The Motorsport Thread (was the F1 thread)

Well, it's time for the German GP!
Looks like Webber has grabbed pole

1	14	Mark Webber	Red Bull-Renault	1:31.257	1:38.038	1:32.230	1
2	23	Rubens Barrichello	Brawn-Mercedes	1:31.482	1:34.455	1:32.357	2
3	22	Jenson Button	Brawn-Mercedes	1:31.568	1:39.032	1:32.473	3
4	15	Sebastian Vettel	Red Bull-Renault	1:31.430	1:39.504	1:32.480	4
5	1	Lewis Hamilton	McLaren-Mercedes	1:31.473	1:39.149	1:32.616	5
6	2	Heikki Kovalainen	McLaren-Mercedes	1:31.881	1:40.826	1:33.859	6
7	20	Adrian Sutil	Force India-Mercedes	1:32.015	1:36.740	1:34.316	7
8	3‡	Felipe Massa	Ferrari	1:31.600	1:41.708	1:34.574	8
9	4‡	Kimi Räikkönen	Ferrari	1:31.869	1:41.730	1:34.710	9
10	8	Nelson Piquet, Jr.	Renault	1:32.128	1:35.737	1:34.803	10
11	6	Nick Heidfeld	BMW Sauber	1:31.771	1:42.310		11
12	7	Fernando Alonso	Renault	1:31.302	1:42.318		12
13	17	Kazuki Nakajima	Williams-Toyota	1:31.884	1:42.500		13
14	9	Jarno Trulli	Toyota	1:31.760	1:42.771		14
15	16	Nico Rosberg	Williams-Toyota	1:31.598	1:42.859		15
16	5	Robert Kubica	BMW Sauber	1:32.190			16
17	12	Sébastien Buemi	Toro Rosso-Ferrari	1:32.251			17
18	21	Giancarlo Fisichella	Force India-Mercedes	1:32.402			18
19	10	Timo Glock	Toyota	1:32.423			201
20	11	Sébastien Bourdais	Toro Rosso-Ferrari	1:33.559

sleeper wrote: James wrote: So Max Moseley is standing down in October and the F1 issue is apparently sorted again. Good news. Spoke too soon James! Apparantly he didnt like the tone of the FOTA teams press releases after Wednesday's deal, particularly the part saying that he was a dictator, so is threatening to stand for re-election again. Certainly seems to confirm that he's a petty, spiteful b*****d to me.

What no!!! So close.

Like I keep saying, he IS the son of a fascist. Explains his actions and attitude perfectly.

  Just get Mosley out of here....

James wrote: Ralf Schumacher has moved to DTM too, I gather.  Interesting move.

Indeed he is, he's in his second year there and is just as much a waste of space in the Mercedes now as he was in the Toyota in his last year of F1. Mercedes should never have given him an 09 spec car, Jamie Green would have done so much better with that equipment

Yep, Hülkenberg and Paffett are both test drivers for F1 but also still race separately.

I dont think Paffet is a test driver anymore, since in season testing is now banned and McLaren already have Pedro de la Rosa, theres no need to keep Paffet on. Still, he's winning races in DTM this year and would be a good bet to get a seat with Manor Grand Prix for next year.

However, some drivers in the past have come up through the ranks and not done that well.  Like Piquet, Jr., Bourdais (although put him in a better car and we may see what he's like) and a few others.

Piquet is definetely underperforming but he's not helped by a poor Renault.Bourdais' problem is that he likes an understeery car, and the Toro Rosso is oversteery by nature. He's still outracing Buemi though.

Also, what's Pantano like (actually, I just looked him up again and forgot he was in F1 and was not especially great, despite his good record in GP2)?

Pantano is quick but nothing special, though with 3 new teams on the grid for next year he has a good shot at a seat.

Oh and Bruno Senna may also get a seat... that's if F1 doesn't have a split.

Same as Pantano, though he would be more deserving of an F1 place IMO. He's currently racing the French ORECA AIM cars in the Le Mans Series, and is proving very quick there a well.

And I think Piquet, Jr. may not even last the season, unless he picks up... meaning Grosjean may get a seat earlier than expected. Also don't forget Kobayashi is also a test driver for Toyota. I also think Fisichella may go at the end of the season.  He's been around for in F1 for ages now and hasn't really done much.

Piquet will probably last the year, but thats it. Kobayashi won the GP2 Asia series this winter but hasnt done too well in the main series. He is Toyota backed though. Fisichella is aparantly considering retirment at the end of the year.

Yea, I've been wondering where Bruno Senna is!

And must agree with Giancarlo.....he had some good years with Renault but he is just done now.

Hulkenberg is the current Williams test driver and a former A1GP champ, I'd be surprised if he didnt make it onto the grid in the next couple of years. Romain Grosjean is the top driver in GP2 this year at the moment and will probably get Piquet's seat next year, definitely a good driver.

Unfortunetly the DTM seems to be a good holding ground for young brits with lots of talent but no money to move on, there's Paffet, Paul Di Resta, Jamie Green and Oliver Jarvis and all of them woul/can do very well in F1.

I'm hoping Hulkenberger (sp.) gets a seat in the future.  His record in lower levels is excellent and it would be interesting to see how he does at F1.

The same with Gary Paffett.

To hold F1 the circuits need to hold a Grade 1 track liscence, and I bleive Indy is the only track in America that has one. The rest are either too short to bother with or need a huge upgrade in safty standards.

^The NASCAR problem came from it being a diamond ground track surface being exceptionally abrasive and the cars weigh the best part of 2 tons, a combination that led to rediculus levels of tyre were, which they might just have got over.

Its not Dubai, its Abu Dhabi, one of the other Emirets that has the GP.

Toyota were the only team to suffer failures at Indy (one on each car I think) but I saw close ups on the McLaren through the banking showing a huge amount of flex in the outside tyre wall of the left hand tyres. It was like an orang or a grapefruit wa bulging out of there, very scary when you think they'e doing 200mph. Michelin reckoned nobody was going more than 10 to 15 laps on those tyres, and Toyota probably less. That year tyres had to last a hole race so I'm guessing there was a change in side wall construction to allow them to work well as well as be durable.

First, the '05 USGP. Yea, I knew all that, just wondering if anyone believed the "Indygate" theory and it was the FIA's attempt to kill F1 in the US. I don't buy it, and agree with you it was just everyone's fault and no will to compromise.
Although if I remember correctly all the tire problems happened on one team. And Indy never had problems before....so maybe that team was just off and was putting more load on the tires? Ah well, water way under the bridge.


As for the future I thought Dubai was on the schedule for this season? As well as 2010 and '11 (with India as well in '11).
I guess I'm just a tradionalist non-European European...I'm all for expanding the sport especially considering so many countries are developing, but  I hop the base isn't sacraficed. I would expand the season to 20 races, enough for the tradtional races and newer tracks. Also, no more Spain having 2...Cataluntya is dull. Scrap it, replace with Valencia. The European GP should rotate bewteen various places. But hey....if I was the President of the FIA then I guess I could do that

Anyway, I really was surprised to read Mosley's dad was head of a British fascist party. Maybe explains his dominance and unwillingess to compromise!


Edited by JJLehto - June 21 2009 at 19:17