Did Punk really kill prog all that much?

Actually, punk was more of a British phenomena than an American one. When American's think of 1977, they think of Saturday Night Fever. When Brits think of 1977, they think of punk. American 1970s nostalgia is wrapped up in disco and actually the punk that made it by 1978-9 was Talking Heads, Blondie and Gary Numan, which was disco punk or new wave. Since the major prog acts relied on America for their millions of dollars, this must have been difficult for them.  My heart bleeds. Even Pink Floyd went disco with The Wall, which I hated when I first heard it. Scissors Sisters do a disco rendition of Comfortably Numb, which is a celebration of the drugs in dance culture.

A big part of the late 1970s was power pop, at which Genesis excelled and the endless forum notes on that pro and con go on and on. I have a whole theory about power pops relation to prog and how prog created the genre that replaced it, but that's another story.

I thought the 80's lineup of Crimson was excellent. Adrian Belew brought a new level of passion and energy to their live performances, and was an excellent guitarist. And Levin/Bruford are probably one of the most powerful rythm sections ever. They adopted the new wave sound and made it progressive. Maybe their albums weren't perfect in the 80's, but they were one of Crimson's most powerful live lineups.

Anyway, I should probably post something on-topic.

Punk rock was a musical movement against prog, but you can't blame it for the downfall of prog. Prog was already going downhill when punk started.

I love punk, and I think it was probably one of the best things that could have happened to music at that time.

Actually, I tend to think that Punk and Progressive mutated together into what became New Wave.  I remember seeing Peter Gabriel's first North American show in New Jersey after he left Genesis.  The opening act was none other than Television, a New York based Punk Band that was to evolve into a more new wave variation.  They were not well received and continued to play through 45 minutes of booing, cat calling, and a more than occaisional piece of projected fruit.

The lead singer would periodically stop, sneer at the audience, and then continue to play.  To my utter dismay, I found that Gabriel selected them to play as the opener.  But for me, this was the sign of the end.  I think Prog became uncomfortable with itself, in that, musicians like Gabriel, Collins, and others found the incessant need to branch elsewhere in more conventional realms, sensing a sort of pretentiousness.  Gabriel was a little more honest about his evolution whereas Collins and Genesis just plain sold out.

Nevertheless, modern prog bands are much more comfortable with their genre - bands like the flower kings, universe zero, etc.

You also have to add in to the fact, that the commercial music business during the late 60's and through most of the 70's had little clue how to manage and market the incredibly diverse (both good and bad) amounts of music being put forth in the public domain.  By the end of the 70's and the early 80's, record companies had learned how to strangle the freedom and creativity of the music community.  But alas, nature will find a way.  Likewise, the internet, cheap recording and distribution methods CD's, IPOD's, downloadable music has crashed down the corporate walls and provided a way for good music to disseminate without the control of corporate america.

That's why Prog has begun to flourish in the late 90's to the present.

Early prog used to be quite punk in many ways. Not lyrically of course, but I remember growing really f**king tired of universalism and cheesy mythology based epics which were REALLY allegories for something MUCH deeper... music needed a shot of realism straight to the face and the punks were just what we needed. They didn't 'steal' prog fans per se, simply gave them an outlet. For instance, the man we used to all know as Johnny Rotten, the most visible symbol of contempt for bands such as ELP, Yes, and other so-called dinonsaurs was secretly a fan of Captain Beefheart, Can, and Van Der Graf Generator. Absurd? Not quite. I was living in pretty much the same reality at the time. Prog was intended to EVOLVE. But we chose not to, and so we paid the price. And yes, we became pretentious and in many ways, we still are. We bought into the tights and silly epics and frilly shirts and spiritual meanderings and awful, BLOODY awful lyrics while forgetting it was all intended as a little absurdity to keep it fun. Much of it was left over from the Mods (ironic as hell, considering how often they're considered the 60s version of punk) and the Hippies (Also ironic, considering that the single most talented/successful psychedelic/WHATEVER band grew bored with it after only a year...).

In summary, on an artistic and perhaps spiritual level, we lost our way. The punks were simply pointing out the obvious.

P.S. the Gabriel incarnation of Genesis was in my view the perfect model for a prog band. Their musical compositions were beautiful, sharp, and dramatic. They never noodled to kill space. Their lyrics were usually playful and absurd. Noone ever faked an epiphany out of 'The Return of the Giant Hogweed'. It was simply beautiful music with simple yet fascinating lyrics. And don't you dare tell me everyone gets something different out of music. If ten people interpret one song differently, that means the song was either a) so badly botched that the meaning waas lost in the songwriting process or b) that writer is so incredible lazy that he can't be bothered to write a song about something. Then again, prog was never meant to be about the lyrics...

Actually, I tend to think that Punk and Progressive mutated together into what became New Wave.  >>

I really agree what you say and have to say here.  By putting the synthesizer at the forefront of the ensemble, prog created the new wave aesthetic; punk, disco and prog kind of merged into new wave and Genesis really was able to take advantage of this.