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Points: 865 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Another victim of the 'Death of CD's'
    Posted: June 30 2007 at 16:34
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Yesterday I purchased the vinyl edition of the new Symphony X album ... awesome artwork, no CD package can compete with a gatefold vinyl!


Now you're making me jealous! The local stores here got so few copies in that they sold out immediately, and the guy behind the counter in one of them told me I might as well order it online! So much for browsing through the record store looking for treasures Cry
The scattered jigsaw of my redemption laid out before my eyes
Each piece as amorphous as the other - Each piece in its lack of shape a lie
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Points: 1402 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 16:02
Bit of a teaser this one. Quite a few paradoxes here
 
I have never downloaded - nor intend to. (I can't see the point in downloading something with crappy mp format when you can have the CD to hold and look at and sonically far superior). I have several music systems to play CDs and I also convert them to play on my Walkman and computer
 
I don't live in an area that has FOPP - in fact this is the first I have heard of them - but I'm sorry to see any specialist shop go under.
 
I've pretty much exhausted High Street stores range of stock but usually check them out first and compare them to Amazon. If there's a couple of quid difference I'll normally buy locally but that's becoming increasingly rare these days. But I did get the new DTs locally (that's Dream Theater and Devin Townsend).
 
There are some good independents around though eg Caerllysi. Just depends on your genre
 
Hope you get my drift 
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Points: 285 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 14:57
I downloaded a cd once through Wal-Mart because it was unavailable otherwise. I buy most of my actual cds on the internet . I think most brick and mortar shops need to do an online business to stay alive and offer competitive prices. It seems FOPP had online service.  I don't really enjoy going to record store anymore.
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Points: 20414 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 14:48
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

^ no wonder if people copy the CDs they rent ... Wink
 
 
Well can't say that doesn't happen once in a whileEmbarrassed
 
This was no problems/influence for the numbers of locations though as the choice for discovery is incredible.
 
Rentals really started dipping when Napster went down after their lost trial.
 
I believe it's the fact of having to get out of the house, ordering it and having to wait for it (in case they don't have there and it must come from the central location). that they don't like anymore.
 
People want everything on the spot nowadays. Abd since you can taste it on the net (even in small samples), people will not get out to rent or buy something they didn't appreciate or thought as average.
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
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prefer lifting our pen
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Points: 21588 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 13:27
^ no wonder if people copy the CDs they rent ... Wink
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Points: 20414 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 13:14
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

CDs beat downloading any day. I've never heard of FOPP though!
 
Neither had I really!!
 
But since I am not living in the UK
 
Never downloaded anything >> wouldn't know how
 
However we lost one of the three semi-independant store in Brussels called Musicmania last month.
 
And that famous Belgian library system I tell everyone (and that world envies us, almost as much as the beerWink) has to lay-off 40% of the workers, because even the renting is getting bad.
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
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as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Points: 1356 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 12:08
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Tragically, UK based music retailer FOPP is to close all it's stores. It blames serious slumps in CD sales.

The London branch of FOPP sold shelves full of prog rock, for as little as £3.00, as well as latest releases. The company blames downloading for nose diving CD sales.

FOPP RIP

Sad news.

Does anyone here prefer buying CD's to downloading, or am I the last one?



Dammit! Fopp is where I get most of my CDs and DVDs Cry

The irony here is that I'll often download and album and if I really like it I'll go into Fopp and pick up a copy for a reasonable price.


Edited by Forgotten Son - June 30 2007 at 12:10
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Points: 21588 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 05:37
Yesterday I purchased the vinyl edition of the new Symphony X album ... awesome artwork, no CD package can compete with a gatefold vinyl!

Edited by MikeEnRegalia - June 30 2007 at 05:38
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Points: 4252 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 04:17
Originally posted by emdiar emdiar wrote:

Personally I've always hated the CD with its crappy plastic cover that cracks before you get it out of the shop, its condensed artwork and sleeve notes, the reading of which requires an electro-microscope and a bottle of Optrex, and the fact that a packet of king-sized Rizlas takes up so much of the surface area that no space remains on which to skin up in any practical way.
On the other hand, at least it's a tangible three dimensional piece of ownable sh*t, and not some ethereal, incorporeal coded nothingness, which I wouldn't pay you for.
 
 
Bring back vinyl. That was something worth having.
 
vinyl is back - if you look carefully   Wink
 
i used to love browsing in record shops - the new "just -in", section, the used section (most lp's were about £1.50), and if you saw anything you fancied they'd put it on for you...now how's that for service? Big%20smile
 
my old shop is still there after 45 years - i might  go there today!
 
happy hunting!
 
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Points: 3928 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2007 at 03:58
Fopp were not bad for prog- the one near me wasn't so good for it, but the Bristol and Bath stores had a fair amount of Canterbury, Krautrock and some Magma albums amidst the usual symphonic legends.
 
Most of the less well known prog I get though is from a nearby record fair- got one today, funnily enough- or occasionally 2nd hand stores. Usually, stores near me have the latest Inside Out label releases but only a few copies of those- once they are gone, that's it really.
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Points: 166183 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 23:51
Cry
 
Any place that sells prog CDs (beyond DT, PT, etc) should never close.
Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive
Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.
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Points: 1494 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 22:06
I like some legal downloads (such as emusic.com) because now I have an iPod and it's so much cheaper. If it were not for emusic's incredibly cheap prices, I would not have nearly as much music exploration. It's hard to see why someone would pay $10 for a download, but when it's $1.50...
 
I think also Amazon.com is driving these places out of business because it has a larger selection, discounted prices (more physical shops sell at MSRP, which is for suckers), and free shipping that only takes a week or so.
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Points: 1907 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 21:49
I download my music, and then buy the Vinyls because i feel the CDs are lacking in "package", and I cant play vinyls on my iPod
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Points: 143 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 21:12
I'm not in the UK so this doesn't directly affect me, but it's been happening to the local music stores where I live, too.  It makes me sad, because I, too, don't ever like just having the CD.  I currently am far too poor to be purchasing CDs, and I'm afraid that once this is no longer the case (it'll 4 years or so, probably) there won't be any decent local stores left.

A friend told me the other day that she, too, likes having CDs but sometimes she just "has to have" a song...right then...so she buys it off iTunes.  How silly!  I've gotten like that about certain songs before, too, and the wait just made it that much better when I finally did take the CD home and play it.
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Points: 15535 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 19:12
I'm also pro-CD.

Tangible objects to me give me a better thrill of getting a new album since I have to make a journey into the central london to use what little money I have to get as much stuff from used record shops as possible.
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 18:34
There's a chain of record stores in Massachusetts called Newbury Comics that have recently started putting huge numbers of CDs on sale for $10 or less. I'm not talking about the crummy bargain bin stuff you find in Virgin Megastores, but lots of really good classic Cds. I assume they have lowered their prices in an attempt to compete with online retailers, and I suspect it's working. I now buy many mnay more CDs than I ever did before, because I can get them at half the price. I think if more stores adopt this policy, they will not be doomed entirely.
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Points: 890 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 18:11
Personally I've always hated the CD with its crappy plastic cover that cracks before you get it out of the shop, its condensed artwork and sleeve notes, the reading of which requires an electro-microscope and a bottle of Optrex, and the fact that a packet of king-sized Rizlas takes up so much of the surface area that no space remains on which to skin up in any practical way.
On the other hand, at least it's a tangible three dimensional piece of ownable sh*t, and not some ethereal, incorporeal coded nothingness, which I wouldn't pay you for.
 
 
Bring back vinyl. That was something worth having.


Edited by emdiar - June 29 2007 at 18:13
Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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Points: 7456 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 17:52
Originally posted by Syzygy Syzygy wrote:

Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Tragically, UK based music retailer FOPP is to close all it's stores. It blames serious slumps in CD sales. The London branch of FOPP sold shelves full of prog rock, for as little as £3.00, as well as latest releases. The company blames downloading for nose diving CD sales. FOPP RIP Sad news. Does anyone here prefer buying CD's to downloading, or am I the last one?

 

As I work within walking distance of two Central London Fopps I've got mixed feelings about this; on the one hand, I still like to buy CDs although I also download from emusic every month, but on the other hand I won't be as tempted to treat myself to yet another prog CD or several following a bad day at work.

 

On balance, it's a bummer CryCryCryCry


So do I.Shaftesbury Ave and Tottenham Ct Road branches. If so; meet up some day?

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Points: 19557 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 17:42
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Tragically, UK based music retailer FOPP is to close all it's stores. It blames serious slumps in CD sales.

The London branch of FOPP sold shelves full of prog rock, for as little as £3.00, as well as latest releases. The company blames downloading for nose diving CD sales.

FOPP RIP

Sad news.

Does anyone here prefer buying CD's to downloading, or am I the last one?

 
I'm not in favour of downloading, but lets be honest, the Musical Industry and big stores are victims of their own greed not of the downloading alone, which if used wisely may boost sells.
 
They still believe we're in the early 90's when they were the only ones who could release a decent CD, so they could put the price they wanted.
 
THEY DON'T HAVE THE MONOIPOLY ANYMORE, SO THEY CAN'T KEEP THE HIGH PRICES.
 
  1. Many bands work for independent labels who sale the albums via Internet.
  2. Some new bands sell their own albums
  3. SAny computer has a CD burner to copy an album.

The cost of a CD is lower than an  LP but still they sell the CD's 2 or 3 times what an LP costed, this is absurd. The cost of a CD with package, booklett, printing, mail and taxes is 1.75 pounds average (Without booklet it goes down even to 1 pound), let's see:

 
Quote
$1500    Business Set-up (dba, LLC, legal documents, bookkeeping)
$4200    Production fees
$12500    Engineering
$5000    New Gear
$750    Piano Tunings
$9300    Musicians
$3200    Mixing Time/Additional Studio costs
$900    Artwork
$1100    Mastering (more than usual because one tune had to be re-mastered)
$2000    CD Release Party
$6000    Manufacturing
$3400    Radio Promotion
$1500    Publicity to date
$3200    Advertising
US$ 54,450
 
This are the costs for a simple guy making his own albums, so for a big company the costs are much lower except in the already famous artists, but in this case they reach Gold or Platinuum easily so the costs go really down.
 
Lets think in 30,000 copies (Record Industry doesn't release less.
 
The cost per CD is US$ 1.8...................Why in hell are the prices so high????
 
Any new artist can release 10 or 20 thousand CD's and sell them in US5.00 to US$ 7.50 and still gain some money that will be multip´lied in the gigs.
 
The big companies don't have a monopoly anymore, they can't keep the prices, don't think in Prog albums sold at 3 pounds, because this is not the meat for a store, a store gains in the thousand of POP  or RAP CD's they sell at US$ 15.00 to $ 20.00
 
Their excuse is: "Less than 10% of CDs are profitable, and these profits ideally must cover the costs of the others."

Why in hell must we pay their ineficient system of finding artists?

So yes, downloading has affected the industry (Specially in singles), but a survey studio http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/3052145.stm proves that a downloader buys more albums than a non downloader.

So if there's somebody to blame is the greedy musical industry, not that I condone the illegal downloading, but it's not the only factor.

Iván
 


Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - June 29 2007 at 17:47
            
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Points: 7003 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2007 at 17:36
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Tragically, UK based music retailer FOPP is to close all it's stores. It blames serious slumps in CD sales.

The London branch of FOPP sold shelves full of prog rock, for as little as £3.00, as well as latest releases. The company blames downloading for nose diving CD sales.

FOPP RIP

Sad news.

Does anyone here prefer buying CD's to downloading, or am I the last one?

 
As I work within walking distance of two Central London Fopps I've got mixed feelings about this; on the one hand, I still like to buy CDs although I also download from emusic every month, but on the other hand I won't be as tempted to treat myself to yet another prog CD or several following a bad day at work.
 
On balance, it's a bummer CryCryCryCry
'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'

Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom


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