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Ok. Which is superior ?

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Poll Question: Take your pick..
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49 [51.04%]
47 [48.96%]
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M27Barney View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 09:21
I'm sure that Stolt would be chuffed to be mentioned in the same sentence as Bach....but again , obviously I would choose Bach, since his music definately influenced prog more than most classical composers...but one cannot ignore the elephant in the room. You can't polish a turd, and even though the fan boys may scream and shout, DSOTM is more about studio perfection versus musical and lyrical content...the fact that Foxtrot is deemed inferior because of its recording/mix is a fookin ludicrous argument....and still tbe supposedly perfect headphone album has not much more to offer? Call it art rock? Pop or studio perfection n sound effects....I still don't see how it gets anywhere near the top 10000 prog releases...or is that just me?

Edited by M27Barney - April 01 2020 at 09:22
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 09:26
And anyway a fox in a red dress....genius...or a woman with a foxes head...either way its a winner...

Edited by M27Barney - April 01 2020 at 09:27
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chaser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 09:41
DSOTM is a great album, but it's Foxtrot for me
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 09:44
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:

DSOTM is more about studio perfection versus musical and lyrical content

Just your opinion...

Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:

...the fact that Foxtrot is deemed inferior because of its recording/mix is a fookin ludicrous argument

I didn't say it's because of the recording/mix.  I would take Nursery Cryme over DSOTM just fine.  But Foxtrot is a very uneven album.  Watcher has that brilliant intro and then that repetition of Watcher of the skies watching about goes on for entirely too long.  Other than that, Get Em Out By Friday is ok, not the best Genesis song ever made or anything and if Trick of the Tail had Peter Gabriel in the credits, most Genesis fanboys would be rating most of that album over Get Em Out.  Supper's Ready is, of course, the undeniable and timeless masterpiece.  If they had just released Supper's Ready as an EP and not stuck on this extra baggage, would I rate Foxtrot over DSOTM?  Yes, I would.  But as it stands, I have to deal with this baggage dragging down one of the greatest epics of prog while everything on DSOTM has a reason, a purpose as to why it's put in there.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 10:00
Fair enough...but I posited that it would be 50/50 or close to...the dichotomy is proven on a reasonably small sample size admittedly...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 10:10
Whether Dark Side of the Moon, or Bach, has anything to do with Prog would not make any difference to me as the question was stated. I consider Dark Side of the Moon to be more of a classic of rock than Prog. I would expect it to rank very high on many rock lists period, whether classic rock, art rock, mainstream rock or progressive rock. It is considered by many to be a seminal album, it's iconic, and many make very positive associations with it. I don;t know how I;d rank it in my collection, it's not one I've listened to much in years, but it is an album that has been very important in my life (especially as a teenager). Foxtrot is just another Gabriel-era Genesis album to me.   It's not that special to me, others will feel differently.   Now "Supper's Ready" is a huge classic, I'd posit. I wouldn't say that either is generally-speaking inherently superior to the other, and different people will take different approaches.

Sorry for adding in part of one of my earlier posts to this post, slightly edited. It wasn't considered interesting enough to get a response then, and I doubt it would now, but it saves me trying to re-type some of that stuff, and my wife is at me to get down to work.

I do consider Dark Side of the Moon to be the much more remarkable and significant album in the history of rock, music generally, and art. That doesn't make it intrinsically to be of better quality, but Dark Side of the Moon is far more iconic and has had a much greater impact.

I've never much liked Foxtrot. I don't find it to be anything special even just in the Genesis oeuvre. To me it doesn't stand out, other then Supper's Ready, and if we were without it, well, it's not that remarkable or unusual an achievement for Genesis. One could easily substitute Nursery Cryme or Selling England by the Pound, I think. And as art rock, I dig The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway.

Dark Side of the Moon may not be my favourite Pink Floyd (it has been), but it does still stand out in the discography as it is so iconic, and it gets referenced in popular culture a great deal. It is one of the great works of the second half of the 20th century I'd posit, whereas Foxtrot is just another Gabriel era Genesis album to me, and it happens to be my least liked of those other than the debut. Pink Floyd has many great albums I think, but only one Dark Side of the Moon. I don't feel quite the same about Genesis with Foxtrot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 12:25
this thread reminds me of this

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HackettFan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 12:27
Foxtrot. Now 29-29.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 20:25
on third beer... so on go the caps...

GET OFF THE DRUGS GENESIS FANS..  NOT EVEN IN THE SAME LEAGUE!!!!!!!

sheesh... I feel better now.. what happened to this forum anyway. We used to have people who knew music.. now we just have fanboys here.

 VDGG may give prog a bad name..  but it is Genesis fan that give prog fan a bad name
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Padraic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 21:02
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

on third beer... so on go the caps...

GET OFF THE DRUGS GENESIS FANS..  NOT EVEN IN THE SAME LEAGUE!!!!!!!

sheesh... I feel better now.. what happened to this forum anyway. We used to have people who knew music.. now we just have fanboys here.

 VDGG may give prog a bad name..  but it is Genesis fan that give prog fan a bad name

You tell 'em mick
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2020 at 22:40
Foxtrot is prog, DSOM is AOR.  

There, I said it.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 00:53
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Foxtrot is prog, DSOM is AOR.  

There, I said it.  

Aye...MICKY...YO FLOYD FANCHILD....DON'T COME CRYING TO US WHEN YOU START BEING STALKED BY FOXHEAD WOMEN IN RED DRESSES....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 02:05
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

on third beer... so on go the caps...

GET OFF THE DRUGS GENESIS FANS..  NOT EVEN IN THE SAME LEAGUE!!!!!!!

sheesh... I feel better now.. what happened to this forum anyway. We used to have people who knew music.. now we just have fanboys here.

 VDGG may give prog a bad name..  but it is Genesis fan that give prog fan a bad name

I'm sorry I can't hear you over the sounds of myself throwing 1,000,000 copies of DSoTM into a wood chipper Wink.

"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 02:43
And here I thought Slayer and Dream Theater fanboys were ridiculous, add Genesis to the list. 

Like I said before, they are two quite different bands to compare. What's next? Someone will compare Moody Blues and Opeth? 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote someone_else Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 03:05
^Or Shub-Niggurath and Moon Safari.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 03:32
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

And here I thought Slayer and Dream Theater fanboys were ridiculous, add Genesis to the list. 

Like I said before, they are two quite different bands to compare. What's next? Someone will compare Moody Blues and Opeth? 



Guess you haven't previously seen this side of the Bobble Heads as micky refers to them.  Hey, I love Genesis too but I don't understand this need to sneer at Pink Floyd. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 06:23
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

...
Plus, I have always been irritated at Steve Hackett for not properly acknowledging that he lifted "Horizons" from Bach.

Hi,

You know why all those home orchestras play dead composers, right? .... They don't have to pay them ... so stealing a riff from Bach ... your free token!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 06:24
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

And here I thought Slayer and Dream Theater fanboys were ridiculous, add Genesis to the list. 

Like I said before, they are two quite different bands to compare. What's next? Someone will compare Moody Blues and Opeth? 




Guess you haven't previously seen this side of the Bobble Heads as micky refers to them.  Hey, I love Genesis too but I don't understand this need to sneer at Pink Floyd. 

A bit of an over-reaction. This bobblehead loves some floyd. Echoes has a dreamy laidback vibe and the start is ace, especially the submarine ping...Shine on had one of the best starts of any symphonic prog track. Also I love all of Animals...also a better album than DSOYM by 10 magnitudes...and proper prog...This argument would be duplicated if abacab was in the top rated albums...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 06:25
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

...
I'm sorry I can't hear you over the sounds of myself throwing 1,000,000 copies of DSoTM into a wood chipper Wink.

Hi,

All that money thrown away ... go ahead!Confused
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2020 at 06:31
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:

Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

And here I thought Slayer and Dream Theater fanboys were ridiculous, add Genesis to the list. 

Like I said before, they are two quite different bands to compare. What's next? Someone will compare Moody Blues and Opeth? 




Guess you haven't previously seen this side of the Bobble Heads as micky refers to them.  Hey, I love Genesis too but I don't understand this need to sneer at Pink Floyd. 

A bit of an over-reaction. This bobblehead loves some floyd. Echoes has a dreamy laidback vibe and the start is ace, especially the submarine ping...Shine on had one of the best starts of any symphonic prog track. Also I love all of Animals...also a better album than DSOYM by 10 magnitudes...and proper prog...This argument would be duplicated if abacab was in the top rated albums...

But again, Abacab and DSOTM are nothing like each other.  You cannot discount the cultural relevance of DSOTM just because it doesn't have full fledged prog songs; something Abacab doesn't have even a mere smidgen of.  Words like "Black and blue/And who knows which is which and who is who" will never get too old, ever. Foxtrot is interesting in its own right but simply doesn't have the broad sweep of DSOTM. 
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