Fourth of July

NetsNJFan wrote: MikeEnRegalia wrote: NetsNJFan wrote: hey!  who supplied youre military machine?  who built your planes?  America. and I acknowledge that Russia pretty much did most of the work.  but Europe really forgets how much America did for them, during the war, in terms of aid and eventual war, and plus we rebuilt Europe after the war. Churchill was more concerned about keeping his empire than beatign Germany and you know it! Let me straighten that out: The Europeans rebuilt Europe after the war. The U.S. invested in Germany big time and made a fortune out of our hard work. fine pretend the Marshall Plan didn't mean anything.

I didn't say that. But look here:

http://usinfo.state.gov/usa/infousa/facts/democrac/57.htm

The U.S. made good profit out of it as well. And why shouldn't they, I never said that was a bad thing.

Yes, England and France had more resources to help themselves rebuild after the war.  However, the U.S. did solely help rebuild Germany, although that was the primary focus of the Marshall Plan.  The Plan also included spending huge amounts of money and effort helping to rebuild thouse parts of France and En gland (and other countries) that were most heavily affected by the war.  That is historical fact.  Anything else is dangerous revisionism.

Peace.

NetsNJFan wrote: gdub411 wrote: Snow Dog wrote: gdub411 wrote: Snow Dog wrote: gdub411 wrote: Tony R wrote: NetsNJFan wrote: emdiar wrote: Could someone please name one freedom that Americans have, that is denied us Brits. We can even smoke Cuban cigars with impunity. oh, now the British are all for freedom and liberty after their oppressive empire falls apart let's not forget England would be a German Territory if America hadn't kept you in the war, so enjoy your freedoms. Bollocks. Germany and France might have been Russian Territory,maybe.... I find it amusing how you Euro's downplay the United States role in the war. I find it amusing that Americans not only downplay the Soviet Unions and Britains role in the war, but also believe that they aloone won it! Hilarious! I am far too much of a history buff and I know better. Both the British and Russians were ass kickers. I have always admired Great Britain's feats in WWII. Not ALL Americans feel that way. Although, I may tell you that to rile you up at some future time. PS...what the Germans did was absolutely incredible on a military standpoint alone. No doubt, the German Army were Tops! If it hadn't been for the RAF Britain would have been virtually defenceless and America would have been too late for us! Yes the RAF was very key in the Battle of Britain. To actually conquer you guys, though, I think Germany would have had to land its forces on that island of yours and that would have proven most difficult with that enormous navy of yours. I wonder how the Germans would have fared if they would have concentrated on bombing military installations instead of civilian targets.... In 1939-1940 the US army was a joke. While it was discusting that we didn't lend a hand until we were virtually forced to, I doubt we would have been much help militarily until 1942 anyhoo.   hey!  who supplied youre military machine?  who built your planes?  America. and I acknowledge that Russia pretty much did most of the work.  but Europe really forgets how much America did for them, during the war, in terms of aid and eventual war, and plus we rebuilt Europe after the war. Churchill was more concerned about keeping his empire than beatign Germany and you know it!

I think what we in the UK often overlook, is that if it hadn't have been for the support of the US troops in WWI, things could have looked quite different.  After the Russians finally capitulated in the Winter of 1917/18, all of the German/ Hapsburg troops from the Eastern front had moved over to the Salient, and their spring 1918 offensive was bleeding the French and Commonwealth countries white.

OK, so the US troops were very inexperienced and niave when it came to trench warfare, but its quite possible that if it hadn't have been for their sacrifice, the Kaiser could have marched on to Paris in May 1918, and there would have been no need for Hitler!

History lesson over!!!

Trouserpress wrote: danbo wrote: The Doctor wrote: goose wrote: Britain is the best country in the world. Anyone who says otherwise is foreign or wrong. Fact.  Hey they at least have the best television programming in the world. Too bad about the dental plan, though.  How about some curry, eh? What on earth do you guys have against our teeth?! I've come across this one before - aren't horrible teeth referred to as "British Teeth" in America? Tres tres bizarre...

I'm not really sure why people in the US make fun of "British Teeth."  I've seen some bad British teeth before, but then I've seen many people in this country who have never had floss inside their mouth their entire lives.

one word....

FLUORIDE! (or the lack thereof)

Royal Consort Camarillo Porker-Bowels visits the dentist:

Smile for the nice cameras, m'lady! Another boiled sweet?

emdiar wrote: To all you sadly deluded Yanks who think you single handedly won WW2, one word....... VIETNAM!

hey the YANKS did a hell of a lot more to win the war than Holland which basically bent over for Hitler.

fandango wrote: NetsNJFan wrote: emdiar wrote: To all you sadly deluded Yanks who think you single handedly won WW2, one word....... VIETNAM! hey the YANKS did a hell of a lot more to win the war than Holland which basically bent over for Hitler. Hey come on.. what the heck did you expect The Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark or even Norway to actually do?  1) Today, the joint population of those countries is 35 million; Germany's would have been over 100 million. 2) They hadn't planned on warfare, whereas Germany had been starting to stockpile since 1933. 3) None of them had an 'Industrial Heartland' to speak of, or any real Natural defenses. Despite this, the Belgian people still slowed the German progress through flooding their land, and many lost their lives in the resistance. You can hardly compare Benelux with the USA, can you?

no of course not - i just don't understand all this animosity towards the USA.  ok so some of the things we today are a bit misguided.  to throw vietnam in our face aftre our troops and the english liberated your country for you is disgusting.

Peter wrote: NetsNJFan wrote: to throw vietnam in our face aftre our troops and the english liberated your country for you is disgusting. I don't want any part of this lamentable dispute, but for the record (and not to downplay the US's huge, crucial part in WW2) Holland was liberated by Canadian troops, not American or British, and the Dutch people remain very grateful to our nation to this day. Our many war dead who rest in European soil, and our significant sacrifices and victories in two World Wars, too often seem to be forgotten by our more-powerful allies... shame!

Yup...those 3 canadian mounties sent that one german a runnin...before you get all worked up Peter...just kiddin around.

gdub411 wrote: Yup...those 3 canadian mounties sent that one german a runnin...before you get all worked up Peter...just kiddin around.

Thanks for the (grudging) chuckle, Gdub (though I take this topic very seriously, as you know), but also for the record, the battle to liberate Holland was particularly bloody and nasty -- house-to-house fighting against a crack, experienced German army. Our country paid quite dearly in young men's blood for the cause of freedom, and I, for one, will never forget that.

The Dutch, bless them, have not forgotten either, and they teach their children at what cost -- and from what quarter -- their freedom from a MASSIVELY stronger, evil foe was re-won.

Now, TTYL -- it's hot and sunny outside, and my family, BBQ and cold beer beckon! Ah, freedom!

Peter wrote: gdub411 wrote: Yup...those 3 canadian mounties sent that one german a runnin...before you get all worked up Peter...just kiddin around. Thanks for the (grudging) chuckle, Gdub (though I take this topic very seriously, as you know), but also for the record, the battle to liberate Holland was particularly bloody and nasty -- house-to-house fighting against a crack, experienced German army. Our country paid quite dearly in young men's blood for the cause of freedom, and I, for one, will never forget that. The Dutch, bless them, have not forgotten either, and they teach their children at what cost -- and from what quarter -- their freedom from a MASSIVELY stronger, evil foe was re-won. Now, TTYL -- it's hot and sunny outside, and my family, BBQ and cold beer beckon! Ah, freedom!

Hey Peter,

Just outside Arnhem, there is a war cemetary especially dedicated to the Canadians, with a memorial of thanks from the Dutch, to your nation for the sacrifice your countrymen made...

Please also remember that on the other side of the road, there is the British Cemetary, where almost 8,000 of our troops lost their lives during Operation Market Garden in 1944... their average ages were 20 yrs, many were married and some had children they never met.  It brought a lump to my throat.