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Topic ClosedDrugs & Music
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Poll Question: Drugs: Important in 60s and 70s music or not?
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himtroy View Drop Down
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Points: 1601 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Drugs & Music
    Posted: June 06 2009 at 22:22
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Points: 651 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 18:12
As a non drug user, it certainly can get annoying being accused of most likely using them all based on the stereotypes that go along with being a fan of so called "psychedelic" music.

I believe some people just have an inclination towards experiencing and creating certain kinds of music just as they do towards enjoying certain flavors of intoxication; it seems to me that they have no direct influence on each other.
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Points: 10698 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 10:58
Have you ever seen birds getting crazy with the over-ripe fruit, they'll fly right into windows etc.
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Points: 1085 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 10:41
Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

Be careful, some of these more complex chemicals end up being way more harmful than initially thought (ecstasy being a prime example - use burning out serotonergic synapses leaving the subjects with almost untreatable depression).


Indeed ...MDMA is no toy. Dimethyltryptamine OTOH occures naturally in the human body & is treated by the brain as being necessary for healthy function, the same way that seratonin & other tryptamines are treated. I enthusiastically recommend DMT: The Spirit Molecule by Rick Strassman, MD for further information concerning the states of consciousness conducive to endogenous DMT production, e.g. birth, R.E.M. sleep, meditation, prolongued prayer, schizophrenia, mantra, extreme stress, death, etc, as well as the effects (as benign as they are) DMT exerts upon the brain. Did you read the article, the link to which I included in my previous post?

Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

You have to wonder if humans and other animals aren't predisposed to intoxicating or stimulating themselves.  I seem to remember reading that coffee was discovered by people seeing goats eating the stuff and becoming frisky.


About 5 years ago I read a book called Animals & Psychedelics by Giorgio Samorini. He documented extensively the use of psychoactive compounds among a whole myriad of wild & domesticated animals & insects. It is his proposal (& I wholly agree with him) that the will to intoxication is as basic & widespread as the will to procreate.


Edited by Captain Capricorn - June 06 2009 at 10:50
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 10:28
Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

Originally posted by Captain Capricorn Captain Capricorn wrote:

Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

The brain does not produce LSD
 
I didn't say it did. What I said was that DMT is endogenously produced by the pineal gland. DMT makes LSD look like breath mints. Wink
 
http://www.lightparty.com/Health/SpiritMolecule.html

 
 
Having no direct experience of either, I'll take your word for it. Be careful, some of these more complex chemicals end up being way more harmful than initially thought (ecstasy being a prime example - use burning out serotonergic synapses leaving the subjects with almost untreatable depression).
 
Interesting but dangerous territory.


 

You have to wonder if humans and other animals aren't predisposed to intoxicating or stimulating themselves.  I seem to remember reading that coffee was discovered by people seeing goats eating the stuff and becoming frisky.

Ants in the fridge, hell.  Be very worried about the frisky goats...


Edited by Slartibartfast - June 06 2009 at 10:33
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Points: 5210 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 10:16
Originally posted by Captain Capricorn Captain Capricorn wrote:

Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

The brain does not produce LSD
 
I didn't say it did. What I said was that DMT is endogenously produced by the pineal gland. DMT makes LSD look like breath mints. Wink
 
http://www.lightparty.com/Health/SpiritMolecule.html

 
 
Having no direct experience of either, I'll take your word for it. Be careful, some of these more complex chemicals end up being way more harmful than initially thought (ecstasy being a prime example - use burning out serotonergic synapses leaving the subjects with almost untreatable depression).
 
Interesting but dangerous territory.
 
You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 09:29
Originally posted by progkidjoel progkidjoel wrote:

Yes, you can't really deny its influence is the 60's... or the 70's...

Yes I did some Yes. LOL
Not in the '60's but I did get hooked on Yes in the '70's.
I'm kinda over it now but sometimes I fall off the wagon. Tongue


Edited by Slartibartfast - June 06 2009 at 09:30
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Points: 19643 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 09:14
Yes, you can't really deny its influence is the 60's... or the 70's...
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Points: 1085 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2009 at 08:36
Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

The brain does not produce LSD
 
I didn't say it did. What I said was that DMT is endogenously produced by the pineal gland. DMT makes LSD look like breath mints. Wink
 
http://www.lightparty.com/Health/SpiritMolecule.html

 


Edited by Captain Capricorn - June 06 2009 at 09:41
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 05 2009 at 06:47
Sure there are pros and cons about the drug culture & the rock scene.
As a Japanese, it's very important for me to understand the relationship between drugs and Japanese psychedelic rock world.

EVE by Speed, Glue and Shinki should be a typical stuff of Japanese Drug Culture in early 1970s.
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 04 2009 at 20:41

Originally posted by Evans Evans wrote:

I've always been of the opinion that if Sgt. Pepper is the most spaced out thing you can come up with on LSD, it's kind of a lame drug, or you're not doing it right.

People say that all the time, about artists who tend to paint things that are a little far out. "I bet that guy was high on drugs", they say. Surreal stuff, like in the style of Salvador Dali, for instance. It's not that hard to come up with strange stuff like that, but you limit yourself if you tell yourself that drugs is the only way to do it.

I think you have to put Pepper in the context of the times.  LSD is an intense drug that you should never take unless you are fully informed of what you are getting into and, as I believe Dr. Leary said, the setting is good.  Having said that I am in no way advocating the taking of illegal substances. 

Now that you mentioned Dali, the best way to get sort of close to an LSD experience is to go see some of his really large masterwork paintings.  The museum in St. Petersburg, Florida is superb.

http://www.salvadordalimuseum.org/home.html

If you can't visit you could order one of these posters:
Halllucinogenic Toreador Poster
This painting is on the permanent display and is huge!!!




Edited by Slartibartfast - June 06 2009 at 09:29
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Points: 3004 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 04 2009 at 16:17
I've always been of the opinion that if Sgt. Pepper is the most spaced out thing you can come up with on LSD, it's kind of a lame drug, or you're not doing it right.

People say that all the time, about artists who tend to paint things that are a little far out. "I bet that guy was high on drugs", they say. Surreal stuff, like in the style of Salvador Dali, for instance. It's not that hard to come up with strange stuff like that, but you limit yourself if you tell yourself that drugs is the only way to do it.

'Let's give it another fifteen seconds..'
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Points: 5210 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 04 2009 at 11:25
The brain does not produce LSD, though is does produce it's on NMDA modulators. Though some here are more personally experienced than I, I've studied the stuff pretty well. I think we actually agree. The distinction I made was between sensation and experience. The only thing that drugs can exclusively produce are specific sensation patterns. I think I used too many negatives in my sentence, we agree.
You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
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Points: 1085 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2009 at 18:46
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

Drugs alter perception....but once you get used to the new perception, it's just another point of view.

There are feelings / sensations that can only be obtained with drugs. There are no insights that cannot be discovered (more fully and deeply) without them.

 
Your pituitary gland produces the best type (and safest) of LSD ... who you kidding?
 
The best trips are natural ... and many "mystics" spend their lives studying all this ... you can even go as far back as Moses and Jesus if you want to ... the "experience" is something that is in our inner system and is available to us all ... if we weren't so confused in the terminology and our own beliefs.
 
No doubt! (it's the pineal gland btw)...I've taken upwards of 500 trips on LSD, psilocybin, mescaline, ayahuasca, etc. & none of them compare in the least to an experience I had a few years back after prolongued asana, pranayama, & dharana experimentation. Endrogenous DMT production is no joke!


Edited by Captain Capricorn - June 03 2009 at 18:47
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Points: 147 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2009 at 18:30
http://www.klaus-schulze.com/photos/7606.htm

Ok now... let's not be naive. Somebodys body can't become like this without drug usage, for sure... You can find hundreds of many artists pictures like this one  where it's obvious there is a ''touch'' of drugs. And believe it or not it's  very obvious to understand what was going on, if you have the slightest idea about drugs and what can do to human body....
That doen't change the fact that we're talking about a musical genious here of course.


Edited by annexusquam - June 03 2009 at 18:34
https://0a0wake0.bandcamp.com/releases
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Points: 18176 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 27 2009 at 10:41
Originally posted by listen listen wrote:

Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

I saw a Paul Krassner interview on a documentary about the Sgt. Pepper and he said that while drugs certainly influence for the music, you couldn't exactly play well while under the influence of LSD.

True sometimes, but sometimes you play better!
 
There's the rub!
 
You can play better ... but it won't be what's in the paper or in the script ... it will be something else ...
 
And that was the point of some of the things I had written before ... if all you have to play is the Chuck Berry song over and over again, it will be easy to do that ripped senseless ... but you are not gonna be able to play  The Endless Enigma ripped ... you won't last 16 bars (so to speak) ... maybe 32 ...
 
Part of the "progressive" thing, is the importance to bring music into a highler level of composition and creativity ... and while ... yep  ... drugs and many other stimulants can help bring across the piece, in the end the ability to play it back in concert is not something that is gonna be done easily if you are ripped and out of it ... some people might be able to do it, but I doubt they can last very long doing it.
 
This is not Comfortably Numb ... and that is one thing that both David and Roger attack a lot, and in fact when I had dinner with them in '75 you know what Roger's main complaint was about the show? "... too much _ucking dope in the audience!" ... and that's a quote ... i9t interfered with the technical elements and some of the things they were doing on the show ...
 
So if you and others enjoy listening to things and makes you feel better and see something fine ... but don't think that simply because you have enhanced your experience that others are doing exactly what you did ... that's not only presumptuous, it's pathetic.


Edited by moshkito - May 27 2009 at 10:45
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Points: 18176 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 27 2009 at 10:29
Originally posted by boo boo boo boo wrote:

In response to what someone said earlier.
 
Gong = Anti drugs?
 
Man if those guys didn't do drugs, they did one hell of a job faking it. From some of the performances I've seen, Daevid Allen looked like he was tripping balls.
 
 
Sad ... and the one person that needed the drugs the least, Daevid, who had connections and actually lived with Mr. Naked Lunch for a time ... had given it up a ways back ... and so had others by that time ... they were extremely aware of some of the pitfalls in these things, and Gilly already had children then ... and she is not a reckless mother ... so if you are saying that they could only do the Flying Teapot Trilogy stoned, it just shows how well you heard the lyrics and paid attention to the music ... Daevid has ... it's not even worth it ... I doubt you guys will read this and be more interested in the sensationalism than the learning and intelligence that a lot of people have ... including here.
 
Because it has the artwork and the look, it doesn't mean it is druggy ... in many ways that's the difference between Europe and San Francisco ... the scen died in San Fran because of the drug over doses ... the scene did not die in Europe because of the drugs ... it continued as an artistic scene ... which it had been from the start ...
 
It's just sad that some folks think that the only way anyone can get inspiration is if they tap into something "out there" if they do some drugs ... and you know that is one of the silliest things ever ... except in America where the media frenzy atrocities around drugs make it all the more attractive and inquisitive all around for everyone.  It's really sad ... everyone blames Janis and Jimi's deaths on drugs ... and no one looks at the person and find out what triggered it in the first place ... easiest cop-out ... don't deal with the problem ... blame the result!
 
Like you have not taken wine with your dinner ... or had a smoke after sex ... so what?


Edited by moshkito - May 27 2009 at 10:30
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Points: 18176 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 27 2009 at 10:14
Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

Drugs alter perception....but once you get used to the new perception, it's just another point of view.

There are feelings / sensations that can only be obtained with drugs. There are no insights that cannot be discovered (more fully and deeply) without them.

 
Your pituitary gland produces the best type (and safest) of LSD ... who you kidding?
 
The best trips are natural ... and many "mystics" spend their lives studying all this ... you can even go as far back as Moses and Jesus if you want to ... the "experience" is something that is in our inner system and is available to us all ... if we weren't so confused in the terminology and our own beliefs.
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Points: 16130 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 27 2009 at 10:02
Originally posted by listen listen wrote:


Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

I saw a Paul Krassner interview on a documentary about the Sgt. Pepper and he said that while drugs certainly influence for the music, you couldn't exactly play well while under the influence of LSD.

True sometimes, but sometimes you play better!


I think you only 'believe' you play better..

I guess it depends what you mean by 'better'
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Points: 352 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 27 2009 at 09:56
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

I saw a Paul Krassner interview on a documentary about the Sgt. Pepper and he said that while drugs certainly influence for the music, you couldn't exactly play well while under the influence of LSD.

True sometimes, but sometimes you play better!
Now is all there is. Be before you think!
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