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The T 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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 Posted: May 11 2009 at 21:10 |
... And probably they're not really losing any sleep because of that... 
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debrewguy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 30 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 3596
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Posted: May 11 2009 at 21:01 |
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But they still can't buy love at PA ...
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: May 11 2009 at 15:50 |
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Yes they were and I think they are paying the price for it now, but why should they give a damn as they are all richer than God now....
Edited by Slartibartfast - May 12 2009 at 08:20
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esky
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 12 2009
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 643
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Posted: May 11 2009 at 15:35 |
 I would like to apologize for my earlier post where I placed Cheesecakemouse's style of writing into question and not his written intent. I wasn't mindful of the rules and guidelines for this website (one of the finest), but that has been now self-addressed. Again, sorry.
To weigh in on the issue, Genesis of 1978 was winding down its past glories of prog and looking for a way to change with changing times. They had just come off two very good albums that showed there was indeed life after Gabriel, and they were now looking for a way to sound fresh after Hackett jumped ship. ATTW3 was the result, and it came off as too little, too late for a prog entry. They knew it, learned from it, and trudged on towards Duke, Abacab, etc. They had evolved into musicians who just wanted to doodle around whatever was their fancy at the moment - period. I still love Collins' singing and not-so-present drumming; Banks remains one of the godfathers of the keyboard, and Rutherford stays that perfect country gentleman who can really rip it apart, bass-wise, whenever he gets the calling to do so. I do wish for one more Genesis album simply to see what's evolved for the three hold-outs since 1991.
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17531
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Posted: May 11 2009 at 13:13 |
Hi,
Guys ... some of these opinions ... aare making everyone look like a bunch of fans and fanatics, not people that appreciate music.
That said, I can understand ... heck ... yes I like Stravinsky and find Tchaikovsky boring but hardly a reason why I can not appreciate Babe Ruth or Frank Zappa or Genesis or Pink Floyd or Amon Duul 2!
... but that has nothing to do with music appreciation in general, much more than anything .,.. and here ... we're suggesting that because it doesn't sound like what we want it to (which is subjective as hell!) ... is what defines good or bad?
One of these days you might regret that ... check this example out ... you changed when your kid was 10 ... and your kid comes back when he is 26 and says ... dad .. you stink because you changed when I was 10 ... and I haven't liked you since! Not gonna bother seeing you again either!
What you gonna say?
Now translate that to Genesis or any other artist!
Make sure you can live with the response ... it will define the real you ...
It's hard being "yourself" ... and please .. remember that it is IMPOSSIBLE to be something that you, or I, want ... please respect people in their artistic choices!
Edited by moshkito - May 11 2009 at 13:18
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hercules amp
Forum Newbie
Joined: May 11 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 3
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Posted: May 11 2009 at 07:31 |
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When bands change and I don't like their new direction I take direct action and stop buying their music, it's an option open to all of us...
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American Khatru
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 28 2009
Location: New York
Status: Offline
Points: 732
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Posted: May 09 2009 at 07:41 |
 Cheesecakemouse wrote:
This is an issue i'd like to address. Fans get irate about the change in direction Genesis took in the 80s, Collins Banks and Rutherford counter argue that bands change.This retort may appear a reasonable statement by itself, but they managed it in an unreasonable way;
Firstly they dismissed their past...
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There is a great deal of class and care in what Cheese presents here, more than what is usually shown. But I'll be damned if people who dare take a line like this don't end up pilloried on this site, not because they're wrong but because some don't can't stand hearing it. Here in a brotherhood of lovers of music that is, no matter the flavor, if nothing else, demanding. It's weird. I'm with you man. The Cheese does not stand alone! (We may yet become farmers.)
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: May 08 2009 at 15:55 |
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With apologies to Tori Amos
They're a bad band
Mr. Bad Band
And she had enough of him
So the wolves try to dry her eyes
'cause the bad band made her cry
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Vibrationbaby
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 13 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 6898
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Posted: May 08 2009 at 14:08 |
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Well they lost my business from `78 on. But I guess they don`t really care since they made kazillions satisfying the simple-minded pigeons who fell for their top 40 bubble gum dribble. At least I got to see their concert at the Olympic Stadium in Montréal for free. They couldn`t even synchronize the huge video screen they showed up with with the audio. When they played the old stuff they were just not into it. Didn`t care. It was as if they were being forced into it. I remember talking to a lot of disappointed people on the metro on the way home.
That`s what I`ve always liked about Ian Anderson. He always gave the audience the best of both worlds. Even on the A tour he was playing the older material and loving it. Never saw a Tull concert or bought a Tull record that didn`t deliver.
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17531
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Posted: May 08 2009 at 10:57 |
Cheesecakemouse wrote:
This is an issue i'd like to address. Fans get irate about the change in direction Genesis took in the 80s, Collins Banks and Rutherford counter argue that bands change.
This retort may appear a reasonable statement by itself, but they managed it in an unreasonable way; |
You gotta love it ... so because some fans got irate ... the artists stink? Ohhh, so Beethoven never changed? Mozart? Sibelius? Lizst?
What bothers me here is this ... what gives a fan, the right to tell me what to compose for his/her pleasure? If you don't like Picasso ... too bad ... go get a picture of an onion for your kitchen! Or a Playboy fold out for your bathroom ... this way at least these artists are of some personal use to you ... regardless of what that is, hey?
| I see this behaviour as arrogant. |
I'm really sorry ... but this is far more arrogant than the artist himself/herself.
IF ... and that is a big IF ... you feel that any music, or art, is there to kiss you and nothing else ... then I am not sure that you will "EVER" appreciate any artists for what they do or did ... because you want something that they are not capable of doing, or have no desire to do ...
You know what bugs me on this? .... it is posted on a "progressive" board ... where the discussion is about the open minded-ness that helps create new musics, new experiences ... and this is like saying ... you can't do that!
There was in the one "Behind the Music" about Metallica ... and someone asked them ... "you sold out" ... and the reply was ... yeah! every night!.
One more thing ... if you have such a strong opinion about an art form and artists involved, why are you not creating your own, instead of expecting others to do it for you?
Edited by moshkito - May 08 2009 at 11:00
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Vibrationbaby
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 13 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 6898
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Posted: May 08 2009 at 10:26 |
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Another band that I don`t bother with anymore is Triumvirat. Thinking of burning some of those as well. As simple as ACDC might be they never sold the farm on their fans. They just sold out the Olympic Stadium in Montréal recently in a matter of minutes.
The Musical Box recently played the Bell Centre in Montréal doing TOTT and the promoters were out in the street giving away tickets.
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toroddfuglesteg
Forum Senior Member
Retired
Joined: March 04 2008
Location: Retirement Home
Status: Offline
Points: 3658
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Posted: May 08 2009 at 09:59 |
I have stopped being angry at Phil Collins. I actually respect the guy now (no more camel dung through his bed room window). Genesis gave us some fantastic albums from their second one to Wind & Wuthering. I am listening to these albums a lot. We also have new bands who almost sounds like them. Go and watch THE MUSICAL BOX and/or THE WATCH doing old Genesis songs. I have heard both bands are the ultimate Genesis dream. Sometimes; the world moves on. That's a fact.
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Vibrationbaby
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 13 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 6898
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Posted: May 08 2009 at 09:44 |
Lucent wrote:
Congratulations Phil Collins, you're the world's biggest douche. |
I second that. He wrecked the band. In those eighteen months that elapsed between TLLDOB and TOTT you would think they could have found another singer. Needless to say I think I gave TOTT 5 stars in a review for PA.  At that point there seemed to be a glitter of hope. The death knell sounded when Hackett left. All hope faded into black. I remember taking our And Then There Were Three and buning them. It was sort of a voodoo ritual. It obviously achieved opposite results so I`ll personally take some of the blame for the band`s demise.
Edited by Vibrationbaby - May 08 2009 at 09:46
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Alitare
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 08 2008
Location: New York
Status: Offline
Points: 3595
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 23:03 |
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Shhhh, don't anger him. He bites.
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The T
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 22:18 |
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^Now that was useful.
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Lucent
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 18 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 259
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 19:05 |
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Congratulations Phil Collins, you're the world's biggest douche.
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Nov
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 28 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 523
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 18:21 |
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Nov
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 28 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 523
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 18:13 |
Cheesecakemouse wrote:
Genesis allowed songs alien to their sound constantly on different albums. They again came across arrogant to their fans. |
What are you talking about? "Whodunnit" is as much Genesis as "Supper's Ready" is because they created it. OK, I really dislike the former but I'll defend their right to produce what the f**k they like. Whether you buy it or not is up to you.
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Vibrationbaby
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 13 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 6898
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 16:00 |
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After that atrocious third album without Gabriel I just couldn`t listen to them anymore. I even have difficulty listening to their early stuff to this day. I have to be in a weird mood and even then I can`t get the material from the late seventies onward out of my head. It`s like an old friend being betraying you.
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esky
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 12 2009
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 643
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Posted: May 07 2009 at 15:37 |
 What a poorly written essay. I mean, simply awful. Hard to take seriously when it's this bad. Better luck next time!
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Genesis were bad to its fans.
