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Points: 7851 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote NotAProghead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2022 at 16:18
^^^^ Regarding the posts above, I think it's a good solution to have splits on both artists' pages with notes on both. Clap I can't suggest anything better.

Formally splits might belong to Various artists, but I guess nobody would like this because in this case it will be hard to find splits and, as a result, sooner or later someone will add these albums to one of the bands' pages (or both) and in the end we'll get "triplications" instead of duplications.


Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

I don't know about the exact PA policy about split-releases, but if I remember correctly it's something like: if there are two artists listed on the front cover, the first one should be used as the "primary" artist.

Maybe Eugene knows better about this policy?
If memory serves me well, it's rather a kind of an unwritten rule than a policy, but it is apllied to mutual projects with all artists listed in the title involved, for example like this one.
Obviously splits are different beasts.
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^ Thank you both for your feedback. Done.
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Points: 43566 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2022 at 06:05
Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

^ I kind of agree with you guys, but I think we should at least mention the duplication on both album pages. Something like:

Note: Also listed under http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75574.

Would be that OK? Maybe you can suggest a better sentence? Thanks!

That's fine. Thumbs Up
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Points: 6737 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2022 at 06:01
Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

^ I kind of agree with you guys, but I think we should at least mention the duplication on both album pages. Something like:

Note: Also listed under http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75574.

Would be that OK? Maybe you can suggest a better sentence? Thanks!

Honestly, this is what I have always wished PA had done. It is the perfect solution, in my opinion, to a problem that need not exist.

The problem with keeping a split release under only one of the artists is not just that split releases are not intended to have a “main” artist, but that for a database like PA, someone looking to find out the discography of a band could easily miss a release (or moreJ because they are listed only on another artist’s page.

Your sentence/wording is fine. 👍🏻
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Points: 2907 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote projeKct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2022 at 05:16
^ I kind of agree with you guys, but I think we should at least mention the duplication on both album pages. Something like:

Note: Also listed under http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75574.

Would be that OK? Maybe you can suggest a better sentence? Thanks!
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Points: 6737 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2022 at 00:39
I have always thought it is silly of PA to not allow splits on the pages of both artists represented on the split (if both are in PA). The ONLY reason I can see is that both will receive reviews and ratings independent of each other - but given it is highly unlikely a split release would ever enter the PA charts (which is pretty much the only reason why duplication is an issue), then I don’t see a problem at all in this.

As seems often to be the case in my writings in this thread, I tend to agree with Cristi. But, again like Cristi, I’m really not worried about it if you remove one of the “duplicated” entries. I think it is silly and wrong to do so, but I’m not going to try and stop you.

I would point out though, that relying on what the policy has always been is not necessarily always the best route to take. Throughout history, mankind has become better by recognising that what was once policy and the norm is not necessarily fair or right.
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Points: 43566 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2022 at 15:43
Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

^ Well, we want to avoid duplicate entries because reviewers would get confused as to which one they should review.

I don't know about the exact PA policy about split-releases, but if I remember correctly it's something like: if there are two artists listed on the front cover, the first one should be used as the "primary" artist.

Maybe Eugene knows better about this policy?

I imagine, people will review the band they like the most on a split, that's where they start. 
There isn't a primary artist on a split. It's not like one artist is more important than the other one(s). 

If you see them as duplicates, just get rid of one of them i guess. 
If you don't see them as duplicates, keep them both on their artist pages. 
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Points: 2907 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote projeKct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2022 at 15:28
^ Well, we want to avoid duplicate entries because reviewers would get confused as to which one they should review.

I don't know about the exact PA policy about split-releases, but if I remember correctly it's something like: if there are two artists listed on the front cover, the first one should be used as the "primary" artist.

Maybe Eugene knows better about this policy?
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Points: 43566 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2022 at 14:47
Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75573

I think we must decide if we list this split release under Iceburn or Zu.

how about keeping both on each artist page?
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Points: 2907 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote projeKct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2022 at 14:38
http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75573

I think we must decide if we list this split release under Iceburn or Zu.
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Points: 2907 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote projeKct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2022 at 05:15
^ Thanks Luka,

Ratings are less of a problem than reviews (and in this case, the ratings are from the same users, thus really no problem), so 30779 will be deleted soon by an admin.


Edited by projeKct - May 02 2022 at 05:15
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http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=30779
http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=30780

Both have ratings
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Points: 2907 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote projeKct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 29 2022 at 04:53
^ I've already contacted Greg about it (yesterday).

Edited by projeKct - April 29 2022 at 05:00
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^ Thanks, Bartek, will report it to Admins.
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http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75137
http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=75136

Duplicate.
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^ Here are a few examples of digital-only entries on PA :
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Points: 43566 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2022 at 07:40
Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

^ Hi Nick,

As far as I know, official digital-only releases are accepted on PA, so I'm not sure why you're posting this? Ermm

Because of what is deemed official, based on the discussion in this thread, regarding whether or not a release was official.

Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

Also, why posting this in the Duplicated entries thread?

Because of what is deemed official, based on the discussion in this thread, regarding whether or not a release was official.


the only rule when adding an album is "no bootlegs", so any other release is therefore accepted. 
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Points: 6737 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2022 at 07:35
Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

^ Hi Nick,

As far as I know, official digital-only releases are accepted on PA, so I'm not sure why you're posting this? Ermm

Because of what is deemed official, based on the discussion in this thread, regarding whether or not a release was official.

Originally posted by projeKct projeKct wrote:

Also, why posting this in the Duplicated entries thread?

Because of what is deemed official, based on the discussion in this thread, regarding whether or not a release was official.
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Points: 2907 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote projeKct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2022 at 06:59
^ Hi Nick,

As far as I know, official digital-only releases are accepted on PA, so I'm not sure why you're posting this? Ermm

Maybe you could share some example with us?

Also, why posting this in the Duplicated entries thread?
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Points: 6737 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2022 at 02:29
At some point PA will have to decide whether it wishes to keep us with the times, regarding digital only releases, and recognise that increasingly bands are deliberately using YouTube as the promotional platform for releases that can only be purchased through platforms like Amazon and Apple. YouTube has changed a lot since being acquired by Google, and there is nowhere near the amount of unauthorised content there once was. Bands can actually get a decent income from YouTube, that while still minimal compared to actual record sales, is better than that from conventional streaming services like Spotify.

More and more bands are not seeking any greater online presence than their YouTube profile. I reviewed an album for a Mexican band last year that is available to listen to only on platforms like YouTube and Spotify, and to purchase only from platforms like Amazon and Apple. They have no website, and barely post on their FB page (which seems to exist more to redirect people to YouTube). I was curious, and enquired if they were considering at least a Bandcamp site, but they said they have no intention of that, as YouTube grants them a far wider audience (in their eyes) than Bandcamp, and they are quite happy with what looks to PA at present as a fairly anonymous release whose presence would no doubt be argued, as the recent DT digital release has been.

I think it will become more and more common, especially for live performances, for bands to release digital albums that are designed to be watched on YouTube, and while they might also be available to purchase from platforms like Amazon and Apple, that is almost an afterthought, as a considerable amount of income from the release is probably going to be achieved by the streaming on YouTube. People like to watch live shows, and many like to do so without paying. I know a lot of people who watch full live shows on YouTube. Expect to see more and more releases (or re-releases) on YouTube, like DT’s.

I know I own several albums that have no “official” presence, as per PA’s present guidelines, apart from being on Apple and Amazon, promoted via YouTube and Spotify and the like. This is some way away from becoming the new norm, but it is far more prevalent than you might suspect.
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