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Has a Prog album ever won a Grammy?
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 1990 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2020 at 19:20
I think the joy for the artist has much more to do with people relating to their music on some level. I don’t think most artists care that much for awards. It was nice to see Rush and Yes get accepted into the R&R HOF, but it made me sad that it was too little too late for Chris Squire. And, Yes isn’t like Rush. They’ve had a lot of different artists come and go, and some got in and some didn’t. That also didn’t sit well with a lot of people. Maybe awards are more trouble than they’re worth. Better to just enjoy the music methinks.
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Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Originally posted by BrufordFreak BrufordFreak wrote:

PAT METHENY has won a bunch (20 wins, 36 niminations)--including: 
1982's Offramp, 
1984's First Circle, 
1987's Still Life (Talking), 
1989's Letter from Home, 
1993's highly acclaimed (here on PA) Secret Story, 
1995's Imaginary Day, and 
2005's The Way Up.

So, you're saying if Yes was put in the jazz category like Metheny for most of his nominations, they'd have probably won? What are the chances the Grammy voters would have even nominated any of Metheny's albums if he was considered for the rock category? I would say zero.


Actually, Greg, I don't think I was saying anything. (I hadn't even seen your post--the one that preceded mine--when I was writing mine.) If I was implying anything, it might be that polished Jazz-Rock Fusion has had a better chance in the Grammy's cuz Jazz is a genre that voters like to hear in a watered down, melodic, classic rock-like, easy listening format. (Even Miles is easier to listen to that say 'Trane, Pharoah Sanders, Sun Ra, or Ornette Coleman, thus Grammy award wins.) So, in effect, I agree with you: Metheny would never get nominated in the Rock categories (but then, he's not really rock, is he?)
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https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/
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Points: 8191 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote BrufordFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2020 at 19:51
Miles, Herbie Hancock, Chick Corea, Weather Report, Jaco Pastorius, RTF, Stanley Clarke, Mahavishnu (1972 & 73), Jean-Luc Ponty, Tony Williams, Al DiMeola, Herbie Mann, Larry Coryell, Billy Cobham, have all received numerous nominations thus solidifiying my point about the Jazz-Rock Fusion access point.

Also, the Soundtrack avenue is another way that some prog artists have received Grammy recognition--Tangerine Dream and Vangelis to point 

Kate Bush has three nominations, Peter Gabriel 6 wins in 21 nominations. King Crimson two nominations, Robert Fripp, three. Mike Oldfield won for Tubular Bells (the song), was nominated for Voyager. Rush had seven nominations, no wins.

Then there are the metal categories...
Drew Fisher
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Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

How exactly do you expect a prog album to win a Grammy when not even Pink Floyd has won one for albums like DSotM, WYWH, Animals or The Wall? The only one that was even nominated in the year it was eligible was The Wall, and that lost to Lennon's Double Fantasy. Floyd received a Grammy for the instrumental "Marooned", and 2 "Hall of Fame" awards for DSoTM in 1999 and the Wall in 2008. I guess Grammy's "Hall of Fame" awards are actually "We Admit We F*cked Up" Revisionist awards.

Yes never got a nomination in their heyday (although later songs like "Blower of a Wicked Fart" and albums like Big Generator were nominated), Genesis was never even nominated until they started playing Broadway show tunes and romantic movie melodies, and Tull was nominated once for Heavy Metal, of all things, but never for any album from the 1970s.

Just for clarification; Tull's Grammy was for Best Hard Rock/Heavy Metal Recording not just Heavy Metal. 6 out of the 9 tracks you would classify as Hard Rock.....and it's a brilliant album IMHO. So good on them.

But it was the first time there was a Grammy to be given which had the name "metal" written on it, and it's generally seen as a shame that the first Grammy that could've potentially been awarded as a metal grammy for a metal album went as a non-metal grammy to a non-metal album.
Porg for short. My love of music doesn't end with prog! Feel free to discuss all sorts of music with me. Odds are I'll give it a chance if I haven't already! :)
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 1990 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2020 at 23:22
I remember that. It is another problem with these kinds of awards. My metalhead friends were angry, because they thought Metallica deserved it. And, there was a big argument about whether the flute was a hard rock instrument. We’re throwing salt on some old wounds here. I love Jethro Tull’s music, but I didn’t think at the time that they should have been in the same category as heavy metal bands for an award. At the same time, the flute is 100% an exquisite instrument for Prog rock music.
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Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Yes never got a nomination in their heyday (although later songs like "Blower of a Wicked Fart" and albums like Big Generator were nominated), Genesis was never even nominated until they started playing Broadway show tunes and romantic movie melodies, and Tull was nominated once for Heavy Metal, of all things, but never for any album from the 1970s.


Made my day (Trevor Horn samples Yes for.... their own song) LOL
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Hi,

Marlon ... "what the heck am I gonna do with it?" ... and decline it!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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Points: 34055 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Icarium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2020 at 08:16
but Peter Gabriel is one of the most winninh MT-V award winners of them all, alongside Madonna.
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Points: 196 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Homotopy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2020 at 10:41
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

I hope not
Just what I thought.
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Points: 18269 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2020 at 11:16
Originally posted by BrufordFreak BrufordFreak wrote:

I remember even as a kid viewing the nominations lists and wondering who the heck the voters were cuz none of the music being nominated (other than Stevie Wonder) was either the most popular (according to Billboard), innovative, or, in my opinion, interesting. The "white bread" of music was winning most of the awards. It was as if people were voting for insider members--to recognize "their own"--people who were playing by the corporate rules (though there are always exceptions).


Oh you mean kind of like the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame only substitute "white bread" for music that has hipster street cred(Talking heads, Lou Reed, Ramones etc.).


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - May 31 2020 at 11:16
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Points: 3136 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2020 at 12:08
It would seem to me that, the fact that, OK computer and Kid A were nominated is the smoking gun..they aint prog...
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 1990 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2020 at 12:59
There really is no fair way to quantify the subjective. Also, I don’t think we should necessarily fault Prog bands for going in a more commercial direction, especially considering that artists also need to eat, drink, and be housed. Also it may seem like album quality often scales inversely with production costs. But, the other side of that coin is that bands typically spend much time on their first album but have almost zero time to unearth new material for subsequent albums that are produced on the fly.
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Points: 18269 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2020 at 13:20
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:

It would seem to me that, the fact that, OK computer and Kid A were nominated is the smoking gun..they aint prog...

Rick Wakeman would disagree with you there. Wink
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Pink Floyd was nominated four times and won once.

Yes also ... they had five nominations and won once.


Edited by Cinema - June 01 2020 at 12:39
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 1990 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2020 at 17:46
Not only did "Cinema" win a Grammy for Best Rock Instrumental Performance, but 90125 also received a nomination for Best Rock Performance by a Duo or Group with Vocal. Good thing, too, because 90125 doesn’t even make it on the PA 1980s-90s “Best” list.   
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Points: 18269 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2020 at 20:23
Originally posted by Jaketejas Jaketejas wrote:

Not only did "Cinema" win a Grammy for Best Rock Instrumental Performance, but 90125 also received a nomination for Best Rock Performance by a Duo or Group with Vocal. Good thing, too, because 90125 doesn’t even make it on the PA 1980s-90s “Best” list.   

Should it? I think as a rock album it deserves a 4 or 5 rating(based on this sites ratings system)but as a prog album I don't think it necessarily deserves more than a 3. However, I do think most prog fans should own it since it's still a part of prog history. 
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 1990 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2020 at 20:34
How can one decouple or compartmentalize that which is inextricably linked? We are talking about 80s Prog here, which is not the same as 70s Prog. 80s Prog was a very different format from 70s Prog, and should not be judged on the same basis. I think that is half the problem. We can’t judge it based on the epic format of CTTE. It was a different time.
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Originally posted by Jaketejas Jaketejas wrote:

How can one decouple or compartmentalize that which is inextricably linked? We are talking about 80s Prog here, which is not the same as 70s Prog. 80s Prog was a very different format from 70s Prog, and should not be judged on the same basis. I think that is half the problem. We can’t judge it based on the epic format of CTTE. It was a different time.

Yes, but it's debatable that 90125 has enough qualities to be called prog. You may as well call the first Asia album prog or the 80's Genesis or Moody Blues albums prog. Maybe they are but maybe they aren't. It will depend on someone's definition of prog and how strict they want to be about it.
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Who cares? Prog is awesome as it is! 
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 1990 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2020 at 21:26
Asia, yes I would, but not using the same definition as 70s Prog. The format and technology had changed. The musicianship and technical ability were there, but the arrangements were shorter, slicker, crisper, and more radio friendly. It’s apples and oranges trying to compare with 70s epics.

The beauty of 70s Prog is that it was more raw, organic, and felt less processed. Themes took time to be developed. The beauty of 80s Prog is that it was delivered in rapid, radio-ready, easily digestible bites. It was more synthetic with a greater emphasis on technology and production.

Edited by Jaketejas - June 01 2020 at 21:40
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