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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 14:32
Originally posted by Pastmaster Pastmaster wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Pastmaster Pastmaster wrote:

Originally posted by garfunkel garfunkel wrote:

But BLM does not care about black on black crime AT ALL.  Shouldn't that be there main focus?  Or am I not allowed to talk about that? It makes me racist, right?

Yup, it's ridiculous. In fact, I saw a black guy complain about the whole BLM movement, and that's saying something. Also, the media only covers all the bad things done by the police and the like, when there a lot of great cops out there. The media also wants to sensationalize crimes against blacks, and probably ignores a lot of crimes against whites. 

Also, no that doesn't make you racist, I agree with you.
The media doesn't have to report on cops not killing black people or cops doing good things because THAT IS THEIR JOB AND WHAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO DO. Is it so difficult to grasp? 

No, but with so much reporting of the bad things cops do, people can forget all the good things they do. The omission of facts can lead to huge misunderstandings.
It's good, it's GREAT that we report things bad cops do, because 1.they may be influenced to stop hiring imbecile ego-freaks into the force, and 2. it might change the mindset in the US and make more people aware of this type of racism. And also 3. So it gets punished, because police men all around have this group mentality where they run to protect their own no matter what. 
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Points: 171 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 14:36
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Is it possible that blacks have two serious problems? Cops killing blacks and  black on black crime? Or is there no room for that possibility in this discussion?
Just as white on white crime. Or white heroin addiction. That is just activities of concern but again it's not institutionalized discrimination for an entire ethnic group by those with power and authority. 
So, you're saying that they are both not serious problems. Gotcha!
Vive Le France!!
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 14:40
Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Is it possible that blacks have two serious problems? Cops killing blacks and  black on black crime? Or is there no room for that possibility in this discussion?
Just as white on white crime. Or white heroin addiction. That is just activities of concern but again it's not institutionalized discrimination for an entire ethnic group by those with power and authority. 
So, you're saying that they are both not serious problems. Gotcha!
Can you be so simple-minded? Of course they are serious problems but they have nothing to do with racism and oppression as the other one. 

Weren't you just defending LGBT rights on a different thread? I wonder why you can't imagine there being other groups that are similarly targeted because of who they are.  
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Points: 171 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 14:50
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Is it possible that blacks have two serious problems? Cops killing blacks and  black on black crime? Or is there no room for that possibility in this discussion?
Just as white on white crime. Or white heroin addiction. That is just activities of concern but again it's not institutionalized discrimination for an entire ethnic group by those with power and authority. 
So, you're saying that they are both not serious problems. Gotcha!
Can you be so simple-minded? Of course they are serious problems but they have nothing to do with racism and oppression as the other one. 

Weren't you just defending LGBT rights on a different thread? I wonder why you can't imagine there being other groups that are similarly targeted because of who they are.  
Can you really be so simple minded? Racism and oppression (in the form of slavery) started all of this.
Come down from your pedestal and look.
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 14:53
Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Is it possible that blacks have two serious problems? Cops killing blacks and  black on black crime? Or is there no room for that possibility in this discussion?
Just as white on white crime. Or white heroin addiction. That is just activities of concern but again it's not institutionalized discrimination for an entire ethnic group by those with power and authority. 
So, you're saying that they are both not serious problems. Gotcha!
Can you be so simple-minded? Of course they are serious problems but they have nothing to do with racism and oppression as the other one. 

Weren't you just defending LGBT rights on a different thread? I wonder why you can't imagine there being other groups that are similarly targeted because of who they are.  
Can you really be so simple minded? Racism and oppression (in the form of slavery) started all of this.
Come down from your pedestal and look.
What pedestal? Of course I know that's how things started so what are you really trying to say? I don't understand. 
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:03
Or let's put it this way, maybe clearer: let's say police forces in here were constantly targeting LGBT people for harassment and were killing them without consequences. Someone started a #LGBTLivesMatter. Would you come here and say "no, #AllLivesMatter ! " ?? 
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Points: 65760 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:04
To keep the discussion going, here is an article voicing an opinion that is contrary to many of those being voiced in this thread http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2015/11/12/1449360/-For-White-America-Black-Protesters-Never-Do-it-Right
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Points: 5319 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:06
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Is it possible that blacks have two serious problems? Cops killing blacks and  black on black crime? Or is there no room for that possibility in this discussion?
Just as white on white crime. Or white heroin addiction. That is just activities of concern but again it's not institutionalized discrimination for an entire ethnic group by those with power and authority. 
So, you're saying that they are both not serious problems. Gotcha!
Can you be so simple-minded? Of course they are serious problems but they have nothing to do with racism and oppression as the other one. 

Weren't you just defending LGBT rights on a different thread? I wonder why you can't imagine there being other groups that are similarly targeted because of who they are.  
Can you really be so simple minded? Racism and oppression (in the form of slavery) started all of this.
Come down from your pedestal and look.
What pedestal? Of course I know that's how things started so what are you really trying to say? I don't understand. 

Calling someone simple minded and up on a pedestal usually does not help win arguments. This is something I would expect a lawyer to know.
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:08
^You're right. I was just getting frustrated. I'm sorry RayRo for the "simple minded" part. 

everything I have said about Triceratopol or something stays though


Edited by The T - November 13 2015 at 15:14
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Points: 1396 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:35
Originally posted by garfunkel garfunkel wrote:

But BLM does not care about black on black crime AT ALL.  Shouldn't that be there main focus?  Or am I not allowed to talk about that? It makes me racist, right?


But BLM does not care about black on black crime AT ALL. 

This is a huge assumption…  While it may be true for a select few, I’m sure it’s not the case for most.

 

Shouldn't that be there main focus?  

They are trying to shine a light on the subject of discrimination that to this day still plagues the country.

Black on black crime is also a problem like many other problems that should addressed.  However, you don’t want to diffuse the light of any issue that you’re trying to illuminate.

 

Or am I not allowed to talk about that? It makes me racist, right?

redirecting and diffusing the spotlight on the issue in question doesn't help. What about black on black crime, what about reverse discrimination, what about…? 



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Points: 171 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:44
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

^You're right. I was just getting frustrated. I'm sorry RayRo for the "simple minded" part. 

everything I have said about Triceratopol or something stays though
I accept your apology with no ill feelings and offer the same.
But stating that one problem is greater than another when they are intrinsically linked to a single ignition source makes little sense to me. The same way as taking one extreme political position at the sacrifice of a greater good makes little sense to me.
 
So I'll ask in a way as polite as possible and without a derisive tone. Does "black on black" crime exist? If so, then is it a problem that should be addressed?
 
Does "cops killing blacks" (BLM) really exist? If so, it is a problem that should be addressed?


Edited by RayRo - November 13 2015 at 15:46
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 16:05
Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

^You're right. I was just getting frustrated. I'm sorry RayRo for the "simple minded" part. 

everything I have said about Triceratopol or something stays though
I accept your apology with no ill feelings and offer the same.
But stating that one problem is greater than another when they are intrinsically linked to a single ignition source makes little sense to me. The same way as taking one extreme political position at the sacrifice of a greater good makes little sense to me.
 
So I'll ask in a way as polite as possible and without a derisive tone. Does "black on black" crime exist? If so, then is it a problem that should be addressed?
 
Does "cops killing blacks" (BLM) really exist? If so, it is a problem that should be addressed?
These all matter Yes. They do. But talking about one specific problem doesn't have to mean that you have to talk about all problems to give it validity. The "cops killing blacks" problem is one that doesn't have to necessarily be addressed at the same time or way as all other problems that affect blacks or any other population. 
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RayRo View Drop Down
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Points: 171 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 16:06
Originally posted by timothy leary timothy leary wrote:

 

Calling someone simple minded and up on a pedestal usually does not help win arguments. This is something I would expect a lawyer to know.
I don't see a moral answer coming for a political question, so I'll leave with this.
 
I gave Andy Webb my word, in two correspondences, that I would not use Legal English or sublanguage or make any "legalistic" sounding threats to PA members in these discussions.
 
I believe that I've kept my word.
 
A good weekend to all.


Edited by RayRo - November 13 2015 at 16:10
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Points: 1281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 17:05
Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

...
I gave Andy Webb my word...
...

Who?

On a related note, I read the Black Lives Matter site and, even if they did want freedom and equality, they're doing a poor job at trying to get it. 
He looks at this world and wants it all... so he strikes, like Thunderball!
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Points: 2223 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 18:14
I just read the entire thread and now feel very nostalgic for a good Yes v. Genesis argument.
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Points: 2466 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 19:18
Originally posted by emigre80 emigre80 wrote:

I just read the entire thread and now feel very nostalgic for a good Yes v. Genesis argument.

lol
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 19:21
And you didn't read the racist comment I received which made me also write a very awful response. Those two have been deleted. 
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Points: 7951 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 20:19
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by RayRo RayRo wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

^You're right. I was just getting frustrated. I'm sorry RayRo for the "simple minded" part. 

everything I have said about Triceratopol or something stays though


I accept your apology with no ill feelings and offer the same.
But stating that one problem is greater than another when they are intrinsically linked to a single ignition source makes little sense to me. The same way as taking one extreme political position at the sacrifice of a greater good makes little sense to me.
 
So I'll ask in a way as polite as possible and without a derisive tone. Does "black on black" crime exist? If so, then is it a problem that should be addressed?
 
Does "cops killing blacks" (BLM) really exist? If so, it is a problem that should be addressed?


These all matter Yes. They do. But talking about one specific problem doesn't have to mean that you have to talk about all problems to give it validity. The "cops killing blacks" problem is one that doesn't have to necessarily be addressed at the same time or way as all other problems that affect blacks or any other population. 
I agree with you T. I would put it this way, if it's any help. Part (only part) of the solution to black on black crime is better policing. Hence the problem. Confidence in the police is too low to be of any constructive value in solving anything. Therefore it should be priority one for things to be fixed.

I wanted to echo too that institutional racism is not just about stats on how many victims there are. Everyone of the affected minority is a victim emotionally. It's the same principle as terrorism. The success is not measured by the number of victims but by the fear it creates.

Edited by HackettFan - November 13 2015 at 20:35
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Points: 7951 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 21:20
What's the deal with white on white violence?
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Points: 5319 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2015 at 21:27
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

And you didn't read the racist comment I received which made me also write a very awful response. Those two have been deleted. 
I read it and must say that type of hate is very troubling.
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