Bandcamp lay off 50% of staff |
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 11 2007 Location: Memphis Status: Offline Points: 10672 |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17940 |
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Hi, The sad part of this, is, that this could easily be remedied in a country that has folks that can afford it, but it doesn't happen. My name is not Gomelsky to pick up some exciting new talent that no one ever heard and plunk them into records, and then (later) CD's. What does this say? As the example, of how many musicians will end up frozen out ... but then bandcamp is not sending you a check every month for $5 dollars either, or you wouldn't say anything. That pretty much says that bandcamp is not helping folks like it should ... Printing a new work, is no longer the way to do it ... it's all digital now and I'm already looking to get all my LP's digitized (if they aren't so already) and then dump them, as they are way too heavy for this old man. CD's will be next ... once all in a digital folder, goodbye to the CD. As I mentioned before, there needs to be a "musicians site" that helps ... not some corporate BS that is merely ripping off the folks out there. Anb by helping, I mean a site that shows their finances on record for everyone ... hate it that bandcamp, apple and others are secretive ... which is (to me) that they are ripping someone off badly ... and it's best to excuse it as privacy! 50 years later, it's still the same story ... there has never been any "accounting" for the moneys taken in ... and the IRS never chased it, and continues to allow these folks to get away from it all ... supposedly because some musicians (usually the rich ones) keep saying that it will hurt the business ... their business, screw anyone else's!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21430 |
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I ripped all my CDs 25 years ago ... I've gotten used to having my entire collection with me, always. I kept the CDs, but they're at my mother's place, since I didn't have enough room to keep them at the apartment I rented while I was studying for my degree. I took some of them when we moved to Sweden, but there's still about 900 CDs and 200 LPs waiting to be relocated.
Today I'm mostly listening via Spotify, occasionally Bandcamp, sometimes my own collection (some artists still don't support any streaming service). As long as artists willingly agree to put their music there, I will keep using these services as a matter of convenience. I am keeping a chart of my favorite albums on my website, so that in the event that these services shut down, I know what to buy to switch to offline mode.
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator Prog Folk Joined: April 29 2004 Location: Heart of Europe Status: Online Points: 20390 |
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I've been using paypal for 18 years and find it ultra-easy (and haven't noticed additional costs) and very safe. Once your credit is registered in their system (it's easy to update too), you don't have to pull it out of your wallet I have to use my bank satellite module to OK payments, but it's quite quick
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
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BrufordFreak
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: January 25 2008 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 8363 |
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Bandcamp has been my go to for 75% of my new music since about 2014. I always love buying music there cuz I feel good about supporting (and communicating) with the artists more directly. (Plus, I've converted my music collection to almost 100% digital formats.) I would be very sad if I were unable to use them in the future.
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Drew Fisher
https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/ |
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Spacekitchen
Forum Groupie Joined: April 24 2023 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 62 |
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Absolutely awful turn of events, especially after Epic bought the company and fired a huge portion of their staff just earlier this year If you want to directly support us musicians through Bandcamp the best option is to buy your music on the first Friday of the month, that's when 93% of the money goes to the artist/label. |
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Rottenprogger
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 13 2021 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 249 |
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Capitalism only supports art when they can exploit it for massive profit otherwise it will strangle it to death at its' earliest opportunity. More confirmation that the new owner doesn't give one single damn about BC.
Edited by Rottenprogger - October 17 2023 at 21:38 |
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siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15330 |
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My first impression reading the article is that by selling Bandcamp they can bust the union simply by doing the classic corporate LLC shuffle. Simply "sell" it to another legal fiction and voila! No union! I cannot believe Bandcamp isn't amazingly profitable given the massive amount of music sold and the relatively low overhead to host a single artist's material.
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17940 |
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Hi, In my book, this is exactly what happened to FM radio after the 70's when the corporate rape took place and all the "independent" FM stations were bought out by corporations. And 24 hours later, you had the "classic" stations that are still there ... or worse ... ask LA about KMET ... over night ... new wave ... and it was the top rated FM station in LA! Tells you the viciousness of "business", sometimes. Again, as I sad before, this would not happen if there was a group of musicians that TOGETHER took care of all this ... but the divisions and the competition they are used to, won't allow many folks to do this ... and they go to BC and Spotify and other sites and "hope" and then "pray" for a check for one lunch! Wow ... such talent for a lunch ... We refuse to learn and help new bands learn ... they won't look at The Grateful Dead, Porcupine Tree, Dream Theater, Marillion, King Crimson (in the past 20 years) and others that control their music, and it is the only way to do this ... but I wonder how much some of these bands want to share space ... PT has done it, but it is all about SW's projects and that's about it ... and while the other PT is nice, it is very over-rated in my book. The fact is that SW, for example, has already been bought out for "distributing" so he doesn't have to bother with it, or waste money on shipping and all the stuff that goes with it. Not surprised ... and until the day that all of the progressive alltalk and noshow help these bands come together and create a venture that will help get rid of bandcamp or the like ... but we're too lazy for that ... and the next entrepreneur will likely end up getting his own set of colored balls after ripping off some artists as much as possible. Saddest thing ... in this day and age ... another company going for the greed and we don't give a hoot!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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Nogbad_The_Bad
Forum & Site Admin Group RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 21188 |
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Pitchfork article
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21430 |
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^ Interesting. My two cents on this: Artists should focus on selling their music themselves, avoiding the middle man almost completely. As the article says, Bandcamp has become a sort-of monopoly when it comes to "alternative" music sales. Whenever one single company becomes too big, it gets vulnerable to a number of problems. I am using Bandcamp to listen to new releases without having to buy them. I have occasionally bought stuff, but honestly I can't afford to buy everything I'm listening to and like. The few albums I really love I'll try to buy as vinyl directly from the artist, and I think this will (and should be) the future: Most listeners have a subscription to a streaming service, and some are also buying physical/digital albums directly from the artists.
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21430 |
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There's another quite interesting article linked at the end of that Pitchfork article:
Looks like Bandcamp is about to ensh*ttificated properly.
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Hrychu
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 03 2013 Location: poland? Status: Offline Points: 5589 |
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You are however not acknowledging artists like me for example, who can't fuсking afford to poop out CDs and vinyl whenever they feel like it. And even if I had to print out 100 poorly duplicated or 300-500 hq pressed physical copies (minumum amount in the case of the majority of CD/vinyl manufacturing services), wait a year and a half or these days perhaps even like more than two, three years (that's minimum waiting time in the case of ALL such services), that would never fuсking sell enough copies for me not to actually sink/lose money!!!
FOR A POOR POOR POOR POOR UNDERGROUND ARTIST, RELEASING MUSIC IN PHYSICAL FORMAT IS EXPENSIVE!!! And considering the lightspeed inflation, IT'S BASICALLY FINANCIAL SUICIDE! Anyway: spotify, Tidal, YT Music sucks. Plain and simple. We've already talked about the 0.000000001% revenue for the artist. But there are other problems. The audio is in GARBAGE quality (even for premium subbed consumers) and on top of that the services RUIN the mastering, by adjusting the loudness level to their bogus systems (YEAH, even for premium subbed consumers). And the NAIL to the coffin is of course that it is STREAMING, no DOWNLOADS!!! So for example, if some generous fan wants to support me and keep my music forever.... well, then the only possibility is to send me a message containing the proof that they made the payment via I dunno, paypalme or patreon (in that case I'd have to create a patreon, get verified yada yada) or something, and ask for a private manually-sent download link. Sounds like a lot of hassle? Well, that lack of convenience just discourages the listener from buying the album. :( But how is the listener gonna be informed the new album was released? Back in the Bandcamp era, Bandcamp itself would inform followers. But now, I'd have to create a mailing list on some most likely paid service! :( And somehow, spread the word and get folks to join it, which is very hard in this day and age. And even with all that being done, no new listeners will ever find me, because the convenient, user friendly platform that is Bandcamp will not exist anymore!!! So, I'd have to make it big on YT or Twitter/X or something first. Except, it's an unachievable task for an underground micro-niche prog rock musician. So, TLDR: small and poor prog artists are fuсked. |
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21430 |
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^ Which is why I favor non-physical formats.
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Saperlipopette!
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 20 2010 Location: Tomorrowland Status: Offline Points: 12206 |
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^^ Are we allowed to write f**k now? Not that I personally ever feel the f**king need to write f**k, but I think it should be f**king allowed. Edit: Not me. Only Hrychu is allowed it seems.
Edited by Saperlipopette! - October 18 2023 at 08:20 |
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Hrychu
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 03 2013 Location: poland? Status: Offline Points: 5589 |
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Not really. I just figured a workaround.
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progaardvark
Special Collaborator Crossover/Symphonic/RPI Teams Joined: June 14 2007 Location: Sea of Peas Status: Offline Points: 52327 |
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I know this is unhelpful for the time being. If the past is any indicator, Bandcamp will eventually collapse and it will open up an economical niche that something else will eventually fill. This has happened numerous times already during my existence with my hobby music project: mp3.com, JavaMusic, Ampcast, SoundClick (which is still around), using CDr services of Cafepress (they don't do this anymore), CDr services of Amazon (they don't do this anymore), and CDr services of Kunaki (this still exists). So, when Bandcamp disappears, I'll just find something else. Whatever replaces Bandcamp will also not exist forever. It will follow the same path: nice idea leads to cool website, independent artists are the greatest, big company comes along and offers several million dollars, take the money and run, website collapses, ad infinitum.
(I know a CDr isn't as good as a pressed CD, but it's pretty much the only affordable option for a hobbyist or a poor musician. When you start looking at trying to get a pressed CD, the costs just don't reap the benefits, and then you have boxes and boxes of them stored in your closets - not me personally, but from what I've heard from people that have chosen that path)
My music project is just a hobby. For more serious musicians, I understand what you're going through. For years and years, I offered my albums as "name your price" and I can tell you that the number of people that download it for free versus those that kindly offer a couple dollars is at a minimum a 9-to-1 ratio. It's more on average at 20-to-1. So, all this talk about supporting independent musicians is just bullsh*t. Statistics don't lie. (I no longer do "name your price." I'm tired of being generous. Sorry if that sounds arrogant.) |
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i'm shopping for a new oil-cured sinus bag that's a happy bag of lettuce this car smells like cartilage nothing beats a good video about fractions |
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siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15330 |
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That is only true if said company chooses to sell out. There is no reason an indie label cannot sustain itself on a level that maintains all the desirable attributes of what attracted the masses to it in the first place. The problem is too many are willing to cash in and let their baby crash and burn.
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 20031 |
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If this is true, why are there so many artists on Twitter saying how great Bandcamp is and how worried they are about this news?
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 20031 |
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You can buy CDs from Bandcamp.
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