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Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
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Points: 65521
Posted: September 12 2011 at 20:36
'Kitsch' has morphed somewhat; it seems to mean at once tacky/low-quality, sentimental, and ostentatious. But those are all completely different things.
Joined: September 12 2011
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 27
Posted: September 12 2011 at 20:51
Well, there was an Australian band in the mid 1970s called Kush which had a little bit of a progressive tendency (their guitarist David Herzog cites Steve Howe as an influence).
Their first album was called "Snow White And The Eight Straights", named after a description that Australian music afficionado Molly Meldrum gave them:
Their second album is called "Nah, Tellus Wh't Kush Means Yer Great Sausage".
The big single off this was "I'm Your Football" whose opening lines are:
"I'm your football, kick me I'm your icecream, lick me I'm your beauty queen, look at me I think I'm speeding, you can book me"
And it goes on like that...
Geoff Duff, the leader singer, was also going to do a concept album about two rival nations of sausages. He did all the cover art and the story, but it got lost in the mail on the way to the record label, so the record never got made. There's one song from it that exists on the Aztec Records CD re-issue of "Nah, Tellus Wh't Kush Means Yer Great Sausage"
All these elements make me consider this title a little kitsch, but overall I don't think progressive music is that kitsch. I'd rather enjoy it than laugh at it. Laugh with it if they're being playful and funny, and Kush for instance often are, while still understanding their sensibilities and the personalities in the band. I don't think it's something I'd ever roll my eyes at or anything.
Edited by AutumnWanderer - September 12 2011 at 20:55
Joined: September 06 2011
Location: Livermore, CA
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Points: 21
Posted: September 12 2011 at 21:24
After looking up "kitsch", I would have to say that some of the people that I know that like prog have been pseudo-intellects and more pretentious than the music is. There is a lot of talent and musicianship in prog that you don't get anywhere else.
Joined: September 12 2011
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 27
Posted: September 12 2011 at 23:35
feloniousgroove wrote:
After looking up "kitsch", I would have to say that some of the people that I know that like prog have been pseudo-intellects and more pretentious than the music is. There is a lot of talent and musicianship in prog that you don't get anywhere else.
What's the difference between a psuedo-intellect and an intellect? I hope that's not too off topic, just trying to understand.
I agree, with all the ideas and talent in progressive music, it is hard for me think of it overall as kitsch.
If Prog could be considered an inferior imitation of something it clearly borrows from then possibly, but given the sheer broad scope of differing influences from all the bands that are considered Prog, nah.
Joined: March 08 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 2461
Posted: September 13 2011 at 04:55
Rick Wakeman performing THE SIX WIVES live INSIDE Hampton Court Palace, wearing a glitter cape & accompanied by full choir and orchestra - most people would call that Kitsch, but Rick simply calls it "fun". I bought the DVD and I certainly enjoy most of it!
Rick Wakeman performing THE SIX WIVES live INSIDE Hampton Court Palace, wearing a glitter cape & accompanied by full choir and orchestra - most people would call that Kitsch, but Rick simply calls it "fun". I bought the DVD and I certainly enjoy most of it!
Yes it is fun to watch a little bit of kitschiness in prog. I had the same feeling watching the opera She (Caamora). When you see singers and musicians dressed up and playing music with a serious passion for their art. it's kind of funny and enteirtaining at the same time. I got the same feeling listening Neal Morse playing great music and almost crying at the same time with the effects of all the personal meaning of his lyrics. It doesn't have a clear relation with the term of Kitsch, because this has a subjective meaning.
To a certain point I guess you could call The Residents intentionally kitschy, but that´s mostly down to the tunes - not their outfits or strange personas. Third Reich n Roll along with the Commercial Album - I personally find to be pretty kitsch, but in a funny and purposeful way mind you.
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
Posted: September 13 2011 at 10:04
I think Kitsch is a completely subjective term. Also there's the question to how you react when you hear kitsch. My friend has often cited that "kitsch is good at times"- I tend to disagree. But again it's entirely subjective.
Is there kitsch in prog? In my eyes yes, much of it is flowing with kitsch. For me it's doing something to pompous or bombastic, covering some baroque piece on a Hammond, singing about Lord Of The f**king Rings or some other fantasy book.
Joined: August 15 2009
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 698
Posted: September 13 2011 at 10:29
My view of kitsch is something cheap, colorful, simple, mass-produced, conspicuous, undemanding with entertaining qualities, and a product of it's time, like fashion. So it's not a product of timeless values. Something that gets dated quickly but may gain a nostalgic value with time.
If that's right (and I can be wrong), nothing could be stranger than to call prog kitsch! Can music be kitsch?
Joined: June 03 2010
Location: Mississippi
Status: Offline
Points: 98
Posted: September 13 2011 at 12:37
wilmon91 wrote:
My view of kitsch is something cheap, colorful, simple, mass-produced, conspicuous, undemanding with entertaining qualities, and a product of it's time, like fashion. So it's not a product of timeless values. Something that gets dated quickly but may gain a nostalgic value with time.
If that's right (and I can be wrong), nothing could be stranger than to call prog kitsch! Can music be kitsch?
I agree that prog isn't kitsch. But some music can be kitsch. Example:
My standard for kitsch is the Dogs Playing Poker paintings. If any music reminds you of those, it's probably kitsch. I don't think about kitsch much anyway. Except when I see Dogs Playing Poker.
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Is prog kitsch?
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feloniousgroove wrote:
