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Topic ClosedAnnouncing the Prog-Metal split

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MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 17:56
Originally posted by darqdean darqdean wrote:

Originally posted by sinkadotentree sinkadotentree wrote:

Very interesting with ANATHEMA, IN THE WOODS.. and THE GATHERING in Post Metal.
if you look at the direction they all took with their later albums it's not so surprising.


We decided to take "Experimental" a little bit more literal than it is being used in "Experimental/Post-Rock" ... like you already mentioned in a later post the new category "Experimental/Post-Metal" will actually be a combination of Experimental Prog Metal and Post Metal. One guideline though is that if bands are too quirky and technical they go to "Tech/Extreme" instead. A good example of an Experimental Prog Metal band would be Maudlin of the Well. They could also be called Avant-Prog Metal, but since they're relatively calm and not extremely technical, they go to Experimental. And style-wise they really go well with the Post Metal stuff (Kayo Dot being the *obvious* example).

The Gathering ... they're a difficult case, since all their albums are so different from each other. In that case I think it's best to look at their masterpieces - in that case: How to Measure a Planet?. And that album is a really good example of a very calm type of experimentality. I strongly recommend to check out this sample: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pt7gtWHWTs Big%20smile
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 17:56
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

^ ^ exactly Ivan...  for me there are certains elements in PM that I do dislike intensely, yet never wanted to write off the whole sub as it was here.. this way is easier for people like me to get a better idea of the differences that were  within  the larger Progressive Metal umbrella.


Looking forward to Agalloch being my first foray into exp/post metal...Clap

though I'm not sure what I may find within  tech/extreme LOL but that is the fun isn't it... exploring.
 
Agalloch is always a good introduction to whatever kind of music you haven't been introduced to (since they don't really fall into any particular category), but you should learn to understand why the vocals are exactly the way they are performed in Agalloch's music, as opposed to being traditional rock'n'roll vocals.
 
By the way, have you and Raffaella exposed yourselves to the Italian atmospheric Death Metal band Novembre? Their newest album will be the best, as my ability to see the future suggests me. Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 17:58
Meshuggah: Melody-is-overrated Metal
Spiral Architect: And-you-thought-Dream-Theater-w**ked-off Metal
Dragonforce: Head-asplode Metal
 
Big%20smile
 
Very good decision.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 17:59
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

^ ^ exactly Ivan...  for me there are certains elements in PM that I do dislike intensely, yet never wanted to write off the whole sub as it was here.. this way is easier for people like me to get a better idea of the differences that were  within  the larger Progressive Metal umbrella.


Looking forward to Agalloch being my first foray into exp/post metal...Clap

though I'm not sure what I may find within  tech/extreme LOL but that is the fun isn't it... exploring.

I thought you already had The Gathering's Manylion?

I must admit, I was rather shocked to find that the Experimental/Post- metal section's top album list was completely dominated by Anathema.


Edited by sleeper - October 22 2007 at 18:00
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:00
Originally posted by stonebeard stonebeard wrote:

Meshuggah: Melody-is-overrated Metal
Spiral Architect: And-you-thought-Dream-Theater-w**ked-off Metal
Dragonforce: Head-asplode Metal
 
Big%20smile
 
Very good decision.
 
Are Dragonforce on the site too now? I haven't observed the additions for a few months but I've learned to expect the unexpected.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:01
Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

^ ^ exactly Ivan...  for me there are certains elements in PM that I do dislike intensely, yet never wanted to write off the whole sub as it was here.. this way is easier for people like me to get a better idea of the differences that were  within  the larger Progressive Metal umbrella.


Looking forward to Agalloch being my first foray into exp/post metal...Clap

though I'm not sure what I may find within  tech/extreme LOL but that is the fun isn't it... exploring.
 
Agalloch is always a good introduction to whatever kind of music you haven't been introduced to (since they don't really fall into any particular category), but you should learn to understand why the vocals are exactly the way they are performed in Agalloch's music, as opposed to being traditional rock'n'roll vocals.
 
By the way, have you and Raffaella exposed yourselves to the Italian atmospheric Death Metal band Novembre? Their newest album will be the best, as my ability to see the future suggests me. Wink


I've heard some stuff from Agalloch  via samples and I had to say I really did like it... a lot..... they are first up on my next CD binge

hahhahaha...  I trust that vision.  Haven't heard them... I'll see what I can dig up by them.  Do they growl in Italian.. .if so... oh brother... I am SO there LOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:01
Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by stonebeard stonebeard wrote:

Meshuggah: Melody-is-overrated Metal
Spiral Architect: And-you-thought-Dream-Theater-w**ked-off Metal
Dragonforce: Head-asplode Metal
 
Big%20smile
 
Very good decision.
 
Are Dragonforce on the site too now? I haven't observed the additions for a few months but I've learned to expect the unexpected.
 
No, but I don't really know why they're not. I'm not complaining though. Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:01
Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by jikai55 jikai55 wrote:

Also, I was wondering about Subterranean Masquerade. They, quite unfortunatly, don't seem to belong anywhere.
 
It's probably going to either Avant-Garde Prog Metal or Experimental Metal, I wasn't involved in this process so I have no idea what the difference between those two is (Experimental Metal could mean anything).


I think they're technical (and extreme) enough to go to Avant-Garde Prog Metal. Please note that the names of the new sub genres might be tweaked a little bit ... in order to judge which band goes where you always have to see the top level genre in conjunction with the style. So the top critera for the second genre are "technical" and "extreme".

We'll soon have the definitions online ... and I think in a week or so we'll have example band/album lists for each of them.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:03
Originally posted by stonebeard stonebeard wrote:

Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by stonebeard stonebeard wrote:

Meshuggah: Melody-is-overrated Metal
Spiral Architect: And-you-thought-Dream-Theater-w**ked-off Metal
Dragonforce: Head-asplode Metal
 
Big%20smile
 
Very good decision.
 
Are Dragonforce on the site too now? I haven't observed the additions for a few months but I've learned to expect the unexpected.
 
No, but I don't really know why they're not. I'm not complaining though. Wink
 
Aren't you? You should be. Angry
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:04
Originally posted by sleeper sleeper wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

^ ^ exactly Ivan...  for me there are certains elements in PM that I do dislike intensely, yet never wanted to write off the whole sub as it was here.. this way is easier for people like me to get a better idea of the differences that were  within  the larger Progressive Metal umbrella.


Looking forward to Agalloch being my first foray into exp/post metal...Clap

though I'm not sure what I may find within  tech/extreme LOL but that is the fun isn't it... exploring.

I thought you already had The Gathering's Manylion?

I must admit, I was rather shocked to find that the Experimental/Post- metal section's top album list was completely dominated by Anathema.


Raff brought it.... and I did like it.... I guess it technically isn't wasn't my first however hahhah.......

this would be my first foray into it.... spending MY hard earned jack hahhahah Wink 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:08
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

^ ^ exactly Ivan...  for me there are certains elements in PM that I do dislike intensely, yet never wanted to write off the whole sub as it was here.. this way is easier for people like me to get a better idea of the differences that were  within  the larger Progressive Metal umbrella.


Looking forward to Agalloch being my first foray into exp/post metal...Clap

though I'm not sure what I may find within  tech/extreme LOL but that is the fun isn't it... exploring.
 
Agalloch is always a good introduction to whatever kind of music you haven't been introduced to (since they don't really fall into any particular category), but you should learn to understand why the vocals are exactly the way they are performed in Agalloch's music, as opposed to being traditional rock'n'roll vocals.
 
By the way, have you and Raffaella exposed yourselves to the Italian atmospheric Death Metal band Novembre? Their newest album will be the best, as my ability to see the future suggests me. Wink


I've heard some stuff from Agalloch  via samples and I had to say I really did like it... a lot..... they are first up on my next CD binge

hahhahaha...  I trust that vision.  Haven't heard them... I'll see what I can dig up by them.  Do they growl in Italian.. .if so... oh brother... I am SO there LOL
 
Great to hear that, the first thing one should understand before getting into Agalloch is that the "harsh" vocals do not express the commonly anticipated aggression they tend to be associated with.
 
Do Novembre growl in Italian? I'm not sure about the growling part, but the singer does alternate between singing in his native language and Italian (usually English dominates, but it is so to a lesser extent on the latest albums which are also their best). Personally I speak neither language very well (my writing skills in English are good thanks to the internet) and I often have trouble concluding which language Carmelo is singing in at a given instant. His voice is a bit unclear, nasal, but I like it.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:10
thanks for the heads up Ivan... I'll hunt up some samples... I'm feeling sort of experimentative tonight.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:10
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by jikai55 jikai55 wrote:

Also, I was wondering about Subterranean Masquerade. They, quite unfortunatly, don't seem to belong anywhere.
 
It's probably going to either Avant-Garde Prog Metal or Experimental Metal, I wasn't involved in this process so I have no idea what the difference between those two is (Experimental Metal could mean anything).


I think they're technical (and extreme) enough to go to Avant-Garde Prog Metal. Please note that the names of the new sub genres might be tweaked a little bit ... in order to judge which band goes where you always have to see the top level genre in conjunction with the style. So the top critera for the second genre are "technical" and "extreme".

We'll soon have the definitions online ... and I think in a week or so we'll have example band/album lists for each of them.
 
So I understand that even though the work has been finished and they will be here soon, improvement and suggestions could be used for additional accuracy? If that's so, I guess it could make sense for me to stick around the forums for the next few weeks for discussions, unless you mind of course (which I guess I have given sufficient reasons for in the past).
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:11
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

The Gathering ... they're a difficult case, since all their albums are so different from each other. In that case I think it's best to look at their masterpieces - in that case: How to Measure a Planet?. And that album is a really good example of a very calm type of experimentality. I strongly recommend to check out this sample: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pt7gtWHWTs Big%20smile
I was referring specifically to Souvenirs which pushed the experimentation of How To Measure A Planet? a little further, but either are valid Approve, though I think they'd practically left the world of metal by then.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:11
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

thanks for the heads up Ivan... I'll hunt up some samples... I'm feeling sort of experimentative tonight.
 
The ones on the site should be right up your alley, Micky. I am sure of it, because I sent them myself. Wink Heheh. One could say they are softer than some of their other songs (which aren't particularly messy or aggressive, as I tend to see it).
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:13
Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

thanks for the heads up Ivan... I'll hunt up some samples... I'm feeling sort of experimentative tonight.
 
The ones on the site should be right up your alley, Micky. I am sure of it, because I sent them myself. Wink Heheh. One could say they are softer than some of their other songs (which aren't particularly messy or aggressive, as I tend to see it).


heading that way....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:19
Originally posted by darqdean darqdean wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

The Gathering ... they're a difficult case, since all their albums are so different from each other. In that case I think it's best to look at their masterpieces - in that case: How to Measure a Planet?. And that album is a really good example of a very calm type of experimentality. I strongly recommend to check out this sample: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pt7gtWHWTs Big%20smile
I was referring specifically to Souvenirs which pushed the experimentation of How To Measure A Planet? a little further, but either are valid Approve, though I think they'd practically left the world of metal by then.


I think they left them it Souvenirs, but How to Measure a Planet? still has a lot of metal ... stoner metal to be precise. I love that album ... but you have to be in the right mood to enjoy it.


Edited by MikeEnRegalia - October 22 2007 at 18:20
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:23
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by darqdean darqdean wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

The Gathering ... they're a difficult case, since all their albums are so different from each other. In that case I think it's best to look at their masterpieces - in that case: How to Measure a Planet?. And that album is a really good example of a very calm type of experimentality. I strongly recommend to check out this sample: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pt7gtWHWTs Big%20smile
I was referring specifically to Souvenirs which pushed the experimentation of How To Measure A Planet? a little further, but either are valid Approve, though I think they'd practically left the world of metal by then.


I think they left them it Souvenirs, but How to Measure a Planet? still has a lot of metal ... stoner metal to be precise. I love that album ... but you have to be in the right mood to enjoy it.
 
Do you have to be stoned to appreciate it? Geek I guess that's why I never got into The Gathering that much. Sleepy
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:28
^ I was never stoned, so I can't comment.Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 22 2007 at 18:29
Originally posted by Trickster F. Trickster F. wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by darqdean darqdean wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

The Gathering ... they're a difficult case, since all their albums are so different from each other. In that case I think it's best to look at their masterpieces - in that case: How to Measure a Planet?. And that album is a really good example of a very calm type of experimentality. I strongly recommend to check out this sample: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pt7gtWHWTs Big%20smile
I was referring specifically to Souvenirs which pushed the experimentation of How To Measure A Planet? a little further, but either are valid Approve, though I think they'd practically left the world of metal by then.


I think they left them it Souvenirs, but How to Measure a Planet? still has a lot of metal ... stoner metal to be precise. I love that album ... but you have to be in the right mood to enjoy it.
 
Do you have to be stoned to appreciate it? Geek I guess that's why I never got into The Gathering that much. Sleepy
With Krys Rygg duetting on Souvenirs you do surprise me.Shocked
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