Is ELP against christianity

the lyrics of that song appear to be questioning.

plus, how can you take any rock music lyric seriously?

I'm not a big fan of Lake's lyrics in general(Roger Waters is more my cup of tea) but I like Lake/Sinfield's satiric/anti-religious lyrics clearly demonstrated in "Hallowed Be Thy Name", "I Believe In Father Christmas", "Karn Evil 9: 1st Impression pt.1" and even "Closer To Believing"(And I need to be here with you, For without you what am I, Just another fool out searching, For some heaven in the sky).

I thought it was one of the great aspects of ELP, breaking all the rules! That's prog imo!

I myself reject every other transcendental world above or under us. Most people can't accept that this life is all we got, so they believe in a "God"(who only exist in their mind) and a religion. It's their explanation of the world and the salve on their wounds(others go to bars to drown their sorrow and become 'comfortably numb' and cynical with credo's as ‘eat, drink and be merry, for tomorrow we die’).

I think that every religion is a denial of life.

For me it's a very peacefull thought that their isn't one so-called "real truth"(or a judge in heaven), except that we all die someday.

I respect mother earth(or nature) and the people around me, that's enough for me.

God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. As the saying goes.

I wonder when the Muslims kill their God and find other solutions (rather than killing) to solve their problems.

My real name is Jeremiah and my mother and sister are of the "Jehovah's Witnesses". So I've often interesting discussions 'bout  God & religion.

Great topic btw!

 

 

threefates wrote: Regarding ELP's lyrics... Greg wrote Mass and Hymn at an early age when he was in the process of figuring out just what mass religion really was.  An age where most men question the universe around them and religion.  Pretty normal I'd say, and in no way says what his actual feeling are on religion. THe other lyrics mentioned, Benny, the ladder lyrics... the pull Jesus from a hat lyrics... that was all written by Pete Sinfield... so go question his faith...

Hi   threefates

Have his views changed? I am a believer but I respect the right to question because if faith is not on a sound philosphical basis it can result in fanaticism

maani wrote: As most members know, I am a full-time Protestant minister.  I've been in Christ for over 20 years, and in the full-time ministry for three.  I love ice cream, action movies, and secular - and particularly progressive - music.  I don't like people who say "like" every third word, women who talk like truck drivers, and hypocrites who claim a mantle of Christianity with little understanding of the very person they claim to follow. In short, I agree with both prog1611 and alan.  But, at the risk of turning this thread into yet another "religious" discussion, I would like to add something. "True" Christians (an admittedly loaded term) know and understand that we are not here to judge or condemn.  In fact, we are strictly forbidden from doing either.  Judgment and condemnation are reserved solely and exclusively to Christ on Judgment Day.  We are here to live a "Christ-like" life - love, peace, forgiveness, humility, compassion, patience, charity, selflessness, service and truth.  We are here to preach the Gospel and proselytize - but not to "ram it down people's throats" or judge or condemn them if they choose not to listen. That the vast majority of mainstream, heirarchical, "organized" Christianity does not get this - that it is dangerously apostate, and often even comes across with narrow, unloving, unforgiving and ultimately un-Christian views and positions - is sad in the extreme, and is what makes "organized Christianity" its own worst enemy. Is ELP anti-Christian?  I couldn't care less.  Because if they are, it is between them and God, and is not for me to judge.  I can still enjoy their music, and admire and respect their talent. Peace.

Sorry maani, but I have to do it again. While I certainly respect what you stand for in the Christian faith, I have to get you on some hypocrisy on your part. You've managed to make some pretty harsh judgements on our own president, which is fine. Believe me even I have some reservations on him myself. But I would like to see these judgements based on facts and NOT sheer speculation and conjecture. Like (yes, I'm using that word) that ridiculous thread you put in about the 9-11 conspiracy and a number of other things. I've even nailed you on a few, well I'm not going to say lies, but mistakes in some things and you have yet to own up to them. Tony R pointed a few screw-ups on my part in some previous posts and he was right and I admitted it. I think you need a bit of a humility check-up there my friend. But then again, don't we all.

Oh, I know you're going to come back saying that you're judging his actions and not the man himself. Again, fine but don't do it out of suspicion or paranoia. Just the facts maani! Just remember, I'm not just judging your actions, I'm judging you.

Edited by marktheshark

Tony R wrote: "We are a nation that is unenlightened because of religion. I think religion stops people from thinking. I think it justified crazies. I think flying planes into a building was a faith-based initiative. I think religion is a neurological disorder."     --Bill Maher, fired from ABC for telling the truth <!-- var SymRealOnLoad; var SymReal; Sym() { window.open = SymWinOpen; if(SymReal != null)      SymReal(); } SymOnLoad() { if(SymRealOnLoad != null)      SymRealOnLoad(); window.open = SymRealWinOpen; SymReal = window.; window. = Sym; } SymRealOnLoad = window.onload; window.onload = SymOnLoad; //-->

Yeah, it's to bad we've had to deal with religious zealots like Abraham Lincoln, Ghandi and Martin Luther King. Can't imagine where'd we be without them!


Edited by marktheshark

tangerine62 wrote: This is a music forum....for f**ks sake let's get rid of all religious overtones....each to their own...but give it a f**kin rest.

I spy a Devil-Worshipper amongst us!!
Burn him,mutilate him then mount his head on a spike at Blamoral Castle.
Then set the Attack Badgers on him........or the Shark
 

Edited by Tony R

tangerine62 wrote: Frankly, who gives a monkeys.............i'm aetheist and couldn't care less about any religion. It's about time religion was kept with the believer, to do with what they want and not to spew nonsense like this in a prog forum. As all christians believe in god, why has there never been a sighting of him??? Burning bush doesn't count....my wife gets one of them when i'm on fire....but thats another story.

Thaaaaankyou for that last sentence Tangerine- I'm sure we ALL needed to know about your personal nightlife ......

I was kinda pleased by your last post ("give it a f*king rest" etc...) as that's what everyone here should bloody well be doing...though it really does contradict your stupidly bold and s**t-stirring "god" thread that you started- don't you think?

Time to start using your head....which is what I sometimes use when my boyfriend's "on fire"

Edited by Starette

MtS:

No, I am not going to say I was judging Bush's actions and not Bush himself.  I was not judging at all.  There is a difference between making and discussing observations, and "judging."  I do not - cannot - judge Bush, no matter how bad, horrible, misguided, even evil he may be.  But I can observe that I believe him to be bad, horrible, misguided and possibly evil.  That is not a "judgment."  Re my comments about Bush, 9/11 and any alternative theory I may believe in about those events, again, I can discuss that theory and make any connections I feel warranted without "judging" Bush.  In fact, I can add 2 and 2 and get 7.3 in that regard and it would still not be "judging."

On the other side of the coin, thank you for noting Lincoln, Gandhi and King.  Not only are there others, but it is historical fact that every major socio-political movement in U.S. history was either led by or largely involved people of faith.  The Revolutionary War - the break from England - was fought by people of faith in order to be able to practice and express faiths other than that followed by the King and the Church of England.  The abolitionist movement was led by Christians - initially Quakers - who did not "buy" the interpretation of Scripture that kept the black man a slave.  Harriet Tubman - founder of the "Underground Railroad" - was a zealous Christian, as were most of those who were hiding blacks as they moved northward toward freedom.  The Child Labor movement - to stop the conscription of young children into the work force - was led by Christians.  The Women's Sufferage movement was started and led primarily by Protestant women in New England.  And, of course, the civil rights movement was started by Southern Baptists and other Christians, and quickly joined by the Jewish community.

Have Christians done "bad" things, too?  Yup.  And we're darn sure not proud of them.  But those who would posit that faith - and in this particular case, Christianity - is somehow anathema to "free thinking," "social movement" or "political action" have zero knowledge or understanding of U.S. history.  And no, I am not suggesting that the U.S. is a "Christian nation."  However, the primarily Christians that founded it, and the majority of the nation that continues to self-identify as Christian, have had a very important, if not critical, hand in shaping many of the good things that this country has become.

Peace.

Arteum wrote: And, by the way, maani, any statement or conclusion you make is a sheer blasphemy. because only God is allowed to judge. he wants to have all the game to himself. People should not even open their mouths or indeed have a single though that in any way defines, summarizes, concludes etc.

I feel really sorry for you that you are not able to see how ridiculous about 90% of your posts look like

Jeremy Bender wrote: I'm not a big fan of Lake's lyrics in general(Roger Waters is more my cup of tea) but I like Lake/Sinfield's satiric/anti-religious lyrics clearly demonstrated in "Hallowed Be Thy Name", "I Believe In Father Christmas", "Karn Evil 9: 1st Impression pt.1" and even "Closer To Believing"(And I need to be here with you, For without you what am I, Just another fool out searching, For some heaven in the sky). I thought it was one of the great aspects of ELP, breaking all the rules! That's prog imo! I myself reject every other transcendental world above or under us. Most people can't accept that this life is all we got, so they believe in a "God"(who only exist in their mind) and a religion. It's their explanation of the world and the salve on their wounds(others go to bars to drown their sorrow and become 'comfortably numb' and cynical with credo's as ‘eat, drink and be merry, for tomorrow we die’).

Jeremy Bender, you think writing secular and anti-religious songs is breaking the rules?! The rule is to be a believer in miracles? Sorry, but this is only in some capitalist countries, where religion sells best. Go to some big Russian city.  If you openly express your belief in God you would be considered a nut and put in a mental home together with believers in trolls and elves and those who think they are Napoleon, baron Munchausen, or Winnie Pooh

Edited by Arteum