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explodingjosh 
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: February 10 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 507 |
 Posted: January 18 2010 at 22:22 |
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I think the Pat Metheny Group is a prog fan's jazz band.
Especially to songs like As It Is, Are You Going With Me?, The Way Up, and Minuano (six eight) I guess the same could be said about the Mahavishnu Orchestra, or Return to Forever, in a different respect, but I think that the PMG is influenced more by 'standard' jazz, where those are more rock influenced. |
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Eapo_q42
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 15 2009 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 148 |
Posted: January 18 2010 at 23:13 |
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I like the idea of Jazz very much. The notion that the music has no boundaries, very appealing....
However, the sound of music just isn't what my taste demands. It's difficult to explain, but even though I like my music to be adventurous, I do enjoy it most within the framework of a rock sound. So with that in mind, I can say I like some Jazz, but prefer prog by a long distance. |
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The Quiet One
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: January 16 2008 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 15745 |
Posted: January 18 2010 at 23:22 |
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Yes, definitely, that's why Pat Metheny is barely named in the forum and is by no means as popular as RtF and Mahavishnu
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 01:26 |
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I won't vote because I have heard very little jazz compared to prog but loved whatever I heard and maybe one day I will in fact have to say that I like it more than prog.
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008 Location: Declined Status: Offline Points: 16715 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 01:47 |
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jampa, I missed your post until Rocktopus quoted it below me, but what the hell are you doing listening to Diana Krall? Did you go to the Grammys' website and randomly pick the first jazz artist you found? At least you didn't get Kenny G...
More importantly, Metheny is influenced by much more (this is going to sound insulting but I'm going to say it anyway) "sensitive" jazz. You could be forgiven for thinking you were watching the Weather Channel when listening to some of Pat Metheny, while MO and RTF kept more of the sharp edges of bebop even when in their more relaxed songs, and that edge is as important to the rock fan as rocking it up. However, I have to give him a great deal of credit for having the balls to release Song X, The Sign of 4, and Zero Tolerance for Silence. Not many successful musicians are willing to piss off their primary audience like that for the love of the music. And he's still stretching himself with things like the new orchestrion tour. He could have recorded another regular Pat Metheny album, and people still would have bought it, but he chose to go through all the effort of learning how to play a damn orchestrion.
Edited by Henry Plainview - January 19 2010 at 01:56 |
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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Rocktopus
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 02 2006 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 4202 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 01:48 |
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I don't mind, just stop pretending that you "get it". You're obviously clueless. Diana Krall? No wonder it hasn't clicked. -I don't like rock. I found a album in the rocksection by someone called Bryan or Ryan Adams. It was boring, and lacked energy and power. |
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Over land and under ashes
In the sunlight, see - it flashes Find a fly and eat his eye But don't believe in me Don't believe in me Don't believe in me |
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Rocktopus
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 02 2006 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 4202 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 02:20 |
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Sonny Sharrock is my favorite guitarist of all. I've never been a completist, but I need to own every little tone ever recorded by him 66-75. Guess I better check out James Ulmer.
I partly agree. Its easiest to simply wait with ECM and 70's jazz until you have plenty of 60's greats. But from the beginning to ca. 73-74, the ECM-catalogue contains plenty of essential albums. (I reccomend the labels Embryo, MPS and BYG Actuel-releases of the same period). Wait even longer with investigating the 80's, 90's jazz. It generally gets smother and sicker year by year. I'll admit I haven't really checked it out properly myself yet. Partly because I've enjoyed very little of what I have heard. |
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Over land and under ashes
In the sunlight, see - it flashes Find a fly and eat his eye But don't believe in me Don't believe in me Don't believe in me |
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PROGMONSTER2008
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 09 2007 Status: Offline Points: 610 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 02:30 |
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I love jazz rock, but I don't really get alot of enjoyment out of straight jazz. I love the way they play but not the tunes they write. But I love everything about jazz rock
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stefolof
Forum Groupie 
Joined: November 30 2009 Location: Kl Status: Offline Points: 59 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 03:15 |
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I started listening to jazz and prog rock about the same time. Now I feel that the records I like most are the ones that combines elements of both. What is creativity anyway, but the combination of two or more already existing ideas?
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bsms810
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 03 2009 Status: Offline Points: 363 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 03:47 |
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'when was the last time you had a girlfriend?'
'I dont look at it as when, I look at it as who...and why' - David Brent |
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Dick Heath
Special Collaborator 
Jazz-Rock Specialist Joined: April 19 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 12818 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 07:27 |
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First generation prog fans were more likely to hear rock and jazz plus classical in the mix, with many of the early prog groups, Nice, Soft Machine (first two albums), Yes's first album, Krimson, Brian Auger - hence a degree of inescapability. Some inevitability with an organ in the band's set of instrumentation, with the likes of Jimmy Smith influencing, add sax and Coltrane would often be the reference for saxophonists and drummers listening and trying to imitate Elvin Jones, Joe Morello, Art Blakey etc.
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The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS.
CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
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jampa17
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2009 Location: Guatemala Status: Offline Points: 6802 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 11:39 |
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Well... sarcasm at the side, I told you... I never said it's bad... and sometimes live with an unknown named band it could be interesting... but it lacks of energy for my tastes... and well... whatever, I can live without it and it doesn't mean that you have to become mad about it... I respect them as they are total master musicians... but their music is not appealing to me... so... carry on...
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008 Location: Declined Status: Offline Points: 16715 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:06 |
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jampa, you are missing the point entirely. Rocktopus was making fun of you because Diana Krall is in no way representative of jazz as a whole and you don't seem to care enough to learn that fact.
Do these lack energy too?
I don't mean to deride ECM, there's a lot of essential music on there, but when I think of the cornerstone of jazz, I don't think of ECM.
I don't pay attention to dates, but I've found plenty of good jazz in modern times. There's John Zorn, Okkyung Lee, Peter Evans, Charles Gayle, William Parker, and Henry Threadgill, to name a few off the top of my head, and legends like Evan Parker, Wadada Leo Smith, Peter Brotzmann, and Bill Dixon are still rocking. Edited by Henry Plainview - January 19 2010 at 20:39 |
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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Procol Harum Machine
Forum Newbie 
Joined: January 19 2010 Status: Offline Points: 36 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:10 |
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I believe jazz fusion spun off from prog. King Crimson was also influenced by free jazz, so you never know.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65603 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:37 |
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 that's a keeper |
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65603 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:39 |
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28%+ of voters like jazz as much or more than prog, pretty impressive considering
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jampa17
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2009 Location: Guatemala Status: Offline Points: 6802 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:39 |
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well Henry, to be honest with you... just the last one... the Machine gun thing appeals to me and sounds fine... if you ask me, yes... it lacks of energy... I know... they are playing hard and all... but I like a lot more metal or hard rock and entertain me most...
And Rocktopus didn't read that I put there Pastorius and Corea right...?? they are not representative of jazz as well...??? I like some jazz fusion but that's why I like those bands... for the rock edge that they put into their more musical orientation... as I said above... I respected them... but don't mind about jazz.. it bores me... and been honest.. that's all.. but if you suggest me a band that is hard enough... I'm willing to take a look...
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65603 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:43 |
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maybe but I doubt it, and suspect the jazzrockers would have done pretty much what they did had prog never occurred .. good bedfellows though, and there certainly was a crossover with guys like RTF, Colosseum, etc. ..another factor may be that, as jazz musicians, it was easier for them to do 'prog' than for proggers to do 'jazz' |
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008 Location: Declined Status: Offline Points: 16715 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:47 |
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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A Person
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 10 2008 Location: __ Status: Offline Points: 65760 |
Posted: January 19 2010 at 20:49 |
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Jampa17, try this:
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Do prog-fans like jazz?
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explodingjosh wrote:
music... and then some Jacko Pastorius and some other bands that I don't know their names but sounds the same... Chick Corea as well... Sorry... I don't put attention to the music that doesn't make the click with me...