The History Of Metal

Well the first Judas Priest album was in 1974 (Rocka Rolla) so is really the second wave with Early Rush,AC/DC,Budgie,Motorhead,Lizzy,Lynyrd Skynyrd,ZZ Top and UFO et al.

Rush's influence on Progressive metal should not be under-estimated.

NWOBHM:Maiden,Saxon,Def leppard,Tygers of pan tang,Diamond Head,Preying Mantis,Girlschool.......

Not to mention where the likes of Cheap trick,Ted Nugent,Rainbow,Whitesnake, and Journey come in.

MikeEnRegalia wrote: To me there are the following stages in the history of Metal: - Thrash Metal: Metallica's ...And Justice For All and Megadeth's Rust In Peace set the roots in the late 80s for a new generation of Thrash Metal bands (Anthrax, Death Angel, ...).

I was a huge fan of Thrash as a teenager in the early 80's and I disagree with this Mike.Anthrax was one of the founding fathers of thrash along with Metallica,Megadeth,Slayer,Exodus and S.O.D.Metallica and Megadeth definitely did not pave the way for them.These bands paved the way for a new generation of thrash bands such as Testament,Nuclear Assualt,Overkill,Brutal Truth,Sacred Reich,Flotsam and Jetsom and the like.

MikeEnRegalia wrote: Tony R wrote: Well the first Judas Priest album was in 1974 (Rocka Rolla) so is really the second wave with Early Rush,AC/DC,Budgie,Motorhead,Lizzy,Lynyrd Skynyrd,ZZ Top and UFO et al. Rush's influence on Progressive metal should not be under-estimated. NWOBHM:Maiden,Saxon,Def leppard,Tygers of pan tang,Diamond Head,Preying Mantis,Girlschool....... Not to mention where the likes of Cheap trick,Ted Nugent,Rainbow,Whitesnake, and Journey come in. I forgot to mention: I cannot list every single band. Do you really think that Rocka Rolla was part of the NWOBHM? Journey is a tough one ... don't know where they fit in. Whitesnake is Blues Rock, Ted Nugent also seems more like Rock to me. And even you forgot some bands, most of all Kiss. Could you post bands that I forget and which aren't properly addressed by my categories, together with the genre that you would associate them with?

No,I'm not suggesting Rock Rolla was part of the NWOBHM.What I feel is that, like any other major musical genre,there was the first wave (of originators and stylistic instigators) followed by the "second wave" in which I include Judas Priest.

The NWOBHM was an 80's phenomena comprised of bands like Maiden (who admit to dabbling with punk in the late 70s) who,backed by "Sounds" music paper (and particularly,Geoff Barton) brought about a rekindling of (mainstream) interest in Heavy metal after the punk onslaught.

In terms of "labelling" as far as I am aware (having been part of the scene since @1972) "Heavy Metal", "Heavy Rock" and "Hard Rock" were pretty much arbitary and interchangeable.

Hence Ted Nugent could be labelled under any of them,although personally I associate Heavy Metal with the Black Sabbath style.
My gut instinct is that Whitesnake,Ted Nugent,Journey and Kiss would come under the totally arbitary and unsatisfactory label of "hard rock".

Any such pigeon-holing is with the benefit of hindsight,I'm not so sure there was the kind of discussion around at the time,that we apply to the progressive rock genres.

Valarius wrote: TheProgtologist wrote: Manowar was NOT a thrash band But they're the kings dammit! They're TRUE METAL!!!

I agree ... how would you define True Metal? I'm not into Manowar at all, but that's really just a matter of personal taste (Manowar is a polarizing band). Tell me how they fit in and who their peers were, and I'll edit True Metal into my post.

I don't feel that Moby Grape or Quicksilver Messenger Service are heavy metal at all; rather they are two of the great psychedelic groups of all time. Moby Grape peddle a kind of sunshine pop-rock akin to Love or The Byrds (if that helps) and Quicksilver are often considered to be like The Grateful Dead as both bands tended to play lengthy improvised jams on stage.

At the time, MC5 and The Stooges tended to be considered 'heavy metal', judging by articles I've read from the era, but now they could be seen more accurately as both extensions of the '60s garage rock boom and precursors to the punk boom of the mid-70s.

Judas Priest aren't really part of the 'FWOHM' in my opinion, although they formed in 1969, they didn't record their first album until 1974, and didn't perfect their sound until 1976- a few years before the 'NWOBHM' but a long time after the 'FWOHM' also. Thus, as Tony R said, they deserve a 'second wave' marker.

Journey are to me nothing like heavy metal; they are a great AOR band but rarely get particularly heavy. The same with Cheap Trick- though a little heavier than Journey, they are far more melodic than your average metal band.

Whitesnake were arguably one of the first of those 'blues rock revival' bands, and could be seen as the forerunners to the likes of Thunder, The Quireboys and Dogs D'Amour.

To your list, I would add a 'pomp rock' category: bands such as Uriah Heep, Kansas, Styx, Queen and Magnum are amongst the biggest selling bands in the world, yet don't easily fit any of the descriptions laid out already. More modern bands that display this style are Muse and The Darkness.

MikeEnRegalia wrote: salmacis wrote: To your list, I would add a 'pomp rock' category: bands such as Uriah Heep, Kansas, Styx, Queen and Magnum are amongst the biggest selling bands in the world, yet don't easily fit any of the descriptions laid out already. More modern bands that display this style are Muse and The Darkness. I think they don't really fit the term "metal", in fact Heep, Kansas and Styx are often referred to as Prog Rock (in this forum). I agree on Judas Priest, should be filed under NWOBHM.

No,Salmacis agrees with me,Mike!

I wonder why everyone seems to overlook Blue Cheer?

They were the founding fathers of both heavy metal and grunge - although I'd agree it's quite hard to fathom through the rampant noise that is "Vincebus Eruptum". To me it's utterly inspired, and the seed for metal and grunge, but many people I've played it to just hear an incompetent psychedelic band with amps pushed up to 11.

Both opinions are right IMO.

The Blues+psychedelia combination was the propellant for heavy metal - the "heavy" bands were the ones who didn't sing about peace and love, and went for dark rather than light sounds.

Hence Hendrix, Cream, Yardbirds, Savoy Brown and Traffic can all be considered major influences on the development of metal.

The most important band, I would suggest (if only for one album) is Spooky Tooth. "Spooky Two" is so obviously an influence on Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin and Judas Priest (who covered a song from this very album - "Better By You, Better Than Me"), that I think of it as a foundation stone in progressive rock music. Even the first Yes album has a similar sound - although I'm not too sure which predates which.

The period 1969-1970 is quite incredible for metal, as heavy blues bands developed the grinding riff structures that we still associate with metal - and the Vertigo label acquired many bands that many retrospectively view as metal; May Blitz, Black Sabbath et al - possibly even Colosseum could be heard as the early part of the first wave.

What typified the sound was the high levels of distortion on the guitars, the "headbanging" riffs, the typically high vocals, which, largely thanks to Ian Gillan would end up as screams, the big drum sound and the wailing guitar solos.

Typically, the music would not enter a major key but more often than not, as the genre progressed, actual key was ambiguous, as the preference for barred "power" chords that left out the third became prevalent in metal music. Thirds tended to be used for effect rather than to establish a major or minor tonality, and the music ended up sounding oddly modal and threatening.

Lyrically, we would not hear many songs about love, instead there were pre-occupations with drug-taking, cult membership and an apparently negative pessimistic view of life. Devotees of the music often say that it's more a realistic view than the lyrics of typical "pop music" recordings.

This fascination with cults and even the occult made a lot of people very worried when metal was in its infancy, and the genre has pretty much existed "underground" or outside of the mainstream until around 1991, when Metallica's self-titled album suddenly made metal hip - and it's never been out of the charts since, especially in the trendier form of "Nu-metal".

Anyway, that's skipping several generations.

I haven't really got time to go any further, as there are work-related things I should be doing... but as a race-through of the birth of metal (1966-1970) - any comments?