" thing - Keith may play as if he's a virtuoso, but I've heard real virtuosi - and Keith is not one. He's about Grade 6-7 - and I state that as someone who has done all the keyboard grade exams and the teaching diploma, then studied music with piano as my main instrument, but also played church and concert hall organs - so I'm familiar with technique.

It's kinda like the whole Satriani/Malmsteen thing - yes, they play fast and loud, but it's pure technique.

The biggest difference between Emerson and the latter is that Emerson at least puts passion into his playing, and is full of original thought and approaches to composition.

The second biggest difference is in the precision in execution. I wish Emerson would take off the boxing gloves every now and then!

Emerson improvises, but it's not good improvisation, and he tends to re-use material far more often than not (and I suspect that much of this is not conscious), bringing a predictable, cloying feel to just about everything, as well as a very amateurish style - which is a pity. With real hard work on the dots instead of the flash, he could have written more great stuff - because there are great moments in between the layers of murk coming out of those boxing gloves.

Keith is NOT the virtuoso that ELP fans would have us believe - it's nearly ALL mouth and no trousers. And I'm not inviting comments from TF here, really I'm not...  That intro on the Royal Festival Hall organ is just despicable - total bluster and no structure, all party-piece and no real music. It's as bad as rap, from that point of view.

When Greg and Carl get it together in a bass/drum groove, there is something seriously good going on - but invariably it ends up in a messy heap with Emerson on top.

I find it hard to ciriticise Palmer, not because I'm not a drummer, but because I feel some pity that he has to work with such a cacophony, and admiration that he still manages to pull off some great grooves and licks despite it!

Finally (for now...), Greg's singing.

Oh dear.

The voice is not my cuppa tea because it's just too "precious". He can put a good edge to it - "ITCOTCK" and other places, but generally, Yuck!

And he sings flat - particularly in that gruesome rendition of "Jerusalem", which ELP fans seem to love - but I hate with a very similar passion. I much prefer the version by Mark Stewart and the Maffia (try tracking that one down ).

Just my opinion

I doubt 3f8s will be able to answer the question that this thread poses

And I'm not expecting to read anything defending ELP in this thread either - there are DOZENS of threads that praise ELP to the skies which I'm sure everyone must have encountered... you an hardly miss them

I think this thread redresses the balance nicely.

Have to go to work.Working until 8 o'clock this evening.Perhaps this will allow me to speak to William Gilmour ex Enid and Dusk and Robert McGregor both superb pianists/keyboards players in their own right and both classically qualified via the Glasgow Academy of Music about this highly technical point from Certified; for once, you have my interest with your comments.

I dont hate ELP, I can take or leave them.

I've only recently started to listen to them again, after giving up on them years ago. I'm playing Tarkus to death at the moment, its a very good prog rock album.

My problem with ELP is their potential vs their actual output. Certif1ed makes the point that Keith Emerson is not the virtuoso that ELP fanatics make out. Maybe so, but he clearly does have the skill to write and perform good music if he wants. He seems to choose bombastic classical rip offs over good original progressive material. I have a problem with rock bands re-arranging classical music. In reality it is never going to sound as good as an orchestral arrangement. Its always going to sound like a rock band trying to show off and prove that they can play classical music for the sake of it. The first ELP I ever heard was 'Pictures at an exhibition' I thought it just sounded weak and silly. I couldn't work out why they had gone to the bother. Why didn't they just...well..do something else? Something of their own? I remember playing it my friends father, an ex concert pianist, and he just shrugged and said 'God, thats crap. Why did they bother? Are they just showing off?'

Lets face it what would you rather listen too? Holsts 'Mars the bringer of war' performed by full orchestra, or performed by Emerson, Lake and Cozy Powell??? With tea chest tribal drumming, snyths and Hammond organs..? I rest my case..

My opinions are based on what I have heard by ELP which I admit is not everything they've done.

Pixel Pirate wrote: I love snyths!

Me too

But not playing Holst. Thats just taking the p!ss. Whats the point in recording an arrangement like that? You could record a version of Stairway to Heaven on Penny Whistle if you liked, but there wouldn't be any point, because it will always be an inferior way to present the song, under any circumstances.

Fragile wrote: Have to go to work.Working until 8 o'clock this evening.Perhaps this will allow me to speak to William Gilmour ex Enid and Dusk and Robert McGregor both superb pianists/keyboards players in their own right and both classically qualified via the Glasgow Academy of Music about this highly technical point from Certified; for once, you have my interest with your comments.

I guess the Glasgow Academy outranks Nene College/University, but one man's opinion is still one man's opinion.

I'm glad to have your interest for once

I loved hearing Cozy Powell doing his drum solo to the 1812 Overture, when I was 13, but when I last heard it it sounded like something Spinal Tap may have rejected for being ridiculous.

Infact, when I think of Keith Emerson I'm reminded of another rock musician with classical ambitions/delusions..

'I'm a big fan of Mozart and Bach, and this piece is somewhere in the middle, a kind of Mach piece'

'This is called 'Lick my love pump''

Pixel Pirate wrote: I love snyths!

The band with Norrysey in???