Would you consider Rush's music Eclectic Prog?? |
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ProgMetaller2112
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 08 2012 Location: Pacoima,CA,USA Status: Offline Points: 3145 |
Topic: Would you consider Rush's music Eclectic Prog?? Posted: January 07 2013 at 23:14 |
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Rush is one of those bands who is not afraid of experimenting even if it means losing fans in the process. Their music has always practically been hard to categorize, they are Hard Rock and Metal and Progressive Rock all in one. Yet they also incorporate elements of Reggae, New Wave, Synth Rock and even Alternative Rock and Pop Rock into their sound. My question to you is. Would you consider them Eclectic??? Because the term Heavy Prog makes it seem as if they are always heavy and that's not always the case.
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Eria Tarka
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 17 2011 Location: BC, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5856 |
Posted: January 07 2013 at 23:19 | |
I think they fit well in heavy.
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Online Points: 28000 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 01:50 | |
I think they've reinvented themselves on at least 3 occasions. Heavy prog does not adequately describe 2112 , Farewell To KIngs or Hemispheres which are much closer to symhonic prog than heavy metal in my opinion. In the eighties they actually became closer to Art Rock or even sometimes described as 'Techno Rock'. For about Roll The Bones onwards they fit the heavy prog category pretty well although the prog element as disappeared over time imo. Overall if you look at their origins and then take the later albums the soul of the band is as a heavy prog band. They rule that category. If you put them in eclectic prog then presumably they go toe to toe with King Crimson and Gentle Giant.
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ProgMetaller2112
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 08 2012 Location: Pacoima,CA,USA Status: Offline Points: 3145 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 02:02 | |
Symphonic Prog , Rush is one of the founders of Progressive Metal, I would argue that their music is Progressive Metal, listen to The Necromancer, 2112 is that Symphonic Prog, and you didn't spell Symphonic right. I would consider everything they did from Fly By Night to Hemispheres Prog Metal or the beginnings of it. In the eighties they actually became closer to Art Rock , many would argue that Art Rock is Prog Rock. For about Roll The Bones onwards they fit the heavy prog category pretty well although the prog element as disappeared over time imo , The proggy elements have always been there with them, it's just the way they play , it doesn't feel right for them not to play complicated pieces If you put them in eclectic prog then presumably they go toe to toe with King Crimson and Gentle Giant. yeah and they are just as good as those two bands probably even better Edited by ProgMetaller2112 - January 08 2013 at 02:07 |
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“War is peace.
Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
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Sumdeus
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 23 2012 Location: SF Bay Area Status: Offline Points: 831 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 03:23 | |
I really don't think I could ever call them eclectic prog.
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Sumdeus - surreal space/psych/prog journeys
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: May 02 2008 Location: Going Bananas Status: Offline Points: 24294 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 03:33 | |
I think Heavy Prog fits them better, although they have incorporated some elements from different styles and they have reinvented themselves more than once. Xanadu on A Farewell to Kings has strong symphonic elements and from Permanent Waves to Signals they were rather symphonic as well. But most of their music is rather heavy Art Rock indeed.
Edited by someone_else - January 08 2013 at 03:33 |
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HarbouringTheSoul
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 21 2010 Status: Offline Points: 1199 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 04:28 | |
So he forgot a "p", big deal. You're one to talk about good English.
And many more would disagree. In general, "art rock" describes any rock music with 'artsy' elements in it, whereas "prog rock" places a greater emphasis on instrumental and compositional complexity. For example, David Bowie and Radiohead are generally considered art rock but not prog rock, because their music is relatively simple for the most part. I think Rush fit just fine in heavy prog. I wouldn't go as far as calling their music heavy metal (although they did influence a lot of prog metal bands), but definitely hard rock. Symphonic? I would say their sound is not 'orchestral' enough for that. They did change their sound over the years, but so did many many other prog bands that aren't categorized as Eclectic. I think it makes more sense to categorize a band after the style they're generally associated with, and that's heavy prog for Rush. It's bands like King Crimson, who are associated with more than one style, or Gentle Giant, whose music contains elements of many styles at once, that belong into Eclectic. |
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The Bearded Bard
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: January 24 2012 Location: Behind the Sun Status: Offline Points: 12859 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 05:15 | |
I would consider Rush's music eclectic, but that goes for most prog bands. As for moving them to Eclectic Prog, I would say no. The core of their music is unmistakenly hard rock, which makes Heavy Prog a perfect fit for them, IMO.
Edited by The Bearded Bard - January 08 2013 at 05:35 |
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5154 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 05:26 | |
It's true that they have morphed style during their long career, but this does not qualify them as Eclectic.
Each of their individual albums has a consistent style. Eclectic is reserved for those who blend many styles in one single album.
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23104 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 08:24 | |
No.
While Rush may have changed palettes a couple of times ( Caress of Steel, Signals), they have always retained that ever so Rushy rock quotient. Rush are like the prog version of the Stones. You'll get your rocks off, no doubt, but you know what to expect and have they ever really really changed style? Not really, outside of those two aforementioned records. My opinion of course - there's bound to be people out there who feel they were an integral part of the early RIO movement because of Villa Strangiato... Edited by Guldbamsen - January 08 2013 at 08:25 |
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 08:35 | |
Heavy prog is a nonsense genre anyway. But so is eclectic. But if it is so, yes, why not Eclectic?
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HolyMoly
Special Collaborator Retired Admin Joined: April 01 2009 Location: Atlanta Status: Offline Points: 26138 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 08:46 | |
To help keep the genres straight in my head, I often have a single "flagship band" that I use to identify each genre. In my case, Rush is "heavy prog" by definition, just as King Crimson is "eclectic prog" by definition. These genres don't really exist as such, but they are there for our convenience. So change them or don't change them, it doesn't really matter; as long as we're consistent and re-categorize other bands accordingly (maybe Porcupine Tree should be eclectic then... see wot I mean?). But I don't see much point in doing that, other than to stir up dust where it isn't needed.
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 08:51 | |
^You are probably right. Rush might be , but they are also Heavy. But so is King Crimson....
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ole-the-first
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 03 2012 Location: Russia Status: Offline Points: 1534 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 08:54 | |
Rush is heavy prog personified. Period.
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This night wounds time.
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rushfan4
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: May 22 2007 Location: Michigan, U.S. Status: Offline Points: 66259 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 08:55 | |
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 26 2005 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 10616 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 09:02 | |
Maybe they aren't always heavy, but most of the times they seem to be.
They don't seem to me to be as eclectic as Gentle Giant or King Crimson. But then again, I'm no Rush expert at all, I must admit.
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HarbouringTheSoul
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 21 2010 Status: Offline Points: 1199 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 11:48 | |
Actually, the Stones changed their style a lot: British Invasion, R&B, baroque pop, psychedelia, roots rock, blues rock, funk, soul, reggae, country, disco... They did all of those things. |
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HolyMoly
Special Collaborator Retired Admin Joined: April 01 2009 Location: Atlanta Status: Offline Points: 26138 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 11:50 | |
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My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased. -Kehlog Albran |
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 11:58 | |
Allocating a sub genre to certain bands may not be appropriate or necessary. Rush are one of those bands in my opinion. You could argue that Moving Pictures is quite 'eclectic' in its variety of styles. Vital Signs, Tom Sawyer, Camera Eye and Limelight are all very different. Bounded only by having the same production.
Overall, it's fair to call Rush, quite simply prog rock, imo, as they 'progressed' and developed from one album to the next, drawing on a number of diverse musical influences. To categorise them overall as 'eclectic' to me seems both off target, and unnecessary. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Online Points: 28000 |
Posted: January 08 2013 at 15:42 | |
I didn't bother to correct my spelling as that 'edited at blah blah' thing at the bottom of the page is always irrititating. In any case it was actually a typo
I always assumed 'Art Rock' to be more about songs than long peices but had a quick look on the internet and its not that straightforward
I guess I got it wrong by using the term 'art rock' but what I was trying to get at was that in the 80's Rush left behind the complexity without losing the artistic qualities in their music.
From 90's onwards they became a lot more straightforward and concentrated on just writing songs but retaining heavy qualities. I have no problem with that btw and rate Vapor Trails highly.
I am a fan and would argue that hardly anything they did could be called 'prog metal'. They likely influenced prog metal bands but then so did many other prog bands .Rush were from a heavy rock background and no more a metal band than Led Zep or Deep Purple. The origins of prog metal come from metal. This would be Iron Maiden , Mettalica and so forth. If you are going back before then perhaps Led Zep 'Achilles Last Stand' was a starting point?
As good as Gentle Giant and King Crimson? Rush smoke both those bands for sheer power but I think those other bands were drawing on a much wider base of influences that went beyond other prog bands. Rush were influenced by King Crimson among others not vice versa.
Disclaimer - apologies for any typo's in the above caused by having chubby ageing fingers. (However I do accept that grammatical errors are down to my lack of intelligence and/or education )
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