Does religion have a place in Prog music?

It is estimated there are circa > 4000 religions extant in the world today. These clearly range from the avowed 'biggies' like Catholicism, Protestantism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Islamism? before gradually ramping down to the esoteric niche 'borderline mental' market vouchsafed by the likes of the Church of Diego Maradona's Miraculously Descended Vesticles and it's affiliate the Tabernacle Choir of Luis Suarez's Dental Stigmata. Prog is not really that dissimilar, as we have the overriding orthodoxy of the likes Yes, ELP, Genesis, Crimson and Floyd c/f the considerably more esoteric and polarizing  iconoclasm provided by Beefheart, Can, Zappa, Amon Duul and VDGG. The Devil does NOT have all the best tunes (he just hires better lawyers to forestall the copyright writs)

Neal rocks, either way.......

Neal Morse seems to think so..........

An artist is allowed to take the inspiration for lyrics from everything. Then the result can be bad or good or insignificant.

I think that artists can sing about any topic they like within reason, (ie do not encourage the listeners to murder or something. Yes music is very spiritual and to me that is what makes Yes what it is. I think that is part of the band, I agree it can be difficult, although not religious I do find Frank Zappa get's a little too offensive IMO, but that's life, your never going to like or agree with what the artist has to say.
(btw I'm not a newbie, I just have a new profile name)

smartpatrol wrote: Hoesntly I don't even really understand the question. Is there a committee that decides what goes in prog albums and what doesn't?

Exactly. As I said before, don't tell Prog musicians they can't do something, because they're sure to do it.

@SteveG, It hasn't been said explicitly, but I presume the the real intended question was whether Prog listeners would be willing to listen to Christian themes. Yes? No?

The vatican praised Revolver by The Beatles as their favorite pop album...

Epignosis wrote: Dean wrote: Wellll. Christian music exists and a whole lot of people are going to take a whole lot of convincing before they believe otherwise. A whole of lot of people taking a whole of of convincing before they believe otherwise......that seems oddly familiar. Dean wrote: Denying its existence is like saying that there's no such thing as christian books or christian art.  Christian music has existed for hundreds of years - whether that is a hymn or a plainsong or a gregorian chant or a mass or a carol or gospel music or christian rock (or rap or metal or hip hop or folk or polka). It is not a genre I will grant you that, but that does not mean it cannot exist, it does not have to be a style of music to exist. Just as children's music is a category and not a style or genre, and love songs are songs that are genre non-specific songs and have "love" as their theme, christian music<span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"> is a category of music that has a christian theme</span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">. That theme can be praise, worship, prayer or testimony; it can preach and/or proselytise; it can be moralistic; it can be a narrative; it can contain a message and it can sermonise but in all those things it is centred around christianity. </span> There are Christian lyrics and Christian intentions and Christian receptions but never Christian music.  Just because a particular set of people used music for a religious purpose does not make it religious music.  Many old Christian hymns are songs written to secular music.  John Wesley's "Love Divine, All Loves Excelling" is a famous example, borrowed from Dryden's and Purcell's King Arthur (Venus is the original singer).  So if you played the melody of "Fairest Isle" to a Methodist, the hearer would may well have a religious interpretation.  If you played it to a Dryden scholar, the hearer may well have a secular interpretation. Dean wrote: <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">The term christian rock was not invented by secular musicologists so we atheists can avoid it, (thou' at times it is nice to be forewarned), it was a term coined by christians and christian musicians back in the mid-1960s (also known as Jesus music and later as </span>contemporary<span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"> christian music) ~ 'christian' may not be a useful adjective for describing the music, 'christian music' a damn useful noun-phrase for those who are looking for it ~ which is I guess why fans of christian music even have their own version of the PA (</span>www.christianmusicarchive.com)<span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">. Those who are looking for it are not looking for Christian music- they're looking for Christian lyrics.  "Christian music" is a misnomer, which is what I've been saying.  </span> <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"></span> <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"> Dean wrote: <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"></span>...and Preachy? It's not a silly adjective it's a (mainly) derogatory one, but I've never heard any of Morse's lyrics since Snow to say whether that is correctly used in relation to his solo material. Religious lyrics can 'h</span>ave a tendency to give moral advice in a tedious or self-righteous way<span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">', (ie 'preachy'), then so can non-religious lyrics. Like every episode of The Cosby Show had to contain a life lesson, to a non-christian overtly christian lyrics do sound preachy or proselytising, sorry but that's just how it is I'm afraid. I've been on this forum a while, and I've never heard the adjective "preachy" used with regard to anybody except Neal Morse.  And if I've forgotten it, I've never seen the term apply to any lyrics other than Christian.  As I mentioned earlier, Jon Anderon records "preachy" things with some frequency, but I've never seen anyone apply that adjective to him.</span> <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"></span> Dean wrote: <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"></span>Not knowing who Kerry Livgren is I assume he is (well?) known as a christian artist and has release other albums with lyrics that have a christian theme. If a christian artist releases an instrumental album it would not surprise me to see it filed under christian music with all his other albums, indeed it would musicology inaccurate but as a cataloguing it would be logical. He's not well-known at all, really.An instrumental album going into the "Christian Music" section only shows that such labels are to market albums, not to describe the music.

I agree there is no such thing as "Christian music" per se, Epi; there are, however, Christian bands and performers who market themselves to Christians as playing music that is indeed Christian, but that is not gospel (like the Winans) or sacred as in some of the compositions of Bach or Beethoven. It seems like splitting hairs, no?

And Dean, Kerry Livgren was the guitarist and principal songwriter for Kansas during the period of their biggest selling albums. Many of their songs in that period certainly have spiritually-inclined lyrics that can be construed as Christian-themed.

In every art does not matter "what", it is "how". And so Van Gogh's Sunflowers painting is crazier and darker than many images of e.g. Fantastic art painters who are keen to be "dark". It's the same thing with the music.

Religiosity of an artist, as an inspiration, can provide great results, and also can be a crap. Of course, it all depends on the artist and of his personal inspiration only, and "heavenly powers" have nothing to do with that, even "satan" does not help the artists because it belongs to the world of the human imagination and Hollywood.

The fact is that some singer-songwriters are very religious in one way or another, and some of them were recorded the great songs in praise of what they believe. e.g. This song is very religious but magnificent too, and I said that as an atheist fundamentalist.







It is another matter how it is actually possible that a brilliant mind like Mr Townshend really believes in the fairy tales created by one Pakistani collector of Rolls-Royces.



Edited by Svetonio - August 05 2014 at 21:34

Hoesntly I don't even really understand the question. Is there a committee that decides what goes in prog albums and what doesn't?