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Should I give ELP another try?
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Tendiwa View Drop Down
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    Posted: April 15 2020 at 06:51
I like their first album, and that's the only one I kept. The other albums I've heard in the past were too much trying to mix in classical influences for my taste. I like it when bands use techniques derived from classical music, but I don't like it when rock bands try to actually sound classical or downright play classical pieces. To me it's like orchestras playing pop/rock music. It's gimmicky.
But with all the praise I see you guys give ELP, I'm thinking I should give them another try. But what album?
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You're going to find classical influences on most of their albums (including the debut). I guess you'd probably want to avoid Pictures at an Exhibition but maybe something else from their "classic" era e.g. Tarkus, Trilogy and Karn Evil 9.

Edited by chopper - April 15 2020 at 07:30
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I can identify with that, I am not a fan and also I prefer the first album by some distance. However (if I leave out the stuff that is dominated by classical influences) I still find Tarkus and Trilogy (the tracks I mean, not the whole albums) to be pretty irresistible pieces of genius rock music.
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To begin with, ELP are one of the few bands to transcend the genre.  They were the most exciting prog band - ever.  If you have any doubts, read Danny Baker's article on seeing ELP in 1971 in the latest ed of 'Prog' magazine.  It says it all - better than I could express.  Sadly, I was too young to see them in their prime - but I finally saw them at the Albert Hall in 92.  
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Tarkus doesn't really have any parts or songs that borrow from classical(at least not directly)so I suggest that one to get next.  
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Nyet
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I'm wearing my Tarkus shirt now so I'm going to say yes. 
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Originally posted by Argo2112 Argo2112 wrote:

I'm wearing my Tarkus shirt now so I'm going to say yes. 
Fanboy ;-)
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Tarkus and Trilogy deserve at least a few listens. 

Even ELPowell is worth checking out, just out of curiosity. 
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Originally posted by Argo2112 Argo2112 wrote:

I'm wearing my Tarkus shirt now so I'm going to say yes. 
 


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Nah.
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To give them a fair shake, you should at least check out the albums "Tarkus", "Trilogy" and "Brain Salad Surgery" (which is where you will find Karn Evil 9) as these are probably less "classically influenced" sounding (though most of their music is classically influenced).

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Originally posted by Tendiwa Tendiwa wrote:

I like their first album, and that's the only one I kept. The other albums I've heard in the past were too much trying to mix in classical influences for my taste. I like it when bands use techniques derived from classical music, but I don't like it when rock bands try to actually sound classical or downright play classical pieces. To me it's like orchestras playing pop/rock music. It's gimmicky.
But with all the praise I see you guys give ELP, I'm thinking I should give them another try. But what album?
 

Brain Salad Surgery is the one to revisit.
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The first album is very eclectic and varied but still as classically influenced as anything they did.

My brief summation of the other studio albums:

Tarkus- Side One is their masterpeice although I hardly evern listen to it as I much prefer the live version from Welcome Back My Friends 

Trilogy - Much more 'complete' and the lyrics are less Sc-fi dominated. Lake never sounded better and there is lots of lovely mini-moog, great piano work and hammond (on Hoedown) from Keith. Carl sounds a little less like he's had 10 cups of coffee. This album should be more appreciated imo.

Brain Salad Surgey - One for the fans maybe. Sci-fi themes dominates and Lake's voice is almost computerised. Palmer is amazing on this album if you are a conniseure of drumming. Up there with Peart on Moving Pictures and Bruford on Red. Lots of synths but a much more compressed sound production wise as Offord was no longer around.

Works Volume One - The second phase of the group after 3 years doing not much but a few solo projects. bills needed to be paid and that dominated the next few years.

Works Vol Two - Ditto

Love Beach - for a few dollars more

Emerson, Lake and Powell - the band returns with a different drummer and a heavily Yamaha GX1 dominated sound. Lake shouts a lot and it all comes across as so trying to recreate the past that it hurts.

Black Moon - Very decent late offering that is a bit overlooked . More song based but the Hammond returns and the Yamaha is consigned to history.

In The Hot Seat - sh*t!




Edited by richardh - April 16 2020 at 00:24
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Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

The first album is very eclectic and varied but still as classically influenced as anything they did.

My brief summation of the other studio albums:

Tarkus- Side One is their masterpeice although I hardly evern listen to it as I much prefer the live version from Welcome Back My Friends 

Trilogy - Much more 'complete' and the lyrics are less Sc-fi dominated. Lake never sounded better and there is lots of lovely mini-moog, great piano work and hammond (on Hoedown) from Keith. Carl sounds a little less like he's had 10 cups of coffee. This album should be more appreciated imo.

Brain Salad Surgey - One for the fans maybe. Sci-fi themes dominates and Lake's voice is almost computerised. Palmer is amazing on this album if you are a conniseure of drumming. Up there with Peart on Moving Pictures and Bruford on Red. Lots of synths but a much more compressed sound production wise as Offord was no longer around.

Works Volume One - The second phase of the group after 3 years doing not much but a few solo projects. bills needed to be paid and that dominated the next few years.

Works Vol Two - Ditto

Love Beach - for a few dollars more

Emerson, Lake and Powell - the band returns with a different drummer and a heavily Yamaha GX1 dominated sound. Lake shouts a lot and it all comes across as so trying to recreate the past that it hurts.

Black Moon - Very decent late offering that is a bit overlooked . More song based but the Hammond returns and the Yamaha is consigned to history.

In The Hot Seat - sh*t!


 

Excellent review Clap
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Originally posted by geekfreak geekfreak wrote:

Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

The first album is very eclectic and varied but still as classically influenced as anything they did.

My brief summation of the other studio albums:

Tarkus- Side One is their masterpeice although I hardly evern listen to it as I much prefer the live version from Welcome Back My Friends 

Trilogy - Much more 'complete' and the lyrics are less Sc-fi dominated. Lake never sounded better and there is lots of lovely mini-moog, great piano work and hammond (on Hoedown) from Keith. Carl sounds a little less like he's had 10 cups of coffee. This album should be more appreciated imo.

Brain Salad Surgey - One for the fans maybe. Sci-fi themes dominates and Lake's voice is almost computerised. Palmer is amazing on this album if you are a conniseure of drumming. Up there with Peart on Moving Pictures and Bruford on Red. Lots of synths but a much more compressed sound production wise as Offord was no longer around.

Works Volume One - The second phase of the group after 3 years doing not much but a few solo projects. bills needed to be paid and that dominated the next few years.

Works Vol Two - Ditto

Love Beach - for a few dollars more

Emerson, Lake and Powell - the band returns with a different drummer and a heavily Yamaha GX1 dominated sound. Lake shouts a lot and it all comes across as so trying to recreate the past that it hurts.

Black Moon - Very decent late offering that is a bit overlooked . More song based but the Hammond returns and the Yamaha is consigned to history.

In The Hot Seat - sh*t!


 

Excellent review Clap

This review misses the point that on the Works Tour, ELP were still sh*t hot live.  Anyone unconvinced by this should try the 'Live at Nassau' album.  The live versions of 'The Enemy God', 'Tank' and 'Pirates' - without the orchestra - are breathtaking.  Emerson skillfully rearranges those songs.  'Works Live' is also worth investigating - I was never a fan of 'Abaddon's Bolero' that gets a new lease of life as well. Oh, and 'Canario' off 'Love Beach' is storming as well - shame that was never performed live.
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Nah.


LOL

Really...the first one is all you really need...imho they never topped that one even with the much praised Tarkus track. 
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
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Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Nah.


LOL

Really...the first one is all you really need...imho they never topped that one even with the much praised Tarkus track. 

With the possible exception of Tocatta I don't think the drumming was ever better or at least more exciting than on the debut also. 
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You could take a slightly different approach if you are discouraged by the many classical references from the '70 to '74 period e.g. start with Black Moon from 1992 which is a vastly underappreciated collection of short symphonic Prog tunes where a welcome 'modern' economy is evident i.e. no long conceptual suites and just the one classical adaptation (Prokofiev but with a Hendrixy kinda vibe)
After that, the closest album that inhabits that stylistic spirit is maybe the ELPowell offering from 1986
I've always felt that if you took the classical influence out of ELP you would end up with something that resembles an Argent/Greenslade hybrid.
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Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

Emerson, Lake and Powell - the band returns with a different drummer and a heavily Yamaha GX1 dominated sound. Lake shouts a lot and it all comes across as so trying to recreate the past that it hurts.
 

I think Greg sounds just fine, especially on "The Miracle," "Touch and Go" and "Step Aside."

But I'm biased. I love that album. I like Black Moon, too (I saw them play at the Wiltern), but I think it's a little less consistent. I also prefer the version of "Romeo and Juliet" that's on Keith's Changing States, retitled "Montagues and Capulets."
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