A Washington Post Reporter on his Love of Prog - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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zenarcher

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Topic: A Washington Post Reporter on his Love of Prog
Posted: May 25 2017 at 07:55

He says prog was rock's "best" rebellion:

http://www.vulture.com/2017/05/david-weigel-prog-rock-book.html

Atavachron View Drop Down

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 14:20

http://www.vulture.com/2017/05/david-weigel-prog-rock-book.html

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Catcher10

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 15:08

This guy is off his rocker........The rantings of a raving lunatic

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 15:10

"In the age of Adderall, it’s hard to find a substantial audience that’s willing to.."

Weigel's only 35. This is definitive proof that prog rock accelerates the aging process and turns even young people into stubborn old cliches.

We must ban prog! Save the children from Old Man Syndrome!

[Hyperreflective paradigm breaking profundity goes here]

Kepler62

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 15:13

Nobody really gets it. It was the record companies buying each other out that kills music. It's always been the mighty dollar not what people liked. Look, the guy even says that a lot of people who had Zeppelin albums also probably had ELP albums. The masses have always been sheep no matter what you are talking about, TV, food, cleaning products, cars blah blah blah . No style of music killed prog. Big business just moved the masses in a different direction.

dr wu23

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 15:17

Heh.....I think he's spot on.

;)

One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 17:36

Kepler62 wrote:

Nobody really gets it. It was the record companies buying each other out that kills music. It's always been the mighty dollar not what people liked. Look, the guy even says that a lot of people who had Zeppelin albums also probably had ELP albums. The masses have always been sheep no matter what you are talking about, TV, food, cleaning products, cars blah blah blah . No style of music killed prog. Big business just moved the masses in a different direction.

The 'masses' may often have bad taste or even be on the dumb side, but they most certainly are not sheep. People buy the music they enjoy, period. If prog sold well in the '70s it's because a strong rock market had matured and been primed by the Art and Psych movements to be open to what prog became.

If anything, prog was a most unlikely and unsustainable style of music and not what record executives would try to shove down peoples' throat. It did well for the same reason metal and disco and Pop did well: people liked it and were willing to shell-out ten bucks for some wax.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy

Catcher10

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 18:07

Correct...people buy music because they like it. I am a perfect example of that philosophy....I don't own any Beatles records.

Prog rock has never been for the casual listener.

rogerthat

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 19:11

There's one - and just one - thing I agree with him on in the interview. Where he mentions that maybe prog was too 'European' and lacked soul. As I have mentioned before, before I got into prog, I used to listen to the music of Illayaraja who was able to adapt Western classical devices AND rock/funk grooves to Indian folk music so that gave his work a spontaneity I have rarely if ever come across in prog. Maybe in some of Yes's music and GG starts out sounding very infectious (because it is so groovy) before it quickly gets pretty dense. I don't mean that in a bad way but I can see how that might limit prog's appeal because it really requires perseverance from the listener before he even gets to the point of sort of liking the music, let alone loving it.

On the other hand, LZ weren't trying to push boundaries and were just a loud rock band? And Wetton is the best he can come up with when he is asked to name a good prog lyricist? Sorry, basis those assertions, I would have to question just how well informed he is. It's ok if he was just discussing music on a forum like this but for somebody who has written a book on prog, I would expect more research.

AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 20:44

I saw this on PE. Interesting. I'm going to print it out and read it at some point.

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 20:46

I might buy his book, it sounds quite interesting

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 21:05

Ok, I did wind up reading parts of it. Two things (for now anyway). One is he thinks Led Zeppelin were "just" a loud rock band who didn't push any boundaries. What a bunch of crap is that. I disagree with that also. LZ might not have been true prog but they did expand things in the seventies much the same way the Beatles did in the sixties(imo). This guy obviously never heard Houses of the Holy, Presence or Physical Graffiti not to mention the unfairly maligned In through the Out Door.

Also, he refers to John Wetton as a lyricist. To the best of my knowledge JW did not write any of the lyrics for the KC albums he appeared on. The lyrics were written by Richard Palmer James.

Manuel

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 21:55

Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

I might buy his book, it sounds quite interesting

Me too. I think it'll be a good read.

infocat

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Posted: May 25 2017 at 21:59

AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Ok, I did wind up reading parts of it. Two things (for now anyway). One is he thinks Led Zeppelin were "just" a loud rock band who didn't push any boundaries. What a bunch of crap is that. I disagree with that also. LZ might not have been true prog but they did expand things in the seventies much the same way the Beatles did in the sixties(imo). This guy obviously never heard Houses of the Holy, Presence or Physical Graffiti not to mention the unfairly maligned In through the Out Door.

Also, he refers to John Wetton as a lyricist. To the best of my knowledge JW did not write any of the lyrics for the KC albums he appeared on. The lyrics were written by Richard Palmer James.

For whatever its worth, Wikipedia has this to say: "The original lyrics and melody for "Starless" were written by John Wetton. [...] For the Red recording sessions, the lyrics were again altered (with contributions by Richard Palmer-James)."

There is also no Palmer-James credit for "One More Red Nightmare", so I assume JW wrote the lyrics there as well.

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Belief is not Truth.

presdoug

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Posted: May 26 2017 at 02:55

Nice to see Triumvirat get their just due, not to be taken for granted in the grand scheme of things.

Kepler62

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Posted: May 26 2017 at 03:12

Yeah for all kit's worth. I sometimes use Wikipedia as a guideline. Buzz Osbourne of the famous prog band the Melvins was asked about the Melvins' entry in Wilipedia and a lot of ot was just fabrication. back on topic. I think that the only book on prog rock that I've read that matters is Macan's Rocking The Classics. That's all you really need. After 1974 or 75 prog had pretty much run it's course and whether anyone wants to accept it or not it it's the industry and economics that sways the music consumer. Bob Fripp did the right thing when he ended King Crimson " For ever and ever " . When it did come back in '80 it wasn'r any more a prog band than Genesis after ATTW3. One think I agree with the guy with is when he talks about Led Zeppelin. They were stealing sh*t right from the get go. Just a band that turned the blues up to eleven that was gobbled up by the music consuming public. Gotta listen to something without digging any deeper than the local FM radio station that plays the hell out of three or 4 songs.

Edited by Kepler62 - May 26 2017 at 03:15

SteveG

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Posted: May 26 2017 at 04:25

"Lovers of Prog" forever try to cast this genre as being above commercial interests. Prog was big business in the early seventies. It helped to found Virgin Records via Mike Oldfield and made Atco/Atlantic a fortune with Yes and Genesis. Atlantic head Ahmet Ertegun kept a tape of Yes, Genesis or Phil Collins' "In The Air Tonight" in his office. He would play the tape after hearing a new artist's material and say "Come back when you can top that. That's what sells."

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Atavachron View Drop Down

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Posted: May 26 2017 at 14:05

Kepler62 wrote:

One think I agree with the guy with is when he talks about Led Zeppelin. They were stealing sh*t right from the get go. Just a band that turned the blues up to eleven that was gobbled up by the music consuming public.

No but I'm sure most people think of them that way.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy

SteveG

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Posted: May 27 2017 at 06:51

Atavachron wrote:

No but I'm sure most people think of them that way.

The strange thing about Zeppelin is that very few people would have heard songs like Bert Jansch's brilliant arrangement to Black Waterside if it was not pinched by Page for "his arrangement" of Black Mountainside, as Jansch, and many others that were pillaged, were such obscure cult artists.

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ExittheLemming View Drop Down

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Posted: May 27 2017 at 07:56

^ erm..wouldn't more people have heard it if Jansch had been accredited properly?

Edited by ExittheLemming - May 27 2017 at 07:57