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Harkmark 
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Joined: October 29 2005
Location: Norway
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 Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:33 |
Vikings at war on a mushroom trip.  I cannot really believe it. Some claim they ate red toadstool, some say psilocybin, but I do not think there is any consensus on this, or whether they actually did it before battles at all.
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oliverstoned
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:35 |
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That's very true. Another issue with products such as "Acid" is that you're not sure of what you get.
Whereas with mush or weed, you know what it is.
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mystic fred
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:41 |
it's all right for you "experienced" hippies to boast about dabbling in drugs in your youth then preaching to youngsters not to do it....you're encouraging them! you should be thoroughly ashamed of yourselves!!
DRUGS CAUSE BRAIN DAMAGE...PERIOD! no one ever gets away with it. don't believe all the NOSTALGIC rubbish you hear, people think drinking and drugs improves performance IT DOESN'T.
don't listen to these foolish ramblings! 
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oliverstoned
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:43 |
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So you never drink alcohol?
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Certif1ed
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:48 |
 mystic fred wrote:
it's all right for you "experienced" hippies to boast about dabbling in drugs in your youth then preaching to youngsters not to do it....you're encouraging them! you should be thoroughly ashamed of yourselves!![IMG]height=17 alt=Angry src="http://www.progarchives.com/forum/smileys/smiley7.gif" width=17 align=absMiddle>
DRUGS CAUSE BRAIN DAMAGE...PERIOD! no one ever gets away with it. don't believe all the NOSTALGIC rubbish you hear, people think drinking and drugs improves performance IT DOESN'T.
don't listen to these foolish ramblings![IMG]height=17 alt=Wink src="http://www.progarchives.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif" width=17 align=absMiddle>
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Quite right.
I am totally ashamed of all those nights spent wandering around fields, woods and mystic stone circles, watching bands like Hawkwind, Here & Now and the Ozric Tentacles playing with cosmic lightshows, and druids performing ages-old ceremonies, women dancing naked...
JUST SAY NO, KIDS!
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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mystic fred
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:49 |
nothing to do with alchohol, oliver, i'm talking about DRUGS! moderate amounts of alchohol can be beneficial, but drugs are for sick people. i recently read cannabis can relieve the symptoms of MS sufferers which would be fine for them, but healthy people taking drugs for experimentation is ludicrously stupid......agree?
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Harkmark
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Joined: October 29 2005
Location: Norway
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Points: 538
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 07:50 |
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I remember, after having eaten Psilocibyn, having the feeling that my mind was being sucked into a drain. I tried to fight it, which I probably should not have done. Then came the feeling of me and my friends having complete understanding of each others mental states and opinions, and the world "sub specie aeternitatis", without needing to say a word. (Looking in a mirror was very scary. Food was disgusting.)
Then came reality sneaking back, in its worst case scenario, only with focus on the hopelessness/pointlessness of everything...
I do not recommend it.
Edited by Harkmark - August 23 2006 at 07:51
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Sean Trane
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Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 08:03 |
mystic fred wrote:
nothing to do with alchohol, oliver, i'm talking about DRUGS! moderate amounts of alchohol can be beneficial, but drugs are for sick people. i recently read cannabis can relieve the symptoms of MS sufferers which would be fine for them, but healthy people taking drugs for experimentation is ludicrously stupid......agree?
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Fred
Alcohol is a drug whether you like it or not. A legal one, but a drug
Ditto with nicotine and caffeine
Canabis and even cocaine and heroin have medical properties and are legally importable in all countries provided they are severly controlled and used only for medication preparations. Even the US Custom have price list for these items.
Coca leaves are a miracle for high altitude, yet even for those heading for 5000m altitude, it is forbidden even in Peru. Why? >> because its commerce is uncontrollable and the Gov't cannot tax it.
As far as healthy people doing drugs, one must make a difference between the ones who do it socially and recreatively (like moi and apparently lots of us on the PA) and the ones who use it as a refuge .
Soft drugs (I include shrooms, and LSD in here) have little problem of physical dependency and only psychological dependancy on those who are pre-disposed to that weakness.
Yes, drugs can be dangerous! Hard Drugs are certainly dangerous!!
But how hypocrits could we be to those young people by lying to them about our own experiences?
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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oliverstoned
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 08:04 |
mystic fred wrote:
nothing to do with alchohol, oliver, i'm talking about DRUGS! moderate amounts of alchohol can be beneficial, but drugs are for sick people. i recently read cannabis can relieve the symptoms of MS sufferers which would be fine for them, but healthy people taking drugs for experimentation is ludicrously stupid......agree?
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Let's make a comparison:
Alcohol kills thousands of people each year, by disease or by car accident.
When abuse, alcohol lowers your level of consciouness, can make someone violent. Incests, rapes, murder are committed under alcohol influence.
You'll never see someone beats his wife coming back from the coffeeshop!
Alcohol is classified as a hard drug by the government himself which prohibites Canna!
Recent (governmental) studies show that Cannabis multiply by 2 the risk of car accident.
With alcohol it's per 8!!
Your fav music genre has been 95% inspired by Cannabis use!!!
Without weed, no prog!
Edited by oliverstoned - August 23 2006 at 08:12
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Harkmark
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Joined: October 29 2005
Location: Norway
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Points: 538
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 08:05 |
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Quote MysticFred: "Drugs are for sick people"
This is IMO a very immature statement. How old are you?
I agree that to some people light drugs might be unhealthy and could cause mental problems. But this kind of categorical statements gets you nowhere, and I don't think you will convince any of the young people around here with them either.
Edited by Harkmark - August 23 2006 at 08:06
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Jim Garten
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 08:08 |
Certif1ed wrote:
I am totally ashamed of all those nights spent wandering around fields, woods and mystic stone circles, watching bands like Hawkwind, Here & Now and the Ozric Tentacles playing with cosmic lightshows, and druids performing ages-old ceremonies, women dancing naked... |
You indulged at Here and Now gigs too, eh? 
Seriously - I think none of us quoted in my previous posting would ever glorify or advocate the use of drugs; the point is like it or not, they can have their up-sides as well as their down-sides - but the very fact they have their (occasionally very serious) downsides must make anyone who is even considering trying them think very carefully before going ahead. 
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Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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Sean Trane
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Prog Folk
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Location: Heart of Europe
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Points: 20414
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 08:47 |
Harkmark wrote:
Quote MysticFred: "Drugs are for sick people"
This is IMO a very immature statement. How old are you?
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Fred is much older than you might expect him to be.
He is a father of teenagers (I think) and he is obviously concerned that soon his kids will be exposed (or have even been exposed already). to the stuff.
The problem of soft drugs is that it leads the weak to harder drugs.
Almost every junkie passed through Mary Jane's legs, but they had probably started with glue first.
I do share Fred's concern with this issue (talking to young people about this), but denying drug's enjoyablity is not the answer.
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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oliverstoned
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Joined: March 26 2004
Location: France
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 08:55 |
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I don't believe in the escalate theory:
Virtually all junkies who "started" with pot, experimented alcohol and glue before. So is alcohol a first step leading to heroin? No, of course.
It's rather the fact that establishement lies on pot who makes young people not believe the establishement when he -rightly- says that heroin is dangerous.
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oliverstoned
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 09:01 |
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It's rather the fact that it's forbidden that makes -not only- youth wants to transgress the prohibition.
-There has been a huge rise of alcohol comsuption during the prohibitive years in the USA.
-France is the EU country where young smokes the more pot whereas it's the more prohibitive country, and Netherlands, the freer, has one of the lower rate of young canna consumers in EU.
Also, french government diabolizes canna but allows very dangerous psychotropic "medications" to please the pharmaceutic mafia.
Edited by oliverstoned - August 23 2006 at 09:02
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Philéas
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 09:03 |
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I'd like to pop in and say that for me, who has yet to try anything
"worse" than weed, all these tales, good or bad, are very informative
and benefitial. There are some things you just can't read in books, and
I'm grateful that this thread is here. I try to get as complete a
picture as possible of what the effects of a drug will be like before I
actually try it. I'm very cautious, and I need every advice I can get.
I am personally interested in LSD or mushrooms because of all the good
things I've heard you can experience during the "trip". However, I am
also highly aware of the dangers of drugs in any shape or form. That
includes both alcohol and caffeine, MysticFred.
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oliverstoned
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 09:06 |
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Just say Know!
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Philéas
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 09:08 |
oliverstoned wrote:
Just say Know! |
Indeed, sufficient knowledge is the key to "successful" usage.
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mystic fred
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 10:20 |
sorry to sound like your auntie on this subject, i am not immature, i have no teenage sons, but i have spent the last several years of my working life (as a security officer) discouraging hundreds of teenagers from using drugs, however soft. Fair enough there are cigarettes, which i dissuade youngsters from using but they still do, and the RESPONSIBLE use of alchohol is ok, i.e. not drinking and driving/bingeing for starters. What really irritates is so called responsible adults advocating soft drugs, even the Police let us down by re-classifying cannabis, but it does lead to schizophrenia and brain damage, believe me i've known people affected by it and many (but not all) move onto harder drugs, dealers, criminality etc.etc. anyone remotely interested in rock knows the dangers of "experimentation" through what happened to many including Syd Barret for instance, who was a heavy user. Other members of Floyd were worried about him at the time and eventually sacked him from the band, i love psychedelic music such as Hawkwind (see my reviews!) and have never felt the need to take drugs to appreciate them. There have been many oppportunities, i'm glad i never took them. That's all i have to say further on this subject and that's my opinion, agree or disagree. 
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Raff
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 10:31 |
oliverstoned wrote:
It's rather the fact that it's forbidden that makes -not only- youth wants to transgress the prohibition.
-There has been a huge rise of alcohol comsuption during the prohibitive years in the USA.
-France is the EU country where young smokes the more pot whereas it's the more prohibitive country, and Netherlands, the freer, has one of the lower rate of young canna consumers in EU.
Also, french government diabolizes canna but allows very dangerous psychotropic "medications" to please the pharmaceutic mafia.
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I have to say I agree 100% with you, even if I've never taken drugs or been interested in taking them. Italy has very strict laws about drugs, but this has not helped discourage people from using them - especially as regards extremely dangerous synthetic drugs such as Ecstasy. Anyway, I am completely against any kind of prohibition, as I feel it is stupid and hypocritical. After all, everyone is free to go to a supermarket and buy all the bottles of wine and spirits available, and no one would bat an eyelid - far from that! Besides, you are perfectly right about "legal" drugs, such as antidepressants or tranquillisers, which are often prescribed by doctors without due care. I know of at least two people who have almost been turned into vegetables by heavy use of such legally available drugs.
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man@arms
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Joined: March 31 2006
Location: United States
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Posted: August 23 2006 at 10:40 |
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Live and let live. For nearly as long as mankind has walked this planet we have found ways to get intoxicated. Drugs will never go away and for every one person you might be able to convince not to do them, many others will indulge. This will never change. I personally find some drugs in moderation to be beneficial, but I realize that whatever I may experience someone else might react differently to. But, you won't know until you try. Don't be a drug virgin.
Edited by man@arms - August 23 2006 at 10:41
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