thoughts on the Holocaust

I often wonder how hard it is for the surviving descendants to remain " true" given their circumstances. The whole forgiveness issue is remarkeable but I can't help thinking if it has prompted follow on generation individuals to say " ah f&%k it the worlds a mess so I can behave without conscience too like the original perpetrators"

Henry Plainview wrote: You know, I had always wondered about the logistics of deporting that many people to camps. Now I know!

Well, the Einsatzgruppen (split into 4 divisions, about 1000 strong) were responsible for most of the shooting deaths. They would enter Polish, Ukrainian, Russian and Baltic villages, round up the local Jews under the pretense of resettlement. Then with the help of local police and partisans, transport them to execution areas in the surrounding countryside. The Einsatzgruppen would then proceed to systematically kill each Jew, single gunshot, next victim... and so on. At Babi Yar in Ukraine, they killed almost 34,000 in this way in just under two days. This was in 1941-42, and precipitated the need for more pragmatic means of execution. Hence the development of gas vans, and eventually gas chambers. The logistics were relatively simple, because the train lines were pre-existing, and all fares (yes fares) were paid to the German Railway network by the SS. The camps were simply built in areas that could be fed easily from large Ghetto areas of the General Government (Reich name for the Polish region led by Hans Frank) and beyond.


Edited by Any Colour You Like - October 11 2010 at 00:50

one of the saddest things is that nations that have been through a genocide/massive extinction themselves carry out the same measures on other nations...

JJLehto wrote: Any Colour You Like wrote: Henry Plainview wrote:   Any Colour You Like wrote: I knew this was going to turn into a sh*tstorm. I don't see any sh*tstorms. I'll re-phrase that then. I forsee this turning into a sh*tstorm. OH yeah, this is PA. Someone will somehow find someway to make the holocaust into an argument!

So have we done it? Did we manage to turn even a holocaust thread into debate about something?

Still believe the Holocaust could never be repeated, not to the scale of mass murder that ocurred. People are more aware now of the dangers of genocide. If you want to treat yourself check out Holocaust survivor David Olere's art work - incredible and powerfully moving. http://www.google.com.au/images?um=1&hl=en&biw=1259&bih=644&tbs=isch%3A1&sa=1&q=david+olere&aq=f&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=

Can you believe?  God made you breathe...

OK not an original thought, but it did pop into my head.


Edited by Slartibartfast - October 16 2010 at 12:03

The T wrote: The holocaust WAS repeated. Just nobody paid attention. Cambodia was, proportionally, as horrible. But it was a nation against its own people so nobody cared.

Point taken but any loss of life in the ratio of 1 fatality to 8 survivors is proportionally just as heinous.

stonebeard wrote: The T wrote: The holocaust WAS repeated. Just nobody paid attention. Cambodia was, proportionally, as horrible. But it was a nation against its own people so nobody cared. It probably wouldn't be much of a stretch to say it was because they were non-white people, too You don't hear as much about the gypsy killings in the holocaust do you, either? Maybe we've wised up a bit to equality now.

We are more attuned to it when they are people more similar to us culturally. 

Actually the German persecution of Jews was well known before the "final solution".  We turned away a shipload of Jewish refugees.

Slartibartfast wrote: Actually the German persecution of Jews was well known before the "final solution".  We turned away a shipload of Jewish refugees.

True.

American planes was also filming the KZ camps throughout the war. But they did not bomb the gas chambers although they did know about the final solution. Also the mass movement of Jews on the railways and in ships was known to the Allies without them lifting a finger to stop it. The responsibility for Holocaust is not only resting on the Nazis shoulders. It could had been seriously disrupted or even stopped if there was a will to stop it. Hence today's Israel's "everyone's against us" attitude.