We -need- progressive rap.

Sorry

 I’m 28 years old;

Old fashioned person ; prefer symphonic rock;

I do like some of the rap music like ‘vanilla ice’ – ice ice baby

Rap is different than prog

if you have interasting prog rap music ; please let me know

i'm open to idea

Well, it's time to answer some agressive comments:

Ty 1020 wrote:

And Ivan, what rap artists are you familar with? When you say that rap is fundamentally commercial, it leads me to believe that you've only heard the commercial rappers, none of whom I find to be representative of the genre as a whole. Underground rap isn't an exception at all, it represents the majority of music in the genre...

Read my whole post, I already said I listened rap in commercial radios, the same commercial radios in which I listened The Who, Yes, King Crimson and early Genesis (of course during the classic Rock hours) but I never heard a decent Rap song in any hour of the day.

But let me ask you a question. All the rap played in the radios is crap and represents at least 90% of the ghenre (if not more).

UNDRGROUND RAP? In your own words you're giving me the reason, undergrown means bellow the ground, hidden, almost not noticeable for most of the world, then by YOUR definition we're talking about an exception.

Ty 1020 wrote:

It's like me hearing We Can't Dance and Owner of a Lonely Heart on the radio and judging prog based on that kind of thing.

Owner of a Lonely Heart or We Can't dance are not progressive rock songs, so you can't judge Progressive Rock for something that it's not Progressive Rock!!!!

MC Hammer. Eminem, Vanilla Ice and all the crap played in the radios IS RAP, so I'm judging rap with  Rap examples. 

BePink theater wrote:

This is a completly ignorant statement. The essence of rap is actually the same as the essence of blues and gospel music. It comes straight form the heart.

In fiirst place, there are some rules of respect in the forums, if you read my posts I never called ignorant to any member talking in favor of Rap Prog or called their statements ignorant, so I ask the same treatment to myself, I believe I'm entitled to it because of my behaviour.

Then, again read my posts I'M TALKING ABOUT THE STRUCTURAL ESSENSE, I don't know if Rap comes from the heart or from the wallets of the artists, and to be honest I couldn't care less, all those words are cliché, the heart is only a bomb that pumps blood to the lungs, no sentiment or feeliing can come from there.

Music comes from the brain, Progressive Rock is an intelligent genre, because most musicians require a formal education, capacity, virtuosism, abbility to blend elements of different nature without sounding artificial, etc. Most Rap is not an intelligent genre, the vast musicians of this genre have no formation at al or maybe small, they don't try to blend elements or anything similar, their works don't improve, they just repeat a profitable formula, so I believe both genres are like water and oil.

Of course there's an emotional component, there's no Prog' without it, but Prog without feeling can exist, there ar a lot of very technicall but cold bands that sound well, but feeling alone is not enough for Progressive Rock, just check the background of most Prog musicians and he background of most rappers. 

May sound snobbish, but it's a fact. most soloist have classical or formal musical education, and each band has at least one of two members clasically trained.

MOST Rap is an easy way to earn millions for people that have a few or not any musical talent, most rappers are guys just speak fast with a repetitive rhythm and talk about the unfair system wearing a $ 10,000 gold chain on their necks.

BePink theater wrote:

Then you say that we shouldnt mix oil and water. What the fuc k do you think Progressive rock is?!

Classical Music, Rock, Jazz. Folk etc are genres based in melody, rhythm, structures and can blend perfectly, there are a lot of examples of Classical blending with Jazz, even berore Rock existed and Jazz is an ancester of Rock, so they can also blend perfectly.

MOST Rap is only the repetition ad nauseam of one single chord along 3 or 4 minutes so it has absolutely nothing in common with Rock, Classical or even Jazz.

BePink theater wrote:

Its people like you that slow down the revoloution of music. We cannot be closed minded if we want to continue prog.

You're wrong, the people that slow musical evolution are from the musical industry that spend millions (and earn more millions) on untalented Rappers. Hip Hoppers and Boys/Girls Band musicians, but refuse to take the risk to support talented musicians with a solid formation, and also those millions of musical listeners that don't care about the quality oif the musician but only about how well Eminem dress, how cute Britney is, how cool and accepted by society they feel when listening this pseudo music.

Be Pink Theater wrote:

Oh come on!  What were talking about would be a moderne compser using a gothic structure to incorperate and and new flavour to his moderne ideas. and that would be considered Moderne Classical

Again read my post, I'm talking about Gothic Classical musical structure, instruments, tempo, etc played by a musician born in the Modern era, not about a fusion of two eras, read before you answer.

Just as an example, Wagner was playing complex modern music in the beginnings of the Romantic era.

Despite he was a Romantic composer based on hisf birth certificate, his music is essentially modern and adventurous, who dared before to make a 16 hours work like The Ring of the Nibelungen?

Iván

Prsonaly, if there wa any such thing as a prog rap band, they would have to be very good instrumentaly and make full use of that. I cant stand rap for two reasons:

1. The mainstream stuff is the only stuff ive heard so its the only thing ive got to go on but it lacks any sort of skill in any department and i find it rather vulgar and crass.
2. I like listening to people sing that means stratching their vocals and using different notes for different lengths of time, rap in essance has nothing of the sort and so i can never truly like it because a rapers talants would always be second best to a singers.

If, however, any band wishes to go "prog rap" then good for them and i will give them a listen to find out what its like.

ivan_2068 wrote: Imagine a hip-hop group that uses special instruments, experiments with electronics and effects (beyond the standard ones), uses different vocal techniques (i.e. improvisation and effects), makes long epic songs with plenty of inventive beats, rhythm changes and instrumental interludes.  It would still sound like hip hop (or trip-hop), but it would be like nothing that's ever been done.  it's possible.. Things are determined by their essense, if all about you're talking is added to Rap or Hip Hop then it would go against Rap or Hip Hop essence and would be something different. If a modern Classical Composer starts playing with Gothic Classical instruments, Gothic tempo and Gothic structure he will cease to be modern, his music will be Classical Gothic done today but would never be considered Modern Classical. Iván

Oh come on!  What were talking about would be a moderne compser using a gothic structure to incorperate and and new flavour to his moderne ideas. and that would be considered Moderne Classical

No way,rap is for suckersI`m not really into categorising music,but if you mean rap like in talking lyrics and that other sh*t.No wayAnd by the way,before someone starts saying that i`m ignorant and so on.I really am not,its just that talking music is not something i see in the future for prog.