Neo Prog do I like it?

kenmartree wrote: AShowOfHands wrote: As a huge Marillion fan I tried listening to some IQ and Pendragon (Only via YouTube mind) and found while it was okay there was something missing or it seemed kind of half-arsed. Perhaps I should listen to a full album before I can pass proper judgement. I think I could get into it its just knowing what will work for me and what won't, then again that's the purpose of this thread!   I'm a huge Marillion fan as well but haven't been able to get into IQ, I think it's the vocals.  Nothing like Marilion that's for sure. I do like Pendragon but I only have the Masqurade Overture.

As a huge Marillion fan I tried listening to some IQ and Pendragon (Only via YouTube mind) and found while it was okay there was something missing or it seemed kind of half-arsed. Perhaps I should listen to a full album before I can pass proper judgement. I think I could get into it its just knowing what will work for me and what won't, then again that's the purpose of this thread!

stonebeard wrote: Why speculate as to influences? If you want to get to the truth, ask the bands. Although, we can be sure Fish was influenced by Hammill, because Fool's Mate is pictured on the Fugazi back cover. So there's a VDGG connection for you. I can easily see how Hammill could have influenced Geoff Mann (from Twelfth Night) as well.

not only "Fool's Mate", but also "Over"; it is pretty well known Fish is a great Hammill fan

Regarding theatrical vocals: I wonder, then, how indluential French theatrical Prog was on some Neo-Prog (though not a prime influence, but would be more influence on French Neo-Prog bands in more direct manner).  I'd really like to see a regional and migratory evaluation of movements such as Neo-Prog in a tree structure.

Anyway... The way I have tries to get into "genres" or "subgenres" here is by going through the streaming mp3s for the subgenre until I find something that grabs me.  If one doesn't care for the primary/ defining characteristics of a category, then better to discover other genres first.  That said, even if one isn't a fan of Neo-Prog, it's very likely that there will Neo-Prog tinged music, or, depending one one's tolerance, borderline Neo-Prog, that will appeal.  I don't care for metal generally, yet there are many bands that have metal as one of the musical elements/ are influenced by it that I truly enjoy (e.g. Hoyry-Kone, Estradasphere, Taal).  Can be a strong influence, and could be multi-tagged as metal.  Itt will be much easier to find music from all of the categories that could appeal once multi-tagging is in place and it's fully and easily searchable.

As to comments about the 80's being a bad decade for Prog:  It was a great decade for avant/ chamber rock by my reckoning.  Now maybe the avant rock movement as exemplified can be thought of as rather distinct, and in some cases parallel to the classic Prog movement, Rio/ avant it shares enough qualities and influences to be recognised as a subgenre (some bands being both Avant and classic Prog, whereas others have a lesser relationship with the original regognised Prog movement in terms of influence and qualities).  While classic symph bands were turning commercial, one had Rock in Opposition that was, well, doing the opposite on principle, and really making amazing progressive rock.  For me, avant rock in the 80's is to quite an extent what saves (from an enjoyment perspective) progressive rock from shallow mediocrity.  They weren't trying to play it safe, nor pander to the mainstream industries rules.  Sure it wasn't that big in terms of audience (it being a very niche market, and practically non-existent in some parts of the world), but what an amazing number of quality albums and bands, and real diversity, that fall under the avant umbrella.

VDGG's influence is best heard in the singing (high emotional content) and the darker pieces from early Marillion and Twelfth Night, and of course Discipline, which isn't necessarely a neo-prog band, but I consider it to be and there the VDGG influence is very much present. IQ uses a lot of Rush references in their music. A Farewell to Kings until Power Windows has influenced bands like Marillion and IQ (listen to Xanadu, Spirit of Radio and Natural Science), but I admit it's not a primary influence, but it is present for sure (at least to my ears).

My favourite bands of the 70s were Genesis, Yes, Camel, Focus, Jethro Tull, ELP and Supertramp. I love Marillion, Pendragon, IQ, Pallas

Hey, Ivan,There is a reason we call it Mellow tron! Excellent argument though , counselor!  That we decide not to like other musical genres , perhaps is OK but we must preserve the sanctity of all forms of PROG, period ! And if some are stretching the envelope of civility maybe they should return to their Vibrators albums or just use the vibrators when you think of it. Left ear lobe and then the right one. I can hear the synth singing already

graydog wrote: Where did it originate? The 80s, which should immediateley tell you something.

A lot of people try neo prog albums with the notion that it's going to suck anyway, so their experience is soiled. If someone likes Genesis, I can't find any reason why he would not like later IQ albums.

Everyone needs to hear IQ's The Wake/i] and Ever, Pendragon's The Jewel and The Window of Life, and Twelfth Night's Fact and Fiction and Art & Illusion (because Live At The Target was all instrumental) before they decide they don't like ANY "neo-prog." You just have to separate the wheat from the chaff.