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sigod View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 04:09

The topic about USA's right to protect itself is an interesting one but i DO love those mellotrons too.

I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision.
- Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 04:15

Perhaps this should be in the 'Discussions not related to music'

Political and theological discussions can be very rewarding but can also cause problems. I am registered on numerous news forums, and vent my wrath and disgust at the world there. Not here.

This is where I come to de-stress from politics, religion and war

Marillion, pop?? Nah, I dont think so. This journalist dont know sh!t !!

 

Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 07:06

Phew!! I'm glad I went to beddybyes when I did!!!!

Just read this Fates and Gdub and then we will agree to differ!Hug

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/tm_objectid=14674177%26 method=full%26siteid=50143%26headline=cat%2dstevens%2dbrande d%2da%2d%2dthreat%2dto%2damericans%2d-name_page.html

 



Edited by Reed Lover



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 08:31
I think Salman Rushdie would disagree with labelling Mr.Islam a peace activist!
Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 08:38

So the evil Mr Islam was about to bring down America

Its incredible how a pacifist ex-pop singer can cause a minor security alert because of his faith. But, 19 Saudis with forged ID's can take flying lessons in the US, without any checks being done, then hi-jack 4 planes and fly them into the WTC and the Pentagon withouut the CIA, NORAD or anyone else for that matter batting an eye lid.

Funny old world...

Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 08:39

 Ermm A word to the wise: As this -- believe it or not -- is a website dedicated to progressive rock (and the goddess Mariah Carey), there is perhaps no better way to anger long-time  and new members, and cause them to leave, than to discuss (ie, argue and rant about) politics and/or religion, especially in an inflammatory fashion.

We come from all over, with differing sexual/political/religious orientations & beliefs, but we are at least united by a love of good music -- why risk dividing/destroying  our cozy little community? Stern Smile

I speak from experience.Disapprove

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Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 08:42
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Political and theological discussions can be very rewarding but can also cause problems. I am registered on numerous news forums, and vent my wrath and disgust at the world there. Not here.

This is where I come to de-stress from politics, religion and war

Clap Hear hear! That was more like it, Blacksword! Clap

"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 08:43

 

"We come from all over, with differing sexual/political/religious orientations & beliefs, but we are at least united by a love of good music -- why risk dividing/destroying  our cozy little community? Stern Smile"

I agree with my friend Peter Rideout on that.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 08:54

I also agree so no more outbursts from me towards Mr.Yusuf-I-Am-Only-A-Pacifist-When-It-Suits-Me-Islam.

Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 09:00

Peter

You've heard my last word on the subject

Beware: Politics the red rag the Blacksword bull....

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sigod View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 09:12

You can bet your bottom dollar that this incident (the plane boss, the plane!! ) will surface in a song on a forthcomming Marillion album.

That's my prediction, you heard it here first...

I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision.
- Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 09:22
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Peter

You've heard my last word on the subject

ClapThank God! Whoops -- I mean, Thank goodness! Wink

"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 09:26
Good observation,Sigod. After all, they did a song about "Estonia" and I don't think any of them were even on the ship at the time of the catastrophe so imagine what they can get out of an incident where every member of the band were present! We could be talking another concept album here..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 10:27
Originally posted by Reed Lover Reed Lover wrote:

I was going to post about all the "Rock Stars" who have been on the FBI's list of dangers to the American Way Of Life.

But one name suffices. It is like a hammer blow to your argument and your stupid governments:

John Winston Lennon RIP

Nuff said dont you think?

 Not quite RL. What sort of a pacifist was our John really? The type that supports murdering bastards perhaps?  http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/649397.stm

Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 10:45

What happened on 9/11 was a terrible act of murder, but I hope America doesn't wear out the sympathy of the rest of the world by over playing the victim card.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,1308176,00.html

(read the last four paragraphs to see what I mean)

Love to all on both sides of the pond.



Edited by emdiar
Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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sigod View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 11:00

Er..does anyone know if Marillion have played any Cat Stevens songs?

They are keen on the odd cover, I've heard them doing a version of Substitute by The Who.

I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision.
- Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 12:18
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

So the evil Mr Islam was about to bring down America

Evidently nothing brings down American... we just don't prefer being vulnerable anymore!

Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Its incredible how a pacifist ex-pop singer can cause a minor security alert because of his faith. But, 19 Saudis with forged ID's can take flying lessons in the US, without any checks being done, then hi-jack 4 planes and fly them into the WTC and the Pentagon withouut the CIA, NORAD or anyone else for that matter batting an eye lid.

I think you got that backwards, Blacksword... it wasn't because of his faith, many muslims come and go thru our airports daily...its because of his past and the fact that Interpol has him as a terrorist financial supporter... And afterall we are still on orange alert here.. which means we can't afford to ignore any information regardless on who he was... or even who he is now.  And thats due to the hi-jacked planes... not instead of...

Its fine that we only come here to discuss wonderful music.. and funny issues like Mariah, but it saddens me to see that so many seem to be able to judge our need for protection... when it wasn't the skies falling in on them. 

And I read all your attached articles... I don't see where it means we should alter our security rules for individuals who might of been pop stars 30 years ago.

And thats my last statement on it!

THIS IS ELP
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emdiar View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 13:09

Hi Threefates, Hug

Your need for protection is not in question 3', nor is that of the rest of the world. It's the methods employed that are to my mind highly questionable. George and Tony's adventures in Iraq have done nothing to 'protect' you and I, and have only helped to polarize two cultures, and inspire more  idealistic young zealots to take up arms against us. Bush was so wrong to call these fanatics "evil". To call them evil implies they are motivated by a sadistic and sociapathic lust to cause death and suffering, just for the hell of it. The truth is their motives are born of deeply held theological beliefs, and the handling of the current debacle in the Middle East is only breeding recrutes.

We can play the isolationist game if we like, but it's a lonely path to tread. I'm put in mind of Wilde's "The Selfish Giant".

Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 13:46
Originally posted by sigod sigod wrote:

Er..does anyone know if Marillion have played any Cat Stevens songs?

They are keen on the odd cover, I've heard them doing a version of Substitute by The Who.

 

I don't know but (former It Bites vocalist/guitarist) Francis Dunnery does a great cover of Cat Stevens' Father & Son on his (almost) essential Tall Blond Helicopter album, where vocally he sound like Stevens, then Gabriel before reverting to his own voice. Have said there are vocal inflection changes, it is still a very heart-felt version recorded as a tribute to his father who had just died.

 

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2004 at 13:57

Hi Emidar.. honey

Mr. Islam being pulled off the plane doesn't really have anything to do with the war in Iraq or Mr. Bush's or Mr. Blair's methods... it has to do with homeland security... and that I'm behind.  I'm not sure about what good the war in Iraq has done or not done... I'm sure that will always be a center of debate for years to come.. and both sides will claim some sort of victory... Thats just the way that works.

I also disagree with you about their motives being born from deeply held theological beliefs.  Like every other war, they continue to use that as an excuse and it might of started that way many years ago... but that is not what it is about today.  I know many muslim clerics here in NYC.. actually I've worked with the head of the Muslim community here in NYC, Imam Al-Hajj Talib W. 'Abdur-Rashid' and we've had many discussions in regard to how non-religious these terrorist groups really are.

Its not much different than the hatred instilled in the young brought up in Northern Ireland.  Its what your bred to think, not whats really truth any longer. I spent quite a lot of time with Muslim families in Malaysia.  You should of heard what they've been led to believe about Americans.  Of course, by the time I left, they probably had a whole different idea of Americans...

THIS IS ELP
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