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Cheesecakemouse 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 05 2006
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 Topic: Should Iron Maiden have been put on the A
Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:19 |
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I've never heard any of their music to judge how much prog they are, but I know its annoyed a lot. I'm annoyed that they are mentioned and yet Split Enz still isn't - it feels like a slap in the face when I saw I.M. on the archives this morning. There is also still the question of Miles Davis and Led Zep as well. But I'll stop my whining and ask what are people's views on them being included. My view is if they are prog then they are prog, like 'em or not.
Edited by Cheesecakemouse - October 03 2006 at 04:23
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MikeEnRegalia
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Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
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Points: 21138
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:28 |
If Metallica also get added: yes. Otherwise: no. I was initially against the addition of bands like Iron Maiden. Now that they're here it would be very inconsistent to not add bands like Metallica, who - among some blatantly non-prog albums - released some fine & innovative albums which are IMO much more prog related than anything Iron Maiden ever did. But that's just my personal opinion. 
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glass house
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Joined: June 16 2005
Location: Netherlands
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:32 |
I never thought as them being prog-related. I enjoy their music.
Even in prog-related.......................NO.
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riversdancing
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 31 2005
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:35 |
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I really do not care. I was against some not-really-prog band such as Death or Nightingale, although I love their music, but as a metalhead I can understand why the core here was against them.
Now I do not say anything against of for Maiden, if someone feel disturbed, simply skip the reviews and threads. I also do not understand why the proglovers can talk about other bands with so much hatred. Probably they should give up their intolerant behaviour and narrowmindedness and leave their caves.
Reflecting to a post in another thread, Maiden is not the 13 year old teens music. I am 29 myself, but the real maiden fans are even older, in their mid-30s (the road to baldness).
Now playing: Seventh Son of the Seventh Son
Edited by riversdancing - October 03 2006 at 04:36
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R o V e R
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Joined: July 13 2005
Location: India
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:35 |
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its all started when they added
Queen, deep purple, and what not
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mystic fred
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:36 |
Maiden influenced many modern bands all across the rock spectrum - including Prog metal bands especially Dream Theater. Their inclusion as Prog related is fully valid and justified IMO.  Heavy rock and Metal is an integral part of the whole rock scene, not on a separate planet. There are groups on here whose inclusion i don't approve of, but you never hear me complain about them.
Edited by mystic fred - October 03 2006 at 04:43
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Easy Livin
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Joined: February 21 2004
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:38 |
Please remember that they have been added to the prog related section, which means they are not classified as prog.
For information, the addition of Iron Maiden was sanctioned only after a lot of detailed discussion in by the site's collaborators. This does not imply that all were in favour of course.
Also note that this will be the last new thread to discuss the addition of IM.
Oh and keep it civil, no throwing of toys out of the pram please.
Edited by Easy Livin - October 03 2006 at 04:41
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R o V e R
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Joined: July 13 2005
Location: India
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:41 |
cool
Edited by R o V e R - October 03 2006 at 04:57
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Asphalt
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:50 |
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actually, this raises another itneresting question: how related to prog an artist has to be to be considered Prog Related? I mean, are we talking about "wants-to-be-prog-but-doesn't-quite-make-it" bands or "wanted-to-make-good-music-and-ended-up-making-prog-without-knowing-themselves" bands?
i.e. Death never meant to be categorized as progressive, they just wanted to sing some innovative death and technical metal; same with some other bands within the prog related spectrum
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Australian
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:57 |
They have already been added, there's nothing you can do, just get over it.
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Bilek
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 05:18 |
 MikeEnRegalia wrote:
If Metallica also get added: yes. Otherwise: no.
I was initially against the addition of bands like Iron Maiden. Now that they're here it would be very inconsistent to not add bands like Metallica, who - among some blatantly non-prog albums - released some fine & innovative albums which are IMO much more prog related than anything Iron Maiden ever did.
But that's just my personal opinion.
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I agree with you to a great extent. Metallica produced IMHO the greatest prog-metal albums of all times: Master of Puppets and ...and Justice for All. Ride the Lightning and black album are also worthy mentions. I really don't see why people keep on classifying them as thrash metal ... yet, Iron Maiden's Seventh Son of a Seventh Son is no less prog than those. Powerslave is also fine. I doubt about the others, they never admitted themselves as "prog" in the first place (though they covered a bunch of prog songs, notably that of Nektar) besides, they are known as a key innovator of NWoBHM...
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Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 05:55 |
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^ sorry, but I beg to differ:
1. I wouldn't call Master of Puppets a prog-metal album. It's simply not a part of that genre. It's a progressive Thrash Metal album - Metallica defined the genre together with bands like Slayer and Megadeth.
2. Seventh Son is IMO not even a prog-related album. The eponymous song *is* progressive, but most of the other songs are typical Maiden songs. Very simple chord structures and rhythms, and the occasional rhythm and/or key changes are commonplace even in AOR ... they're not adventurous enough to qualify as prog.
But that's just my opinion!
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Tony R
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 05:59 |
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but...they have been added as Prog-Related...which..um...isnt Prog...if some of their songs "are" Prog then they quite obviously are prog-related..
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:01 |
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NutterAlert
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:07 |
I have always disliked Iron Maiden's style of music. However, I have to say, I do like their new album.
So to answer the question...I don't know
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Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005
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Bilek
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Joined: July 05 2005
Location: Turkey
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:32 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
^ sorry, but I beg to differ:
1. I wouldn't call Master of Puppets a prog-metal album. It's simply not a part of that genre. It's a progressive Thrash Metal album - Metallica defined the genre together with bands like Slayer and Megadeth.
2. Seventh Son is IMO not even a prog-related album. The eponymous song *is* progressive, but most of the other songs are typical Maiden songs. Very simple chord structures and rhythms, and the occasional rhythm and/or key changes are commonplace even in AOR ... they're not adventurous enough to qualify as prog.
But that's just my opinion!
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this is the first time I hear a genre called "progressive thrash metal"!!!! besides, Slayer and Megadeth's music are way too heavier than Metallica's. Honestly, I couldn't stand listening to a Slayer album all the way through, and even Megadeth was a bit hard for me (when I was into all kinds of heavy music!). I really wonder where the heck is the progressive element in Slayer's music...
as for 7th Son, Moonchild's synth intro, Infinite Dreams' melody, and The Prophecy's beautiful acoustic guitar outro give me the feeling that only prog gives. (I haven't listened to the album for ages, though) Can I play with Madness, The Evil That Men Do and Only the Good Die young are indeed typical Maiden songs (NWoBHM), which I'd classify as fillers in this instance (Maiden lovers, just don't bash me!) The Clairvoyant is a bit above these tracks.
taking the title track's length, the "prog percentage" of this album must be higher than 25%, mind you!
what the heck, I'm not even a Maiden fan anymore 
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Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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Tony R
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: July 16 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 11979
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:41 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
Tony R wrote:
but...they have been added as Prog-Related...which..um...isnt Prog...if some of their songs "are" Prog then they quite obviously are prog-related.. |
If 25% of an album is prog and the rest isn't, then ... it's a tough choice whether I want to call it prog -or prog-related. |
I know what you are saying and from a purist point of view you are probably correct but this is Prog-Related we are talking about and what is Prog-Related here to do?
...if there is a chance that Iron Maiden listeners will make the jump from the proggier IM sings to say prog-Metal or hard-edged bands like Rush or Porcupine Tree and from their to Classic Prog then why not include them? That is what the Prog-Related category is supposed to be a stepping stone to real Prog.
I think that Iron Maiden,from that point of view,are the epitome of Prog-Related along with bands like Magnum.
Edited by Tony R - October 03 2006 at 06:43
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KeyserSoze
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:57 |
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Ok, now we daily get 20 reviews of Iron Maiden albums. Who's next? U2 or Faith No More? They influenced many bands too...
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salmacis
Forum Senior Member
Content Addition
Joined: April 10 2005
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Points: 3928
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 08:31 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
If Metallica also get added: yes. Otherwise: no.
I was initially against the addition of bands like Iron Maiden. Now that they're here it would be very inconsistent to not add bands like Metallica, who - among some blatantly non-prog albums - released some fine & innovative albums which are IMO much more prog related than anything Iron Maiden ever did.
But that's just my personal opinion.
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This is what I was worried about- the 'if band X are here band Y should be' kind of thing. IMO, both Maiden and Metallica had prog influences in their music but I wouldn't necessarily have expected to see either on a prog website. I'm not going to start a mutiny about it, and I've been able to see the prog in Maiden's output for years, but it has possibly opened the floodgates a bit TOO wide. Maiden aren't too shocking an addition (arguably Triumph, ELO and Fairport Convention are less valid inclusions) but I worry that now there'll be cries to get no end of other metal bands on the site...
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Padraic
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 08:45 |
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If I had my way, Iron Maiden would not be here for the simple reason that I would ditch the entire prog-related section altogether. However, in another thread The Progtologist pointed out, and correctly so, that the existence of prog-related is a direct request or desire of the site's owners. It is important to remember that ultimately this is their site and it will be run in the manner that they see fit. So, given that prog-related is here to stay, I do believe Iron Maiden is prog-related or a proto-prog metal, if you will, having exerted enormous influence on a lot of PM bands.
I am sort of worried that we are on a slippery slope here, however. Time will tell.
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Should Iron Maiden have been put on the A
