James Lee wrote: From what I understand, it's far better to be greedy and selfish than lazy. In America, you can be a kitten-eating cokehead rapist racist, as long as you're succesfully ambitious. How dare those left-wing slackers whine about going hungry and homeless when everyone has an equal chance to disregard common decency in the name of business acumen!

Good one James!!!

I never said that being jobless and receiving dole/pogey was easy. The fact is that unemployment insurance money although not high cash , is normally  temporary - until you find a new job. A lot of people , however seem content on receiving that , and then go work on the black market making a full wage (but not taxed) on top of the allowance money, since the trade unions are protecting them via the socialist party.

Also as I talk of professional jobless carreerists, I also encompass the ones refusing to work for a living (I could still agree to that under special conditions) but also refusing to help out society when it does need a hand (ie: the tasks I mentionned before). If you know jobless persons and ask them to be at your home so the plumber to repair the sink can get in, some of those guys pretend that they have dozens of important things to do just that precise day. Ever noticed how the willingly jobless are the busiest persons you know but never seem to do anything?!? Talk about one-way solidarity!!!  Does society owe a living to those kind?

I, as a worker , sometimes  really think I am fool to work my ass off and do everything to make sure employers would want to hire me.

 

Actually the rich pay upwards around 70% of the taxes here in the USA. I see no point in ever taxing anyone over 40% just because their income is higher than someone elses. I realize there are ways to buck the system and many rich people report much less than what they made in tax writeoffs and such...but while this could be looked down upon....it is a blessing to the struggling entrepeneur who is trying to get his business off the ground.

I see no reason to punish success and reward failure...and that is liberalism and leftism in a nutshell....just doesn't make sense to me.

Garion81 wrote: gdub411 wrote: Actually the rich pay upwards around 70% of the taxes here in the USA. I see no point in ever taxing anyone over 40% just because their income is higher than someone elses. I realize there are ways to buck the system and many rich people report much less than what they made in tax writeoffs and such...but while this could be looked down upon....it is a blessing to the struggling entrepeneur who is trying to get his business off the ground. I see no reason to punish success and reward failure...and that is liberalism and leftism in a nutshell....just doesn't make sense to me.   I agree with most of that except there could be a leaner version of taxes on the up and coming guy.  But it is not just about that GDUB,  It is about services that government provides and is responsible for.  Your company uses the roads more than my company does.  I think higher taxes are justified to keep the roads in shape. (Very simple example I know but it illustrates the point).  Why should the average taxpayer who does not use the roads as much pay as much as your company?  Who benefits the most for the roads?  Any tax liability is just passed on to the consumer so the company itself really feels no loss. So is the company really penalized or is just perceived that way?

well that would be taxation without representation...wouldn't it? Actually trucking companies pay hefty amount of uber dollars on our roadway systems. Ask any trucker that. Try going across state lines when they get you on that scale....BIG fees are paid out to the states for that. California is notorious for that as well as New York and Ohio. In Illinios, it costs truckers quite a bit of money to use the tollway system here. Trucking companies are literally nickeled and dimed to death going from state to state....funny thing is....where would our economy be without the trucking companies?....so don't heft all the responsibilities on UPS....there is a reason why Clinton brought in arbitrators to settle the strike back in 97....most companies don't warrant the presidents attention.

and the simple fact is the rich still pay 70% of the taxes here in the USA....so obviously they are doing their part in the roads of america...in fact...70% of it.

gdub411 wrote: Actually the rich pay upwards around 70% of the taxes here in the USA. I see no point in ever taxing anyone over 40% just because their income is higher than someone elses. I realize there are ways to buck the system and many rich people report much less than what they made in tax writeoffs and such...but while this could be looked down upon....it is a blessing to the struggling entrepeneur who is trying to get his business off the ground. I see no reason to punish success and reward failure...and that is liberalism and leftism in a nutshell....just doesn't make sense to me.

Really now? I would like to see where those figures come
from? Write offs are a blessing? I suppose that if you
are honest, and have a great product or service to offer
they are. (see "ethical") The social system in The USA
is exploited, I agree.
But, "Punish sucess and reward a failure" I think not.

Garion81 wrote:   George Carlin once said there are only three classses: 1. The Rich: Do no work, control most of the money and pay the least taxes 2. The Working Class:  Do all the work, pay most of the taxes and control a lot less money 3. The Poor: They are there to scare the hell out of the Working Class.

Hah, funny :)

I believe the rich should be taxed even more:) Not as extreme as Sweden or any Scandinavian countries, but it should be more than what the US has now. They need to pay up Muhahahhahahahah :)

Hah, I know I was just joking on that, that really made my day.

Anyways, I know some of the rich really works hard, but I believe they should contribute more to society because of their high status. Even with taxes, multi-millionaires and billionaires still can get their Gucci bags and their Jaguars and their Mansions, but however we do need money for other people, right? I partially believe that people should earn their money, but I do not wish for a man to die because he does not have enough money to pay for a ripoff medicalbill.

Well...Socialism in New Zealand.

The unemployment benefit is higher than minimum wage - unfair for those who slog their guts out earning peanuts.
The new education system rewards stupidity and penalises original thought (perhaps its intention).
Our native people (Maori) are given extra rights which they do not deserve...they're hardly downtrodden - what happened to equality?!

My compass score was fairly right-wing, but to say I'm conservative is perhaps not the best description. I just wish for a country where everyone has equal rights, someone can work hard and carve out their own niche without having a whining communist activist breathing down their neck claiming they're a menace to society. I can't tell you where it lies on the compass!

Oh, they keep very busy, if that's what you mean...the sheer time spent on the phone, in meetings, on planes, et cetera, must really fill up the hours. It's probably very difficult despite being surrounded by every luxury and convenience money can buy, in addition to having a number of people at your beck and call, attending to your every whim at any hour of the day. I don't know how wealthy people have the strength to carry on.

Then there are all those slackers who have to go to the same job for 10-16 hours a day, and also try to fit in all the other things (sleeping, eating, family, etc) during the remaining hours, on his/her own and on a budget...well, you see my point. Hard to be too sympathetic, unless you're seriously into the devil's advocate role.

Rob The Good wrote: Oh another thing: A short while ago our Govt decided to push through a "Civil Union" bill which made gay marriage (in all but name) legal & recognised by the state. The Govt, being an elected body supposedly representing the will of the people, decided to do a big poll to see what the people of NZ thought about it. The result was: over 60% of the country DID NOT want it! Of course, Nanny State decides to shove it through anyway, because they're so fashionably left wing they know what's good for us! Who the **** do they think they are?! Sorry...Angry young man on the loose!

Good call! Personally, I'm for gay marriage, but if the people are against it, so be it. Thats democracy, is it not? (by the way, i don't think the government should be involved with marriage in the first place from a separatiion of church standpoint, but i'm not sure that really applies in many other countries outside the US).

re james: I'm not trying to say that its burdensome to be rich, I'm just saying that they work very hard, crunch lots of numbers, and make a lot of difficult decisions on a daily basis. Its a lot of responsibility to be running that company that's worth millions of dollars and being constantly in the public spotlight.

James....Bill Gates started out by working out of his own garage...if it is so easy to be rich than why aren't we ALL rich. Bill Gates worked his arse to reach the point where he is at now...he has a right to enjoy the fruits of his labour.

I , myself, being the lazy person I am, is exactly where he should be....about $50,000/year.