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Ivan_Melgar_M 
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 Posted: September 14 2007 at 00:28 |
Most of theior albums ubtil "The Grand Illusion" were MAINLY Prog, but IMHO not completely, the mainstream element, call it Rock, AOR or POP depending on the era, was always present.
So I believe Prog Related is more than OK
Iván
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The Rock
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 22:12 |
Most of their albums up to ''Pieces of eight'' were prog IMHO.
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What's gonna come out of my mouth is gonna come out of my soul."Skip Prokop"
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micky
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 19:44 |
 salmacis wrote:
'The Grand Illusion' is still prog, IMHO, with the
exception of 'Superstars' (this one is very Broadway and not to
my tastes) and 'Miss America' (a decent enough slab of heavy
rock). Even 'Come Sail Away' has a great keyboard mid section. It's
after that album they lost any real of trace of prog, IMHO.
Their first 3 or 4 albums are prog, but I don't think they are particularly good prog. That's besides the point though, really. |
the question thus needs to be asked..... is that enough to be
classified HERE in a prog category. Being prog fans... if one
wanted to hear some prog Styx... the category Prog Related says nothing
about their prog music. In my mind there is a 3 or 4 album line
in the sand. Not proposing their moving (so don't get up in arms
people).... but asking you James.. what do you think. I raised
this issue some time back in another thread.. and typically... got
little to no response.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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jimmy_row
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 19:35 |
salmacis wrote:
'The Grand Illusion' is still prog, IMHO, with the exception of 'Superstars' (this one is very Broadway and not to my tastes) and 'Miss America' (a decent enough slab of heavy rock). Even 'Come Sail Away' has a great keyboard mid section. It's after that album they lost any real of trace of prog, IMHO.
Their first 3 or 4 albums are prog, but I don't think they are particularly good prog. That's besides the point though, really. |
I agree with most that Grand Illusion is overall the best album, but they had some scattered moments of brilliance on the Wooden Nickel label (despite the fact that they were all but left in the dark). A Day is an indication of what they could've done had Dennis and JC learned to combine their styles more often and Father OSA hints at the upbeat hard rock sound they would develop in the future but with very clear progressive leanings. The title track from A Man of Miracles is great as well, edged out in pomposity only by ELP themselves.
On the whole, I believe Styx catch too much flack for the huge missteps they made, while most passer-by's ignore the quality progressive and hard rock material they made in their prime.
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Raff
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 14:26 |
salmacis wrote:
'The Grand Illusion' is still prog, IMHO, with the exception of 'Superstars' (this one is very Broadway and not to my tastes) and 'Miss America' (a decent enough slab of heavy rock). Even 'Come Sail Away' has a great keyboard mid section. It's after that album they lost any real of trace of prog, IMHO.
Their first 3 or 4 albums are prog, but I don't think they are particularly good prog. That's besides the point though, really. |
Exactly!  ProgArchives aims to be a complete database of prog music, and that includes the bad together with the good. There are a lot of bands I dislike here, but I would never dream of saying they should be removed because I don't like them. And then, we should always be careful of passing judgment on bands or artists whose output we know only marginally.
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salmacis
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 14:09 |
'The Grand Illusion' is still prog, IMHO, with the exception of 'Superstars' (this one is very Broadway and not to my tastes) and 'Miss America' (a decent enough slab of heavy rock). Even 'Come Sail Away' has a great keyboard mid section. It's after that album they lost any real of trace of prog, IMHO.
Their first 3 or 4 albums are prog, but I don't think they are particularly good prog. That's besides the point though, really.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Joined: April 27 2004
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 11:47 |
pero wrote:
Sorry I heart your feelings, I didn't know that you are so fond of Styx. 
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No Pero, not particulary a fan,as a fact the album I like more is The Grand illusion, an album that is mainly non Prog, but you can't judge a book by the cover as you can't judge a 30 years career for one studio album and one "The Best of" that normally has the worst and/or the most commercial tracks.
Iván
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pero
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Location: Croatia
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Posted: September 13 2007 at 03:14 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
pero wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
pero wrote:
No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop |
Have you heard their firstb three albums?
If you don't believe they are Prog, well I don't get what Prog is.
Iván |
No I didn't . I had only "Grand illusions" and "Paradise theatre" as a vinyls and best of on CD. |
Then Pero, how can you say ttheyb are exclusively a POP band?
You haven't heard:
- Styx
- Styx II
- The Serpant is Rising
This first three are 80% or 90% Prog (If tthey were 100% they would be in a Prog Genre not in Prog Related), they even released Movement for a Common Man 5 years before ELP did it.
Neither you have heard:
- Man of Miracles
- Equinox
- Crystakl Ball
This three albums are more mainstream oriented but still they keep a healthy balance between Prog ansd mainstream, even The Grabnd Illusion has really Prog tracks as Fooling Yourself.
You can't judge Styx exclusively in Come sail Away, Babe and Mr Robotto, that's like the guys who say "Hey Kansas was an AOR band" but they only heard "Dust in the Wind" and maybe "Point of Know Return" (The song, because Closet Chronicles, He Knew, Hopelessly Human, etc, are full Prog tracks).
Nobody can give a atetment as strong as "No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop" unless he has heard a representative number of albums that cover all the eras of the band,mainly when this band is 35 years old and has changed radically during their long lasting career.
Iván
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Sorry I heart your feelings, I didn't know that you are so fond of Styx.
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jammun
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 14 2007
Location: United States
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Points: 3449
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Posted: September 12 2007 at 22:56 |
Well, I'm perusing the forum here and might as well make a few enemies.
I've heard some of the early stuff -- I owned the first album but who knows where it is now. If we are to consider Styx as a prog band, based on the early albums, then surely they would have to rank amongst the worst. At least they became competent when they went AOR.
Edited by jammun - September 12 2007 at 23:09
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debrewguy
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Posted: September 12 2007 at 14:26 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
pero wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
pero wrote:
No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop |
Have you heard their firstb three albums?
If you don't believe they are Prog, well I don't get what Prog is.
Iván |
No I didn't . I had only "Grand illusions" and "Paradise theatre" as a vinyls and best of on CD. |
Then Pero, how can you say ttheyb are exclusively a POP band?
You haven't heard:
- Styx
- Styx II
- The Serpant is Rising
This first three are 80% or 90% Prog (If tthey were 100% they would be in a Prog Genre not in Prog Related), they even released Movement for a Common Man 5 years before ELP did it.
Neither you have heard:
- Man of Miracles
- Equinox
- Crystakl Ball
This three albums are more mainstream oriented but still they keep a healthy balance between Prog ansd mainstream, even The Grabnd Illusion has really Prog tracks as Fooling Yourself.
You can't judge Styx exclusively in Come sail Away, Babe and Mr Robotto, that's like the guys who say "Hey Kansas was an AOR band" but they only heard "Dust in the Wind" and maybe "Point of Know Return" (The song, because Closet Chronicles, He Knew, Hopelessly Human, etc, are full Prog tracks).
Nobody can give a atetment as strong as "No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop" unless he has heard a representative number of albums that cover all the eras of the band,mainly when this band is 35 years old and has changed radically during their long lasting career.
Iván
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Don't forget Far Beyond These Castle Walls & Man in the Wilderness from Grand Illusion, Lord of the Rings from Pieces of Eight, and special mention of Suite Madame Blue on Equinox. Too many times, popular bands are debased because some folks here exhibit a belief that commercial success somehow is not compatible with a progressive attitude or approach to music (see Rush, Dream Theater, Collins-era Genesis, 80s Yes, ELO,Pink FLoyd).
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
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Posted: September 12 2007 at 14:04 |
pero wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
pero wrote:
No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop |
Have you heard their firstb three albums?
If you don't believe they are Prog, well I don't get what Prog is.
Iván |
No I didn't . I had only "Grand illusions" and "Paradise theatre" as a vinyls and best of on CD. |
Then Pero, how can you say ttheyb are exclusively a POP band?
You haven't heard:
- Styx
- Styx II
- The Serpant is Rising
This first three are 80% or 90% Prog (If tthey were 100% they would be in a Prog Genre not in Prog Related), they even released Movement for a Common Man 5 years before ELP did it.
Neither you have heard:
- Man of Miracles
- Equinox
- Crystakl Ball
This three albums are more mainstream oriented but still they keep a healthy balance between Prog ansd mainstream, even The Grabnd Illusion has really Prog tracks as Fooling Yourself.
You can't judge Styx exclusively in Come sail Away, Babe and Mr Robotto, that's like the guys who say "Hey Kansas was an AOR band" but they only heard "Dust in the Wind" and maybe "Point of Know Return" (The song, because Closet Chronicles, He Knew, Hopelessly Human, etc, are full Prog tracks).
Nobody can give a atetment as strong as "No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop" unless he has heard a representative number of albums that cover all the eras of the band,mainly when this band is 35 years old and has changed radically during their long lasting career.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - September 12 2007 at 14:06
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pero
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Joined: July 11 2005
Location: Croatia
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Points: 1242
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Posted: September 12 2007 at 07:36 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
pero wrote:
No, Styx are not prog-pop, they are only pop |
Have you heard their firstb three albums?
If you don't believe they are Prog, well I don't get what Prog is.
Iván |
No I didn't . I had only "Grand illusions" and "Paradise theatre" as a vinyls and best of on CD.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Joined: April 27 2004
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Posted: September 11 2007 at 02:42 |
Easy Money wrote:
I do not get why bands for adolescents like Styxx, ELO and Queen are considered more prog than adult music like Bowie or Hendrix. It is a matter of substance as oppossed to Spinal Tap like appearances. |
Are you sure of what you are saying?
STYX, Queen and ELO are anything but teen or adolescent bands, their fanbase covered a wide range of ages and hardly most of them were teens.
Iván
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Easy Money
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Joined: August 11 2007
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Posted: September 10 2007 at 22:17 |
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I do not get why bands for adolescents like Styxx, ELO and Queen are considered more prog than adult music like Bowie or Hendrix. It is a matter of substance as oppossed to Spinal Tap like appearances.
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Raff
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Posted: September 07 2007 at 09:29 |
salmacis wrote:
IMHO, Styx should be considered prog. Far too often here, people judge the band on 'Babe', 'The Best Of Times' etc (all of which I personally hate; hardly anything the band recorded after 'Pieces Of Eight' does a thing for me). The same happens with Kansas; they hear the hits and think that they are just AOR.
From the debut through to 'The Grand Illusion' (their most progressive album), Styx had varying degrees of prog on their albums. There was also a heavy rock influence, too, of course. I personally thought most of their first few albums were quite poor to be honest (especially the debut) but they are prog albums, IMHO. People should listen to, say, tracks like 'Suite Madame Blue', 'The Grand Illusion' and 'Castle Walls', then call them a pop band, rather than those godawful ballads and pseudo novelty songs of later years. |
I'm no expert on Styx, and they've never interested me much to be honest, but to state they're nothing than a pop band - on the strength of their later, AOR output - is akin to saying that Genesis are nothing but a pop band because they released "Invisible Touch" or "We Can't Dance". Perhaps some people should try to LISTEN to a band first before making such sweeping statements.
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salmacis
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Posted: September 07 2007 at 06:58 |
IMHO, Styx should be considered prog. Far too often here, people judge the band on 'Babe', 'The Best Of Times' etc (all of which I personally hate; hardly anything the band recorded after 'Pieces Of Eight' does a thing for me). The same happens with Kansas; they hear the hits and think that they are just AOR.
From the debut through to 'The Grand Illusion' (their most progressive album), Styx had varying degrees of prog on their albums. There was also a heavy rock influence, too, of course. I personally thought most of their first few albums were quite poor to be honest (especially the debut) but they are prog albums, IMHO. People should listen to, say, tracks like 'Suite Madame Blue', 'The Grand Illusion' and 'Castle Walls', then call them a pop band, rather than those godawful ballads and pseudo novelty songs of later years.
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The Whistler
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Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
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Posted: September 07 2007 at 03:42 |
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No way, Styx did "Mr. Robotto?" That song is awesomely annoying!
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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The Whistler
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Posted: September 07 2007 at 03:41 |
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No way, Styx did "Mr. Robotto?" That song is awesomely annoying!
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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meinmatrix
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Posted: September 06 2007 at 14:43 |
I think they could be called as Cock Fonkers unless Whistler objects. 
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Tony R
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Posted: September 06 2007 at 14:16 |
ghost_of_morphy wrote:
I like the prog pop label. It's appropriate for bands that you can't accuse of selling out because they never quite made it in to begin with. |
Styx were huge in the USA. Paradise Theater got to number 1 in the main album chart. They are probably amongst the top 10 biggest-selling bands on this site...
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Should Styx be considered as Prog?
