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Philéas 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 14 2006
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 Posted: October 03 2006 at 11:31 |
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Yes, but only because we have the Prog Related category (I actually
want it removed). They have many Proggish moments in much of their
music, Prog Related is a good place for them to be.
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bhikkhu
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 10:28 |
 MikeEnRegalia wrote:
^ U2 heavily influenced Dream Theater (Mike Portnoy is a huge fan), and Faith No More could be seen as related to prog because it was essentially Mike Patton's band.Having said that, neither one should be called prog or prog related (except perhaps the last FNM album, which is kind of Avant-Garde/Experimental).
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That is interesting Mike. However, I don't think it was the prog elements of these bands that were inspirational.
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 10:11 |
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^ U2 heavily influenced Dream Theater (Mike Portnoy is a huge fan), and Faith No More could be seen as related to prog because it was essentially Mike Patton's band.
Having said that, neither one should be called prog or prog related (except perhaps the last FNM album, which is kind of Avant-Garde/Experimental).
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Bilek
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 10:11 |
bhikkhu wrote:
KeyserSoze wrote:
Ok, now we daily get 20 reviews of Iron Maiden albums. Who's next? U2 or Faith No More? They influenced many bands too... |
I'm curious. How many prog bands did U2 and Faith No More influence?
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speaking of which, can anyone tell me what the heck U2's genre really is? I'm really curious about it (and please don't make the joke "curiosity killed the cat"!!!!  )
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Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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bhikkhu
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 10:02 |
KeyserSoze wrote:
Ok, now we daily get 20 reviews of Iron Maiden albums. Who's next? U2 or Faith No More? They influenced many bands too... |
I'm curious. How many prog bands did U2 and Faith No More influence?
The hysteria is unwarranted. Every band gets evaluated on its own merits. Just because The Beatles are here, that doesn't mean we are now obligated to include bands like The Rolling Stones, and The Kinks.
I am not a big metal fan, but I was in favor of Iron Maiden's inclusion. I took the time to get several albums, and carefully evaluate the music. This is how it is done.
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 09:31 |
salmacis wrote:
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
If Metallica also get added: yes. Otherwise: no.
I was initially against the addition of bands like Iron Maiden. Now that they're here it would be very inconsistent to not add bands like Metallica, who - among some blatantly non-prog albums - released some fine & innovative albums which are IMO much more prog related than anything Iron Maiden ever did.
But that's just my personal opinion.
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This is what I was worried about- the 'if band X are here band Y should be' kind of thing. IMO, both Maiden and Metallica had prog influences in their music but I wouldn't necessarily have expected to see either on a prog website. I'm not going to start a mutiny about it, and I've been able to see the prog in Maiden's output for years, but it has possibly opened the floodgates a bit TOO wide. Maiden aren't too shocking an addition (arguably Triumph, ELO and Fairport Convention are less valid inclusions) but I worry that now there'll be cries to get no end of other metal bands on the site... |
Thing is that Iron Maiden are here to stay ... it's a given.
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Cristi
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Crossover / Prog Metal Teams
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 09:17 |
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Yes. Under the prog-related category, it's really no problem. They have always made good, cleverly made complex heavy metal, a lot of rhythm and tempo changes, great guitar solos, awesome bass work, good drumming; I agree that they definitely influenced the prog-metal scene. Anyway, it would be a mistake to consider them as prog-metal artists. Prog-related, yes.
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Padraic
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 08:45 |
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If I had my way, Iron Maiden would not be here for the simple reason that I would ditch the entire prog-related section altogether. However, in another thread The Progtologist pointed out, and correctly so, that the existence of prog-related is a direct request or desire of the site's owners. It is important to remember that ultimately this is their site and it will be run in the manner that they see fit. So, given that prog-related is here to stay, I do believe Iron Maiden is prog-related or a proto-prog metal, if you will, having exerted enormous influence on a lot of PM bands.
I am sort of worried that we are on a slippery slope here, however. Time will tell.
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salmacis
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Content Addition
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 08:31 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
If Metallica also get added: yes. Otherwise: no.
I was initially against the addition of bands like Iron Maiden. Now that they're here it would be very inconsistent to not add bands like Metallica, who - among some blatantly non-prog albums - released some fine & innovative albums which are IMO much more prog related than anything Iron Maiden ever did.
But that's just my personal opinion.
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This is what I was worried about- the 'if band X are here band Y should be' kind of thing. IMO, both Maiden and Metallica had prog influences in their music but I wouldn't necessarily have expected to see either on a prog website. I'm not going to start a mutiny about it, and I've been able to see the prog in Maiden's output for years, but it has possibly opened the floodgates a bit TOO wide. Maiden aren't too shocking an addition (arguably Triumph, ELO and Fairport Convention are less valid inclusions) but I worry that now there'll be cries to get no end of other metal bands on the site...
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KeyserSoze
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:57 |
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Ok, now we daily get 20 reviews of Iron Maiden albums. Who's next? U2 or Faith No More? They influenced many bands too...
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Tony R
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:41 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
Tony R wrote:
but...they have been added as Prog-Related...which..um...isnt Prog...if some of their songs "are" Prog then they quite obviously are prog-related.. |
If 25% of an album is prog and the rest isn't, then ... it's a tough choice whether I want to call it prog -or prog-related. |
I know what you are saying and from a purist point of view you are probably correct but this is Prog-Related we are talking about and what is Prog-Related here to do?
...if there is a chance that Iron Maiden listeners will make the jump from the proggier IM sings to say prog-Metal or hard-edged bands like Rush or Porcupine Tree and from their to Classic Prog then why not include them? That is what the Prog-Related category is supposed to be a stepping stone to real Prog.
I think that Iron Maiden,from that point of view,are the epitome of Prog-Related along with bands like Magnum.
Edited by Tony R - October 03 2006 at 06:43
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Bilek
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:32 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
^ sorry, but I beg to differ:
1. I wouldn't call Master of Puppets a prog-metal album. It's simply not a part of that genre. It's a progressive Thrash Metal album - Metallica defined the genre together with bands like Slayer and Megadeth.
2. Seventh Son is IMO not even a prog-related album. The eponymous song *is* progressive, but most of the other songs are typical Maiden songs. Very simple chord structures and rhythms, and the occasional rhythm and/or key changes are commonplace even in AOR ... they're not adventurous enough to qualify as prog.
But that's just my opinion!
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this is the first time I hear a genre called "progressive thrash metal"!!!! besides, Slayer and Megadeth's music are way too heavier than Metallica's. Honestly, I couldn't stand listening to a Slayer album all the way through, and even Megadeth was a bit hard for me (when I was into all kinds of heavy music!). I really wonder where the heck is the progressive element in Slayer's music...
as for 7th Son, Moonchild's synth intro, Infinite Dreams' melody, and The Prophecy's beautiful acoustic guitar outro give me the feeling that only prog gives. (I haven't listened to the album for ages, though) Can I play with Madness, The Evil That Men Do and Only the Good Die young are indeed typical Maiden songs (NWoBHM), which I'd classify as fillers in this instance (Maiden lovers, just don't bash me!) The Clairvoyant is a bit above these tracks.
taking the title track's length, the "prog percentage" of this album must be higher than 25%, mind you!
what the heck, I'm not even a Maiden fan anymore
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Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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NutterAlert
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:07 |
I have always disliked Iron Maiden's style of music. However, I have to say, I do like their new album.
So to answer the question...I don't know
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Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 06:01 |
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Tony R
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 05:59 |
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but...they have been added as Prog-Related...which..um...isnt Prog...if some of their songs "are" Prog then they quite obviously are prog-related..
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 05:55 |
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^ sorry, but I beg to differ:
1. I wouldn't call Master of Puppets a prog-metal album. It's simply not a part of that genre. It's a progressive Thrash Metal album - Metallica defined the genre together with bands like Slayer and Megadeth.
2. Seventh Son is IMO not even a prog-related album. The eponymous song *is* progressive, but most of the other songs are typical Maiden songs. Very simple chord structures and rhythms, and the occasional rhythm and/or key changes are commonplace even in AOR ... they're not adventurous enough to qualify as prog.
But that's just my opinion!
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Bilek
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 05:18 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
If Metallica also get added: yes. Otherwise: no.
I was initially against the addition of bands like Iron Maiden. Now that they're here it would be very inconsistent to not add bands like Metallica, who - among some blatantly non-prog albums - released some fine & innovative albums which are IMO much more prog related than anything Iron Maiden ever did.
But that's just my personal opinion.
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I agree with you to a great extent. Metallica produced IMHO the greatest prog-metal albums of all times: Master of Puppets and ...and Justice for All. Ride the Lightning and black album are also worthy mentions. I really don't see why people keep on classifying them as thrash metal ... yet, Iron Maiden's Seventh Son of a Seventh Son is no less prog than those. Powerslave is also fine. I doubt about the others, they never admitted themselves as "prog" in the first place (though they covered a bunch of prog songs, notably that of Nektar) besides, they are known as a key innovator of NWoBHM...
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Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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Australian
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Joined: June 13 2006
Location: Australia
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:57 |
They have already been added, there's nothing you can do, just get over it.
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Asphalt
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:50 |
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actually, this raises another itneresting question: how related to prog an artist has to be to be considered Prog Related? I mean, are we talking about "wants-to-be-prog-but-doesn't-quite-make-it" bands or "wanted-to-make-good-music-and-ended-up-making-prog-without-knowing-themselves" bands?
i.e. Death never meant to be categorized as progressive, they just wanted to sing some innovative death and technical metal; same with some other bands within the prog related spectrum
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R o V e R
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Posted: October 03 2006 at 04:41 |
cool
Edited by R o V e R - October 03 2006 at 04:57
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Should Iron Maiden have been put on the A
