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QM: Does Time exist?
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Valdez View Drop Down
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Points: 617 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Valdez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 17:43
The measurement of time surely exists.  And if the sun rises and sets on a schedule (as it does) then it could be said to be keeping time. Although, if life as we know it did not exist, then the sun (and everything else) would be un-observable and would not exist. Time exists in our minds given our capacity to comprehend our surroundings.  Instinct, via seasons, is a timekeeper for many animals including man. Instinct can be said to be a clock of sorts that depends on a forward moving time, which is the future. Memory depends on times past. All crucial for survival in many ways.  When we die, we have 'Run out of time' as we know and observe it.

The ability to even imagine a point A or a point B requires time to do it in, as would any question that time could answer.  I'm thinking that if Time didn't exist then nothing else would. If consciousness (as we reckon it) didn't exist, then time wouldn't either. Ying Yang

Even if one could travel to the earths past, by rights, everything in the past should repeat exactly as it was.  which means that you could not be there.  The future is a roll of the dice that has not yet happened, and that would prohibit a visit.

Theories about multiple 'Timelines' also prove that time exists in theory. lol


Edited by Valdez - November 13 2024 at 18:16
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Points: 381 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Starshiper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 16:51
It's a very philosophical and scientific question that has been argued for centuries. Presentism argues that only the present is real, while the past and future have little reality. On this view, time really consists in our experience of duration, not as a measurable construct. On the other hand, eternalism maintains that all past, present, and future events are all equally real, much like all the points on a line are equally real points. Personally, I believe it is always only 'now'.
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Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

 
The conclusion is that Everything may exist simultaneously.  
People seem to think that it's crystal clear what it means to "exist". I don't think that at all.

Also, I wonder whether "simultaneous" itself is a notion that relies on a concept of time?
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Points: 65224 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 16:04
I will have to cogitate on the things you outlined.

That aside, I tend to think it may not be possible to move at will between or with the slices of space/time, and so our notion of time travel is not feasible, at least using the example of a deck of cards being fanned, riffled, spread, or shuffled.





Edited by Atavachron - November 13 2024 at 16:05
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Points: 14022 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 09:53
Of course the thread was closed 14 years ago, too late for a correction Dead
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Points: 14022 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 09:49
Nice. I did't think the subject could be updated. Now I'll search the Quintorigo suggestion that I've made in 2010 on which I misspelled the band's name
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Points: 43432 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 08:32
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

Can't find a way...how?

The "edit post" in the "post options". Smile
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Can't find a way...how?
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Points: 43432 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 08:19
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

Please forgive the syntax error in the thread title: EXIST not EXISTS...sorry

You can easily edit that. Smile
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Points: 14022 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 08:04
Please forgive the syntax error in the thread title: EXIST not EXISTS...sorry
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Points: 14022 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 13 2024 at 08:01
As promised, I'm starting a thread about theoretical physics. It doesn't mean to be technical.
Theoretical physics is often source of phylosophical reasonings and the real existence of time can possibly raise an interesting discussion:

Let's start from a book: "THE END OF TIME" by Julian Barbour.

Imagine a whole Universe consisting of only three points and a single particle. The possible configurations of this universe are only three: particle in point A, particle in point B and particle in point C.
Lets take a photo of this Universe in all its possible states and make several copies,then call each photo "a slice of space".

Use the slices as a deck of playing cards, then watch them in rapid sequence.
We will have the impression of a particle moving randomicly from one point to another.
Now do the same with our Universe consisting of billions of light years in diameter and approx 10^80 protons. 

The sequence of these enormous slices of spaces is what we call "time".
The conclusion is that Everything may exist simultaneously. The illusion of Time depends only on the position of the slices.

This could potentially explain the two slit experiment and some of the weird paradoces of the quantum mechanics.

A colleague of Julian Barbour, Lee Smolin, has then published a book entitled "TIME REBORN", in which he presents the opposite vision: Time is substantial, absolutely real. 

Both the books are clear and enjoyable and despite the opposite opinions, the two scientists who are also colleagues in the same University, mention each other in a very respectfully way.


Now: which vision of TIME do you prefer is the right one, and why?




Edited by octopus-4 - November 13 2024 at 09:47
I stand with Roger Waters, I stand with Joan Baez, I stand with Victor Jara, I stand with Woody Guthrie. Music is revolution
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