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Topic ClosedReal 5 star albums

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 11:25

It is time for a revolutionary act. We take out all the stars and every reviewer should rate the album again.

Secondly new album can be reviewed after tehir release but can be rated at least a half year after their release.
I have noted the first reviews of albums always are 5 stars. People are so relieved that their favorite band finally released another album, that they give a 5 star just to express their gratitude. This high peak lowers slowly through time with all less positive reviews later and the album would end up at about 4.20.

REVOLUTION!

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 11:51

Top albums cannot be limited to 5... There are far more "essential" albums, in every sense of the word...

As for a quick top 10, I may list:

In the Court of the Crimson King
CttE: Yes
Foxtrot (not SEbtP): Genesis
Thick as a Brick : Jethro Tull
666: Aphrodite's Child
Pawn Hearts : VdGG
Hot Rats: Frank Zappa
Six Wives : Wakeman
Phaedra: Tangerine Dream
Brain Salad Surgery : ELP

As I said, it depends on many factors, and both the bands, and the albums may vary from time to time. For me, there can be a top 100 list, for instance, and absolutely different from progarchives list (free from "most" prog-metal and neo-prog s**t, that is to say!)
And the top 10 list above not even includes my personal favorites: these are the "historically important" ones, of course also worthy in musical sense...

Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 12:05

I think many ratings here get too subjective.  Obviously subjectivity drives one's opinions, but perhaps one may go over the top in this fashion.  It's gotten to the point that I pass over reviews (usually) that have five stars.  A few examples of my own subjective faults:

 

When Misplaced Childhood came out, I was hugely emotionally attached to it since it somewhat mirrored what was going on with myself at the time.  It's the only cassette I played for a few months.  I was extolling its virtues to everyone within earshot, only to have odd glances returned to me.  Hearing it many years later with my head in a different place, it seems to be nothing special to me at all anymore.  Back then, all the rough spots in the recording were obscured by my emotional response to the lyrics.  The entire theme seems somewhat silly to me now.

 

The first prog album I owned was Nursery Cryme.  It opened the door to this genre.  Because of this, I've always loved this album, even though it has its rough moments and the production leaves a lot to be desired.  To give it a five star rating would be misleading to others since I have an affinity to it mainly because of timing, but my urge would still be to overrate it.

Gentle Giant's Octopus.  The only album at present I would give five stars to.  I was introduced to this way back when I was looking for some challenging music.  This fit the bill and then some.  This to me is perfection.  That being said, I can understand why some would not find it appealing at all, and a five star review might not be true to its worth (but I still think it's perfect

).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that an equal amount of subjectivity and objectivity should be employed.  Unfortunately, many reviews don't seem to have much objectivity at all.

To me, an example of a fantastic review was done by BiGi about a month ago for A Trick of the Tail.  Opinion strongly supported by fact.  Just reading that review caused me to recognize great elements that I hadn't considered before.  And this is an album I've heard hundreds of times.  Every subjective comment is supported by why the song works, why certain moments are so beautiful, etc.

 

Anyway my two cents worth....

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 12:19

I'll give fivers for:

ANEKDOTEN "From Within" and "Gravity"

BILL BRUFORD, EDDIE GOMES and RALPH TOWNER "If Summer Had It's Ghosts"

HAWKWIND "Space Ritual"

KING CRIMSON "The Night Watch"

RUSH "Exit...Stage Left"

THE SPACIOUS MIND "Cosmic Minds at Play"

...

Ok, CtTE also.

 

"Mama's little rater"

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 13:55
This is a bit silly topic, because it is always a question of opinions and tastes only and they vary from time to time. For me, a five star album is something that I wouldn't want to live without... and that may change, too...

Of the albums that I have listened frequently enough, I would give five stars to:

Gentle Giant: Free Hand
Yes: Close To The Edge
Gentle Giant: Acquiring The Taste
Stravinsky: Rite Of Spring (Best versions are by Ozawa, Knussen and Salonen)
Szymanowski: 1st Violin Concerto (BBC SO/Mordkovich/Sinaiski come to mind)

I can't  think of many other records that would give me as much pleasure as those do.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 14:04
best "Rite of Spring" version is by Leonard Bernstein and the Israel Philharmonic Orchestra, in my opinion. there are a lot of faster versions, but none is that powerful. Bernstein really understood Stravinsky


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 14:05
I love Bernstein - West Side Story is amazing, musically.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 14:14
Originally posted by BaldJean BaldJean wrote:

best "Rite of Spring" version is by Leonard Bernstein and the Israel Philharmonic Orchestra, in my opinion. there are a lot of faster versions, but none is that powerful. Bernstein really understood Stravinsky


Even if I wouldn't say definitely the best, you could without hesitation add Bernstein to my list. I saw a TV documentary in the 80's of him rehearsing a youth orchestra with the Rite, and it was just hilarious. He knew the piece so inside out, and could lead every single musician by hand. Simply fantastic, end of.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 14:38
For me a five star album is one that if I somehow lost it, I would immediately replace it again. Essential to my collection. No way that I could limit that to five.
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http://artrock2006.blogspot.com
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 14:41

Originally posted by Dragon Phoenix Dragon Phoenix wrote:

For me a five star album is one that if I somehow lost it, I would immediately replace it again. Essential to my collection. No way that I could limit that to five.

 

I totally agree with you!!!!

"A Flower!!!"
"If you go down to Willow farm, you look for Butterflies..."
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 14:53

 

OK, so no revolution. Hmm, it was a try.

Subjectivity is the weak spot in every review, but on the other hand it is what makes a review personal and interesting to read.
But essentiality is something like air in life or as Dragon P. says an album, which you immediately buy again when losing it and this again is subjective to the person and the moment in life.

But the only album that keep coming around is Close to the Edge of Yes.
So in objective terms Close to the Edge is the only real 5 star album, essential in your prog collection.

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 15:03
CttE is DENIFITELY a 5-star album. As are Selling England by the Pound and Foxtrot as well, and let's not forget Red. I just consider these albums to be pure masterpieces in every sense of the word; the quality of musicianship and composition is of the best possible caliber, and their influence on prog music is immense.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 16:10

My opinion on this is that the albums should be rated on quality, not essentiality (?).  This way, people don't look upon these ratings as "you need to have this/that"... however true it may be.  It seems like nearly every band has a 5 star album... instead of cheapening the state of a 5 star (relatively speaking of course), I feel we could try to add an Honors rating system to any fiver, so that you have 5 normal stars for any exceptional album, and five gold stars for a masterpiece. 

However, ratings for these albums (fives only) could only be submitted by impartial, fair reviewers (i.e. Gatot, Maani, ProgLucky, M@X, various others who have proved their credibility and fairness.) Also, a 2/3 majority of this board must vote this album in by nomination from 25 members of the forum.

This way, we can eliminate fanboyism, ratings sabotage, and all the albums we consider masterpieces would be equally represented.  And if your favorite obscure, yet amazing album doesn't get in, chill out! Your favorite still has a stellar five star rating.  Spread it around some and maybe it'll get done next year. Yes, this will happen yearly, like elections.  I would like to see that the admins and board don't have to spend every day negotiating with lobbyists from the CTTE foundation (like it won't be first in line).

Wh'ghal ng'fth mglw'y Ry'leh, Cthulhu fhtagn...



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 16:20
Originally posted by Tiresias Tiresias wrote:

My opinion on this is that the albums should be rated on quality, not essentiality (?).  This way, people don't look upon these ratings as "you need to have this/that"... however true it may be.  It seems like nearly every band has a 5 star album... instead of cheapening the state of a 5 star (relatively speaking of course), I feel we could try to add an Honors rating system to any fiver, so that you have 5 normal stars for any exceptional album, and five gold stars for a masterpiece.

I think that's making things too complicated.

However, ratings for these albums (fives only) could only be submitted by impartial, fair reviewers (i.e. Gatot, Maani, ProgLucky, M@X, various others who have proved their credibility and fairness.) Also, a 2/3 majority of this board must vote this album in by nomination from 25 members of the forum.

There is no such thing as an impartial reviewer.

This way, we can eliminate fanboyism, ratings sabotage, and all the albums we consider masterpieces would be equally represented.  And if your favorite obscure, yet amazing album doesn't get in, chill out! Your favorite still has a stellar five star rating.  Spread it around some and maybe it'll get done next year. Yes, this will happen yearly, like elections.  I would like to see that the admins and board don't have to spend every day negotiating with lobbyists from the CTTE foundation (like it won't be first in line).

I think we simply need more ways to query the albums database. I recently proposed a query that selects gems (albums with few, but stellar ratings), as opposed to popular albums.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 16:45
In the Court of the Crimson King (the beginning...)
Close to the Edge (the spreading)
Dark Side of the Moon (the mass marketing)
Scenes from a Memory (that which remains)


those 4 albums are pretty essential.

To define what I mean by essential, I mean that if someone asked "what is prog?" and wanted a non-verbal answer, I would play these 4 albums for them. There are quite a few others that I would use to define the genre (aka, are essential to the genre) but those are the 4 that come to mind for me.


Edited by DracoMordag
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 16:56

ELP - Brain Salad Surgery

Genesis - Foxtrot

Yes - Close To The Edge

Rush - Moving Pictures

Muse - Absolution

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 17:08
rush - moving pictures
yes - close to the edge
opeth - still life
comus - first uterrance
camel - mirage
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 17:16
  • Devin Townsend - Terria
  • Pain of Salvation - Remedy Lane
  • Roine Stolt - Hydrophonia
  • Kevin Gilbert - The Shaming of the True
  • Yes - Close to the Edge

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 17:17
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

  • Devin Townsend - Terria
  • Pain of Salvation - Remedy Lane

 



ah yes forgot those fantastic
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 12 2005 at 17:21

The previous post says it ALL to me...

Of all those CDs I would only rate CTTE as a 5 star, I would not give any of the others above 3.

So there you have it...WE ALL HAVE DIFFERENT TASTES, therefore, I see 'Paris' by supertramp as a 5 star CD, othere will only give it 2...with the amount of reviewers here, I fail to understand why people are upset by the amount of FIVE STAR reviews, we ALL think of a 'essential masterpiece' in a totally different way...

Surprised theres not more really...

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