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chopper
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Topic: Is the Beatles Rubber Soul overlooked? Posted: April 11 2012 at 12:06 |
Snow Dog wrote:
chopper wrote:
hobocamp wrote:
One point no one has raised- are we talking about the album as released in the UK or the USA?
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The UK version is how The Beatles intended the album to be. The US versions were always tailored up till Revolver. |
Up to and including Revolver. Which has three tracks missing in the US version. You probably know this. |
Yes, but my memory's not what it was Steve Ian.
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HolyMoly
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Posted: April 11 2012 at 11:37 |
Snow Dog wrote:
chopper wrote:
hobocamp wrote:
One point no one has raised- are we talking about the album as released in the UK or the USA?
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The UK version is how The Beatles intended the album to be. The US versions were always tailored up till Revolver. |
Up to and including Revolver. Which has three tracks missing in the US version. You probably know this. |
All three of which are John Lennon-sung tracks, oddly enough. That means on the US version John only sings two songs instead of five on the UK version. Quite a difference.
Edited by HolyMoly - April 11 2012 at 11:38
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My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased.
-Kehlog Albran
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Snow Dog
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Posted: April 11 2012 at 09:10 |
chopper wrote:
hobocamp wrote:
One point no one has raised- are we talking about the album as released in the UK or the USA?
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The UK version is how The Beatles intended the album to be. The US versions were always tailored up till Revolver. |
Up to and including Revolver. Which has three tracks missing in the US version. You probably know this.
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Sagichim
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Posted: April 11 2012 at 09:07 |
I'm not sure which version i have, but i think the album have some nice songs and some i really don't care about. The songs were starting to be a little more interesting, but nothing special just yet, i consider it a transitional album. The big leap was Revolver, where the writing was much interesting and adventurous, they left behind their happy clappy days and moved towards somewhere they have never been before. But this is just my opinion i understand why people like it more than i do.
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chopper
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Posted: April 11 2012 at 08:51 |
hobocamp wrote:
One point no one has raised- are we talking about the album as released in the UK or the USA?
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The UK version is how The Beatles intended the album to be. The US versions were always tailored up till Revolver.
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catfood03
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Posted: April 10 2012 at 22:35 |
Beatles for Sale is overlooked, IMHO. Despite a few clunkers on that record.
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Matthew T
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Posted: April 08 2012 at 15:03 |
Love it, On a par with the others. My favourite Beatles will always be "Abbey Road". But as most know here, I like em' all. "Rubber Soul" gets as much play as the others and actually is always loved by everybody here at home. Fabulous album. "Nowhere Man" is my fave song
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Matt
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Dayvenkirq
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Posted: April 08 2012 at 12:48 |
earlyprog wrote:
Overlooked (underestimated) relative to what?
Relative to:
- no. ratings? Yes, this is "first grade" prog - more PA members should know/rate this.
- no. of special collabs and Prog Reviewers rating the album? IMO, Yes. How would it alter the rating? possibly upwards.
- the year released? A pure 5.0 rating as - IMO - it is the best popular/mainstream album released up to 1965.
- subsequent releases by The Beatles? No, not IMO.
- innovation? yes!
- overall rating? no.
- my personal view? yes, it's better than Revolver as opposed to the ratings |
I would still maintain my argument that "overlooked" and "underestimated" are two somewhat different things.
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earlyprog
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Posted: April 08 2012 at 11:51 |
Overlooked (underestimated) relative to what?
Relative to:
- no. ratings? Yes, this is "first grade" prog - more PA members should know/rate this.
- no. of special collabs and Prog Reviewers rating the album? IMO, Yes. How would it alter the rating? possibly upwards.
- the year released? A pure 5.0 rating as - IMO - it is the best popular/mainstream album released up to 1965.
- subsequent releases by The Beatles? No, not IMO.
- innovation? yes!
- overall rating? no.
- my personal view? yes, it's better than Revolver as opposed to the ratings
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HolyMoly
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Posted: March 19 2012 at 08:52 |
I grew up with the US version of "Rubber Soul" as one of the earliest records I had, I used to play it on a toy Fisher Price record player. It's very different - instead of opening with the rocking "Drive My Car", it instead opened with the country folk of "I've Just Seen a Face" (which was on "Help" in the UK). It gives the whole album a more rustic feel. Plus, side two opened up with the subtle, pensive "It's Only Love" instead of the Ringo-sung "What Goes On". In fact, if the UK Rubber Soul didn't have the superb "Nowhere Man" on it, I'd be tempted to give the US version the upper hand here.
Back to topic - is it overlooked? Hard to say. I've lived and breathed Beatles my whole life, and most people I know who like the Beatles agree with me that pretty much every album they put out was essential in its own way. They're kind of the gold standard in record making.
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My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased.
-Kehlog Albran
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Dayvenkirq
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Posted: March 19 2012 at 01:27 |
hobocamp wrote:
One point no one has raised-
are we talking about the album as released in the UK or the USA?
I have always considered Revolver with the track listing released in the UK as a solid contender for the first prog album.
I love Rubber Soul. It is not overlooked in my peer group.
It's one Beatles album we all know of. |
Good point. I meant the UK version because the US one doesn't have 'Nowhere Man' on it, although the latter is also very nice . I probably should give Revolver another listen 'cause I really like it , although I have already made up my mind about half of its stuff that just sounds like ...it (I apologize.)
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hobocamp
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Posted: March 18 2012 at 13:40 |
One point no one has raised-
are we talking about the album as released in the UK or the USA?
I have always considered Revolver with the track listing released in the UK as a solid contender for the first prog album.
I love Rubber Soul. It is not overlooked in my peer group.
It's one Beatles album we all know of.
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Dayvenkirq
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Posted: March 18 2012 at 01:58 |
KingCrInuYasha wrote:
I don't think it's overlooked, given that "Drive My Car", "Nowhere Man" and "In My Life", three of the band's well known songs, are on it.
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The songs may not be overlooked, but the album in general may be. If someone asked you "What album is it from?", you would probably be like: "Uh ... I forgot." Not you, KingCrlnuYasha. I mean, take any person who does not listen to music on a regular basis, perhaps.
On the topic: define "overlooked." I looked up M-W and concluded that Rubber Soul is indeed overlooked because of the musico-revolutionary nature of Revolver and Sgt. Pepper. In fact, I think even Revolver is overlooked due to the obvious artistic superiority of Sgt. Pepper, a "concept" album (at least that's what others call it), the unique artwork, a twisted take on the classical instrumentation in pop music, ... what did I miss?
Edited by Dayvenkirq - March 18 2012 at 02:00
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Horizons
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Posted: February 01 2012 at 13:21 |
My favorites are The Word and Looking Through You.
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Crushed like a rose in the riverflow.
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KingCrInuYasha
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Posted: February 01 2012 at 13:06 |
I don't think it's overlooked, given that "Drive My Car", "Nowhere Man" and "In My Life", three of the band's well known songs, are on it.
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He looks at this world and wants it all... so he strikes, like Thunderball!
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jammun
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Posted: January 29 2012 at 19:14 |
Rubber Soul is a great album. Might not be up there with Dylan, at the time, but certainly as groundbreaking. In the original configuration (not the American version) we've got, amongst many others, Drive My Car, Nowhere Man, Girl, In My Life, and of course Michelle. I don't see how it'd be underrated, expect by those who just don't like The Beatles.
I always liked it, and traded my Dave Clark Five's Greatest Hits to a rube for it at the time. He was happy to have Glad All Over. I was happy to have The Word.
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Can you tell me where we're headin'?
Lincoln County Road or Armageddon.
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Slartibartfast
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Posted: January 29 2012 at 07:38 |
I took a look over the album so no...
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Atavachron
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Posted: January 28 2012 at 19:00 |
^ when I say 'better' I mean the real article - in this case folk
musicians primarily in the US but also Britain - were better at writing
the kind of ironic, cautionary and even grim folk-style lyrics than the Beatles [e.g. 'Norwegian Wood']
; and
yes in many ways better at blending folk music with pop.
Are you going
to tell me that Paul McCartney and John Lennon wrote Folk lyrics
superior to Dylan, Seeger, Guthrie, Collins, Stills, and Mitchell, or
that Lennon/McCartney better ushered authentic folk into a pop
market? I don't think so.
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NYSPORTSFAN
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Joined: January 07 2012
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Posted: January 28 2012 at 07:59 |
Atavachron wrote:
yes, but that was not terribly new in pop music as the Folkies had been doing that for years, and usually much better
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When you say better are talking about lyrically? If you are talking about songcraft I would like to know which folkies who were better than the Beatles at the Beatles own style of combining pop melodies with unusual harmonic progressions with using sources that were obviously outside of rock and roll? As it is folk music was one branch to a huge tree for the band.
I think the Beatles had kind of broken new ground lyrically with songs like the "The Word" with it's pre-hippie "All You Need Is Love" sentiment or "Girl".
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TODDLER
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Posted: January 26 2012 at 18:19 |
It seemed when I first heard "I Don't Want To Spoil the Party" from Beatles For Sale it dawned on me that this new style which was acoustic was developing into what they wrote later which was Rubber Soul. To an extent songs like "No Reply" and "I'm A Loser" are examples of this change. Early acoustic songs like "Till There Was You" and "This Boy" were based off chord progressions that were used mostly in the 50's. "I'll Be Back" obviously was not. On Rubber Soul with songs like "I'm Looking Through You" and "Girl" it sounded like they had made a huge leap into a different style. Originally on the American release of Rubber Soul it opened with "I've Just Seen A Face" and left quite an impression on American kids who heard it for the first time. Although the song was not meant to appear on the English version of Rubber Soul and instead was found on Help, it fit the style of Rubber Soul. I wasn't fond of the Beatles American "Rock N' Roll" covers except for John Lennon's "Twist and Shout" and "Rock N" Roll Music". But with Rubber Soul's release and the influence it had on all the great writers of that day,,,it would be logical to assume that the Beatles had created a style of their own which involves surpressing their own personal influences and although sometimes incorporating the influences which are not to be indicated by the human ear and in result of this they sound more original to the listener. For example ,,,they might have written a song which had the obvious 1920's Big Band or dixieland style. But it had no reflection on their creative song writing. It was just an addition to their song. "Cry Baby Cry" and 30 others have chord progressions that just don't enter the minds of other great songwriters.
Edited by TODDLER - January 26 2012 at 18:20
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