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Peter View Drop Down
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Points: 9669 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:24
I don't care one way or another -- I don't like dance music.
 
As with most humans, I wish her well, though.
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:25
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Originally posted by RoyFairbank RoyFairbank wrote:


For instance, I just proved she doesn't write her own material. We all know from looking at Prog credits what what I posted means.





It's fine that you don't believe she writes any of her own music, but you have an awfully strange definition of "proof."

a-hem:

Originally posted by surely the most incredible man to ever live surely the most incredible man to ever live wrote:




1. "Bad Romance"   Lady Gaga, RedOne < Producer and Music Writer
 4:55
2. "Alejandro"   Lady Gaga, RedOne < ditto
 4:34
3. "Monster"   Lady Gaga, RedOne, Space Cowboy <double dito
 4:09
4. "Speechless"   Lady Gaga <a "personal" song, so they play invisible
 4:30
5. "Dance in the Dark"   Lady Gaga, Fernando Garibay <click the link, ditto ditto
 4:48
6. "Telephone" (featuring Beyoncé) Lady Gaga, Rodney Jerkins, LaShawn Daniels, Lazonate Franklin, Beyoncé < double double double ditto
 3:40
7. "So Happy I Could Die"   Lady Gaga, RedOne, Space Cowboy 3:55
8. "Teeth"   Lady Gaga, Teddy Riley <ditto, click the stinkin' link

These are production people.... the old bald men I was talking about....

Gaga gets only one alone credit.... but this is common in Modern pop, they get credits just for singing (with auto-tune) LOOK AT BEYONSE, SHE GETS A CREDIT JUST FOR SINGING ON TELEPHONE SEE?

Interesting tidbit: Sal Cinquemani of Slant Magazine called the song (speechless) the lone "dud" from The Fame Monster and others called it a Fraud. Yet I'm sure she didn't actually write that one either. It was supposed to be a "personal" song so they gave her the lone credit. Come on people, learn your pop practices.



Edited by RoyFairbank - May 07 2010 at 22:28
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Points: 9869 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:27
Originally posted by gottagetintogetout gottagetintogetout wrote:

Someone dying their hair for a character kills the music for you?  You have a very strange view on musical quality.


Because only Fish and Gabriel get to dress up.  If anybody else does it, it's disgusting. Angry
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thellama73 View Drop Down
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:27
^^Yes, I saw it the first two times you posted it. Co-writing credits don't prove anything. By your logic, she could have written everything and those guys could have been given partial credit for some minor production details they added.

Edited by thellama73 - May 07 2010 at 22:27
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:30
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

^^Yes, I saw it the first two times you posted it. Co-writing credits don't prove anything. By your logic, she could have written everything and those guys could have been given partial credit for some minor production details they added.



They are professional songwriters who work with people like Brittany Spears. Look at the links. They weren't just sipping tea while Gaga twirled hits out of her fingers


btw. my references to her hair dying are because I like blondes and was making joke. OuchTongueCry
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:34
Donovan was a professional songwriter who appeared on Alice Cooper's "No More Mister Nice Guy" but didn't help write it. Paul McCartney was a professional songwriter who chomped carrots on the Beach Boys' "Vegetables" but didn't help write it. Those guys are also production geniuses, so that may be where their credits come from. Or maybe they helped polish out some rough edges in the songwriting, but there's no evidence that she wrote none of of it, as you claim.
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:41
Au Contraire if I could speak french

Where is the evidence that she wrote any of it? They aren't just production specialists as you claim. They are primarily song-writers, in fact, some of the best in the world. It is fashionable however to give stupid credits so the "artist" can save face. Come on you know this. When they write hits for Spears and her ilk, Destiny's child, etc. that is their job... they don't downgrade their job for one artist.

Further - alice cooper and Paul McCartney could obviously write and were playing in a time when they were expected to be able to do so. In the 80s people started using professional writers (though some genres had been doing so already and very much so in the 1960s). Even good bands with some experience in writing. Jefferson Starship for instance. But once the write-it-yourself generation of hit-makers went under - they are all in their 60s now - this current state of affairs took hold. Don't deny it.

1. "Me Against the Music" (featuring Madonna) Spears, Madonna, Christopher Stewart, Nikhereanye, Penelope Magnet, The-Dream, O'Brien Christopher "Tricky" Stewart & Penelope Magnet 3:44
2. "(I Got That) Boom Boom" (featuring Ying Yang Twins) Roy "Royalty" Hamilton, Royal, Holmes, Jackson Roy "Royalty" Hamilton 4:51
3. "Showdown" Spears, Cathy Dennis, Bloodshy & Avant, Jonback Bloodshy & Avant 3:17
4. "Breathe on Me" Lee, Anderson, Greene Mark "Metro" Taylor 3:43
5. "Early Mornin'" Spears, Moby, Christopher Stewart, Magnet Moby 3:45
6. "Toxic" Cathy Dennis, Bloodshy & Avant, Jonback Bloodshy & Avant 3:21
7. "Outrageous" R. Kelly R. Kelly 3:21
8. "Touch of My Hand" Spears, Harry, B. Muhammad, Soloman Jimmy Harry & Shep Soloman 4:19
9. "The Hook Up" Spears, Christopher Stewart, Nikhereanye, Magnet Christopher "Tricky" Stewart & Penelope Magnet 3:54
10. "Shadow" Spears, Lauren Christy, Scott Spock, Graham Edwards, Charlie Midnight The Matrix 3:45
11. "Brave New Girl" Spears, Brian Kierulf, Josh Schwartz, Kara DioGuardi Kierulf & Schwartz 3:30
12. "Everytime" Spears, Annette Artani Guy Sigsworth & Britney Spears 3:53

































































They even give writing credits to Spears


Edited by RoyFairbank - May 07 2010 at 22:49
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thellama73 View Drop Down
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:46
I don't deny it. But I also don't deny the possibility that a young lady who claims to write her own songs and talks at length about how she came up with the lyrics might be telling the truth.

Like I said, you have a right to believe what you want, but don't go calling it "proof" when it absolutely is not.


Edited by thellama73 - May 07 2010 at 22:48
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:51
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I don't deny it. But I also don't deny the possibility that a young lady who claims to write her own songs and talks at length about how she came up with the lyrics might be telling the truth.

Like I said, you have a right to believe what you want, but don't go calling it "proof" when it absolutely is not.


it is proof, think rationally - learn to generalize.

Without generalizations the world makes no sense. A scorpion would be mysterious every time and you wouldn't know to prevent yourself being stung.

btw, if you didn't notice, I replaced the album by spears I had for a moment with an earlier one when she had more "street" cred -when she was popular in 2003- and they gave almost all the writing credits and even a production credit.

notice one guy is named Roy "Royalty" Hamilton LOL classic!


Edited by RoyFairbank - May 07 2010 at 22:57
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thellama73 View Drop Down
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:54
Allow me to recap your argument in the form of a syllogism.
Premise A: Many of Lady Gaga's songs give co-writing credit to professional songwriters.
Premise B: Many of these songwriters have written songs for Britney Spears and other pop stars.
Conclusion: Lady Gaga has never written a note of original music.

Plato you ain't, sir.
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Points: 734 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:55
I love this thread. Its (mostly) intelliegent discussion on a name in pop who has become a meme in her own right.
That said, I hate her. Its her image. I usually try not to judge music based on image (which is the point of alot of Disney pop and such, of which Gaga is not a part of) but I think she tries to hard to come off as strange and abnormal. I respect the fact that she does have talent (though I'll admit I was suprised to find that out LOL) and I admire how much passion she stirs up among music fans... But she tries so hard to be the character shes created. Its fairly hollow and will get old quickly (unless she tries to be Madonna, and change her image every album... Actually I would be impressed if she was successful at that)
'Yeah, thats.. Whatever you're talking about for ya' - Zapp brannigan
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 22:59
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Allow me to recap your argument in the form of a syllogism.
Premise A: Many of Lady Gaga's songs give co-writing credit to professional songwriters.
Premise B: Many of these songwriters have written songs for Britney Spears and other pop stars.
Conclusion: Lady Gaga has never written a note of original music.

Plato you ain't, sir.


Aristotle invented the syllogism LOL

I told you about the strengths of induction

join the dark side llama Evil Smile





Edited by RoyFairbank - May 07 2010 at 23:02
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thellama73 View Drop Down
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:02
I'll never join you!
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:02
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I'll never join you!


seriously, though my friend, obviously she may have gone over the lyrics with someone... I learned recently of this charming case where T.E. Lawrence wrote a rough poem to express his love and sent it to the all-time famous poet Robert Graves to make it into a real poem. On a much pettier scale - that could happen with Lady GuyGuy
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thellama73 View Drop Down
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:10
I was really hoping you would take the bait and this would turn into a Star Wars quote thread. Unhappy
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Points: 9669 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:13
Gaga?Confused    GAH! Shocked
 
This is WAAAAAY cooler, kiddiwinks.  V
 
Would you prefer the original studio version:
 
 
or live?
 
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:19
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I was really hoping you would take the bait and this would turn into a Star Wars quote thread. Unhappy


wrong you were
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Peter View Drop Down
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Points: 9669 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:21
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSTU4Cnb4BY&feature=related
 
Mwa ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! LOL
 
 
goodnight.
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:26
Also, it might interest you to know that she was hired by her record label as a songwriter before she became a solo artist.
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/features/Lady-GaGa-Totally-GaGa.4891798.jp
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Points: 1072 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 07 2010 at 23:41
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Also, it might interest you to know that she was hired by her record label as a songwriter before she became a solo artist.
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/features/Lady-GaGa-Totally-GaGa.4891798.jp


I'll concede that she has a carefully-cultivated reputation as being a sort of songwriter and can probably play a decent piano but that the nature of the beast is that her pop career is a well-oiled machine and certainly none of the profit-interested people involved want to leave it to her, no matter how good her writing is.

In any case the involvement of the song-writing cabal suggests that on her own Gaga could not reach any where near the same levels that she did with her grade A assistance. In any case, everyone involved is aiming towards the same dubious goal: create a hit pop album. There is no artistical strain involved here - it is a matter of technique.

sorry, I've nodded off twice writing this. I need to hit the sack. Sleepy It's not complete....




Edited by RoyFairbank - May 07 2010 at 23:42
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