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Topic ClosedWorst Album in the Symphonic Top 20
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Poll Question: Which of these do you like least?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
8 [6.45%]
4 [3.23%]
2 [1.61%]
9 [7.26%]
3 [2.42%]
3 [2.42%]
5 [4.03%]
20 [16.13%]
2 [1.61%]
2 [1.61%]
13 [10.48%]
4 [3.23%]
5 [4.03%]
3 [2.42%]
5 [4.03%]
18 [14.52%]
4 [3.23%]
1 [0.81%]
1 [0.81%]
12 [9.68%]
This topic is closed, no new votes accepted

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Roj View Drop Down
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Points: 3126 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 06:36
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Hey Roger!  Long time no chat!  How're things?

(And which four Yes?)

You'd probably like see a little Flower King action in the top 20, no?  Wink
 
I'm good Robert, hope you're well too buddy.
 
My four by Yes would be Going For The One, Tales From Topographic Oceans, Close To The Edge and The Yes Album (Drama might make it too, come to think of it!).  I have to say I'm pretty keen on Keystudio at the moment  too. 
 
Hmmmmm, there may just be the odd Flower Kings album in my top 20 LOL.
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Points: 2477 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 07:58
I'm sorry, fellow (PG-era) Genesis freaks, but I've never really enjoyed 'Fountain of Salmacis', I find it monotonous! I was really surprised when Dan Britton (of Deluge Grander) told me it was his favourite track of all time.

I briefly considered voting for NURSERY CRYME, but then I thought: 'No, no, Musical Box is an immortal classic and anyway, HAMBURGER CONCERTO is a far less interesting album...'
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Points: 9669 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 09:41
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Peter Peter wrote:

Ermm Should I do a similar one for prog metal? (I bet The T would really appreciate that....)
 
I would love it actually...Tongue 
 
But since prog-metal is hardly popular among classic-prog lovers, that thread would be run pretty much only by metalheads... therefore, it wouldn't be confrontational and would run actually quite smoothly... Tongue
Well Chai, you know I don't like the genre, so I don't think I should do one -- or even post in such a poll. LOL
 
Ermm I might be perceived as being just a wee bit biased, or of having some sort of (not too well hidden) agenda....
 
But you go right ahead -- see if the (other) classic prog lovers stay out! Wink


Edited by Peter - March 23 2009 at 09:42
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Points: 9869 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 12:25
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:


W.r.t to what is a masterpiece,  I really think the core of the album is more important to determining what is a masterpiece.  Would you dump a desert island album just because of two extremely short filler tracks and instead take a barely above average album but one without filler?  For example, CTTE is not a masterpiece just because all three tracks are strong, that is quite irrelevant, the magnum opus that the title track is is enough to confer masterpiece status on it.  At least, that's the way I look at it.  If you say you didn't like Siberian Khatru and therefore CTTE is not a masterpiece for you but - insert a Camel album here! - is a masterpiece because it is very consistent Sleepy, I'd have to disagree.  Likewise, SEBTP is a masterpiece in my book on account of Firth alone, it doesn't matter what else they didn't do on the album.  And Nursery Cryme is too purely for Musical Box, I'd be rueful about it if all the other tracks were bad, but I still wouldn't deny credit to Musical Box.


That sums up my feelings about Tarkus.

And mine too. Wink  I consider both Tarkus and BSS to be masterpieces purely on account of the respective epics, I really don't need any more reasons than them to regard the album very highly.  The rest of the tracks may or may not be worthwhile, but there are very few albums out there with something like the Karn Evil 9 suite and that to me is far more important.  I would always pick brilliance over consistency, both in albums and in bands.  Consistency is overrated, there, I said it!  Tongue
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Points: 3577 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 13:15
Kansas




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Points: 32560 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 14:19
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:


W.r.t to what is a masterpiece,  I really think the core of the album is more important to determining what is a masterpiece.  Would you dump a desert island album just because of two extremely short filler tracks and instead take a barely above average album but one without filler?  For example, CTTE is not a masterpiece just because all three tracks are strong, that is quite irrelevant, the magnum opus that the title track is is enough to confer masterpiece status on it.  At least, that's the way I look at it.  If you say you didn't like Siberian Khatru and therefore CTTE is not a masterpiece for you but - insert a Camel album here! - is a masterpiece because it is very consistent Sleepy, I'd have to disagree.  Likewise, SEBTP is a masterpiece in my book on account of Firth alone, it doesn't matter what else they didn't do on the album.  And Nursery Cryme is too purely for Musical Box, I'd be rueful about it if all the other tracks were bad, but I still wouldn't deny credit to Musical Box.


That sums up my feelings about Tarkus.

And mine too. Wink  I consider both Tarkus and BSS to be masterpieces purely on account of the respective epics, I really don't need any more reasons than them to regard the album very highly.  The rest of the tracks may or may not be worthwhile, but there are very few albums out there with something like the Karn Evil 9 suite and that to me is far more important.  I would always pick brilliance over consistency, both in albums and in bands.  Consistency is overrated, there, I said it!  Tongue


You know, that's a good way to put it: Brilliance beats consistency.  I like the consistency of The Mars Volta's De-Loused in the Comatorium a lot, but "Tetragrammaton" on Amputechture is brilliant.

Yep...and I feel the same about Brain Salad Surgery.
https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays
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Points: 13033 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 17:26

if my least favourite means the worst...then my choice is the Echolyn one.

I dont know why Hamburger Concerto has so many votes :(

Follow me on twitter @memowakeman
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Points: 971 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 17:58

Personally feel that Trilogy is overlooked, that and the other early ELP records which I feel are equally deserving of being in the top 20. But if I had to remove one and insert another it would be Trilogy for Leftoverture

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Points: 46838 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 19:04
Originally posted by mr.cub mr.cub wrote:

Personally feel that Trilogy is overlooked, that and the other early ELP records which I feel are equally deserving of being in the top 20. But if I had to remove one and insert another it would be Trilogy for Leftoverture



I think Trilogy was their most consistent album and 'mature' album if you will... funny though... I probably prefer it less for just that reason...  you can forgive the lows... but with this music.. prog... man.. you LIVE for highs... Clap  Consistency can be boring.. and nothing sucks more than being boring.. .see Camel.
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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Points: 1049 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 20:28
so tempting to run one band down to make a point in this poll .. I never liked camel cigarettes much never understood their wide acclaim ..  the spokes man of the company has one of the dullest most boring voices ever !
 

Edited by Yorkie X - March 23 2009 at 20:31
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Points: 971 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 20:55
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by mr.cub mr.cub wrote:

Personally feel that Trilogy is overlooked, that and the other early ELP records which I feel are equally deserving of being in the top 20. But if I had to remove one and insert another it would be Trilogy for Leftoverture



I think Trilogy was their most consistent album and 'mature' album if you will... funny though... I probably prefer it less for just that reason...  you can forgive the lows... but with this music.. prog... man.. you LIVE for highs... Clap  Consistency can be boring.. and nothing sucks more than being boring.. .see Camel.
 
Oddly enough I believe there are a number of highs on Trilogy, I think it is equally as exciting as their debut. Endless Enigma and Trilogy are very progressive pieces, though certainly not as exploratory as anything on Tarkus. But to me From the Beginning is ELP at their most simple, yet most effective.
 
However, I cannot argue with you about the matureness of the album. It is a different breed of ELP album and as much as I love their other early stuff, there is just something about that opening piano intro to Trilogy that makes me enjoy this album. I can see how you don't like consistency, but to my ears ELP avoids complacency on Trilogy- which is what I want to avoid (see Led ZeppelinSleepy)
 
And I believe any ELP album from their debut through BSS is deserving of being in the Top 20. I could have easily picked another of their albums, I just find this one unique

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Points: 94 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 21:17
Gentlemen of the Jury,
   CTTE is the definitive symphonic progressive rock album. If you are a musician, and have ever tried, much less succeeded in reproducing any or all of it onstage, as I have, you would gain a respect bordering on awe for the creative and sonic wonders of this record.
   It was so far beyond what even the YES band members could do in one take that, once it was recorded and spliced together,  they had to learn to execute it live for the stageshow.
   And You and I is the best prog ballad ever, CTTE is a mythic poem about space, time, and humanity, and Siberian Khatru is about, well, it is about the music first, and the "story"second. I have heard the the lyrics are based partly on Asimov's Foundation trilogy.
   YES, the symphonic prog standard-bearers.
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Points: 681 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2009 at 22:45
Leftoverture (Kansas)
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Points: 1319 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 01:26
Originally posted by 88melter 88melter wrote:

Gentlemen of the Jury,
   CTTE is the definitive symphonic progressive rock album. If you are a musician, and have ever tried, much less succeeded in reproducing any or all of it onstage, as I have, you would gain a respect bordering on awe for the creative and sonic wonders of this record.
   It was so far beyond what even the YES band members could do in one take that, once it was recorded and spliced together,  they had to learn to execute it live for the stageshow.
   And You and I is the best prog ballad ever, CTTE is a mythic poem about space, time, and humanity, and Siberian Khatru is about, well, it is about the music first, and the "story"second. I have heard the the lyrics are based partly on Asimov's Foundation trilogy.
   YES, the symphonic prog standard-bearers.
88melter



This doesn't sound like a description of the worst album in the top 20 at all Wink.. read the poll question again
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Points: 94 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 14:26

88melter here.

   Point taken, but my glowing assessment of CTTE was meant to COUNTER any votes or voters who may believe it to be suitable for inclusion on the 20 worst Symph-prog list. It does not belong there by any stretch of my imagination, at least. I will take it up another notch, and add that, if you are not inclined to put CTTE on the TOP 20, rather than the WORST 20 list, perhaps you are not a symphonic prog fan at all, a position one can hold with integrity, or course, but one that doesn't qualify a person to be voting on what recordings are the worst of a genre that one feels little or no affinity for.
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Points: 24598 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 14:51
Originally posted by 88melter 88melter wrote:

88melter here.

   Point taken, but my glowing assessment of CTTE was meant to COUNTER any votes or voters who may believe it to be suitable for inclusion on the 20 worst Symph-prog list. It does not belong there by any stretch of my imagination, at least. I will take it up another notch, and add that, if you are not inclined to put CTTE on the TOP 20, rather than the WORST 20 list, perhaps you are not a symphonic prog fan at all, a position one can hold with integrity, or course, but one that doesn't qualify a person to be voting on what recordings are the worst of a genre that one feels little or no affinity for.
88melter

Oh, I see. So the small minority of people who don't like CttE that much (although I'm not one of them) aren't true symphonic fans. It all makes sense now...

Who died and made you judge and jury?Confused I'm sure there are some people who don't regard CttE as much as you and me, but that doesn't mean they aren't knowledgeable about symphonic prog. Don't make blanket statements like that. You don't know what goes on in other people's minds after all.


Edited by birdwithteeth11 - March 24 2009 at 14:54
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Points: 94 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 15:52

I thought that blanket statements like that were just what chatrooms needed to make someone's point of view clear.

  I am much more interested in why you do not care for CTTE, and what seems like worthier music to you, than just the fact that CTTE is not your very favorite. Tell me more, and I'll try and respond to any specifics  with some of my own. Without a point of view that is informed by specifics, our opinions do not matter as much, eh?
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Points: 1818 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 16:42
I think birdwithteeth said that he liked CTTE. Besides , man If I had to ask for explanations every time someone does not like ELP this would be worst than the Crusades. After all , they are missing it.
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Points: 1818 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 16:43
I think birdwithteeth said that he liked CTTE. Besides , man If I had to ask for explanations every time someone does not like ELP this would be worst than the Crusades. After all , they are missing it.
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Points: 4202 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2009 at 18:41
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:



Kansas's album is one of the only ones up there with any real commercial success, and I wonder if that's why it's so frowned upon.  I think Yorkie said it well.



Some of you Americans, and your way of looking at the world.

So their no. 5 in the US charts (which I had no idea about, until I googled it just now) is why I don't find it exiting? Very few outside of North America ever registered Leftoverture, or Kansas (the band) existance. They're probably as obscure over here as Van Der Graaf Generator is over there.

Close to the Edge reached no. 3 in the UK. Nobody seems to have a problem with that. Its just widely regarded as a greater, more progressive yet successful album (and rightly so). 
Over land and under ashes
In the sunlight, see - it flashes
Find a fly and eat his eye
But don't believe in me
Don't believe in me
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