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lucas 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 06 2004
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 8138
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 Posted: July 30 2011 at 13:07 |
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When I discovered this site, I left behind extreme metal bands, and now that they are here, I returned to them !
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"Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood)
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2755
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Posted: July 31 2011 at 10:44 |
 ExittheLemming wrote:
To be fair I think David(Atavachron) concedes by implication that 'Prog' has never been a freestanding genre c/f Reggae, Blues, Metal, Rap, Techno, Jazz etc and that the only demarcation criteria we can use for artists on PA might just boil down to them having a demonstrably progressive attitude towards their music's development.
BTW I'm assuming by 'progressive music' you mean what we call 'Prog? (e.g. Ornette Coleman is clearly progressive music but it ain't Prog)
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Things were much clearer back when we used the term Art Rock.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: July 31 2011 at 10:54 |
lucas wrote:
When I discovered this site, I left behind extreme metal bands, and now that they are here, I returned to them ! |
lol, first part sort of applies to me. Not necessarily discovering the website by itself, but really getting into prog. Found metal's concern with its ethos and 'culture' rather limiting and conservative thereafter.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: July 31 2011 at 11:38 |
ghost_of_morphy wrote:
Things were much clearer back when we used the term Art Rock. |
I do believe art rock is a much better, more intelligible and more inclusive term for what all generally gets called progressive rock. I don't see the need for drawing a line between Elton John circa Brick Road and Genesis. Yes, the latter's music is more sophisticated and complex, but I have yet to be convinced that by itself constitutes a completely different approach to music. Both are trying to do something interesting in a rock context, ultimately.
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Proletariat
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 30 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1882
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Posted: July 31 2011 at 12:24 |
The more I learn about music the more I find that all the genres are poorly defined. Each genre crosses over with every other genre and the lines between them are fuzzy. When I was younger though every one seemed so different and my mouth watered at the prospect of discovering some catigory... Now when I talk to anyone who is a fan of a sound I see nothing but diffensivness of their section of the record shop. But I think their favorite album could have been on this shelf instead.
When everything is post modern and seperated a few of us may see that indeed nothing is.
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who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2755
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Posted: July 31 2011 at 12:50 |
rogerthat wrote:
ghost_of_morphy wrote:
Things were much clearer back when we used the term Art Rock. |
I do believe art rock is a much better, more intelligible and more inclusive term for what all generally gets called progressive rock. I don't see the need for drawing a line between Elton John circa Brick Road and Genesis. Yes, the latter's music is more sophisticated and complex, but I have yet to be convinced that by itself constitutes a completely different approach to music. Both are trying to do something interesting in a rock context, ultimately.
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I agree completely. Art Rock is such a stupid name though, whilst Progressive Rock sounds kinda cool..... 
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: August 01 2011 at 00:42 |
Proletariat wrote:
The more I learn about music the more I find that all the genres are poorly defined. Each genre crosses over with every other genre and the lines between them are fuzzy. When I was younger though every one seemed so different and my mouth watered at the prospect of discovering some catigory... Now when I talk to anyone who is a fan of a sound I see nothing but diffensivness of their section of the record shop. But I think their favorite album could have been on this shelf instead.
When everything is post modern and seperated a few of us may see that indeed nothing is. |
That kind of sums it up, doesn't it? I am sure a lot many of us have gone through this phase at some point. Unfortunately, people in that phase (and some never get out of it and remain steadfast genre fanatics) constitute the biggest target audience for art because that kind of fanatical passion gets food on the table for that artists. I am extremely selective about what gigs/concerts I attend and hence the enemy of people who make or perform music for a living, ironically.
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tamijo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 06 2009
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 4287
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Posted: August 01 2011 at 03:05 |
Proletariat wrote:
The more I learn about music the more I find that all the genres are poorly defined. Each genre crosses over with every other genre and the lines between them are fuzzy.
When everything is post modern and seperated a few of us may see that indeed nothing is. |
The fact is that its not so much about the genres crossing over, its those ¤%&#&% artists, they keep sneaking out of the box we try to hold them in.
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Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2755
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Posted: August 01 2011 at 09:38 |
tamijo wrote:
Proletariat wrote:
The more I learn about music the more I find that all the genres are poorly defined. Each genre crosses over with every other genre and the lines between them are fuzzy.
When everything is post modern and seperated a few of us may see that indeed nothing is. |
The fact is that its not so much about the genres crossing over, its those ¤%&#&% artists, they keep sneaking out of the box we try to hold them in. |
Well that's more or less what founded prog the genre, mixing with Classical (King Crimson, Yes, Geness, ELP), Jazz (King Crimson, ELP), Folk (Jethro Tull and early Genesis), etc.
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Failcore
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 27 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 4625
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Posted: August 01 2011 at 13:58 |
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Metallica, what the crap. I would have added almost every other Thrash band ever before adding Metallica.They had no experimental/progressive attitude at all.
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 18063
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Posted: August 03 2011 at 16:11 |
Slartibartfast wrote:
A couple come to mind for me: ELO and Kraftwerk. I wasn't really big into either of these but I had Out Of The Blue and Autobahn. When I became a big prog fan, I didn't keep up with either. So it was years between me moving on and joining this site. When I saw they were here I was surprised, but I still don't have any interest in getting back into them. Of course if any fans want to convince me... |
I personally like the stuff that came out around Kraftwerk, from the solo albums to all the early Ralf and Florian stuff. In many ways, the experimentation and fun derived from it was a lot more enjoyable of a listen than what became the commercialization of the synthesizer as a meaningless instrument ... that is ... the instrument that could do all the other instruments, and now ... cheaper, too!
ELO was very nice and I liked all their albums up until the one that had Eldorado, and all that ... after that I think it lost something. I personally enjoyed Roy Wood's Wizard a lot more, specially "Eddie and the Falcons" (fabulous pastiche of 50's music!) and then "Mustard" (hilarious satires, even on the Beach Boys!) ... but sadly, those albums were kinda ... lost in the shuffle. Not exactly progressive, but Roy was much more adventurous than ELO was, at least, insofar as playing his own instruments. I did think that ELO made the call to go "commercial", and I can't really blame them after so many years in the tank trying hard to make something to enjoy a better car or instrument. But I do like their early incarnation of "The Move" as well, and still have those albums!
But yeah ... Roll Over Beethoven ... and them prog archives! Time to do some rock'in'!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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kevin4peace
Forum Groupie
Joined: January 01 2011
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 98
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Posted: August 06 2011 at 12:46 |
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Back to the start of this thread... ELO and Kraftwerk are some of my favourite bands. Standing In The Rain off of Out Of The Blue is simply amazing. As for a full album, I'd suggest On The Third Day. Trans Europe Express is my favourite Kraftwerk album right now, although The Man Machine is great too...
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Nothing to say here. Nothing at all. Nothing is easy.
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DiamondDog
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 15 2011
Location: Cambridge
Status: Offline
Points: 320
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Posted: August 15 2011 at 23:37 |
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I like ELO, but I wouldn't personally call them a Prog band.
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For6luca
Forum Newbie
Joined: February 14 2010
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 31
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Posted: August 16 2011 at 11:06 |
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Metallica, my favourite band 15 years ago
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2755
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Posted: August 16 2011 at 14:33 |
DiamondDog wrote:
I like ELO, but I wouldn't personally call them a Prog band. |
I might, maybe up until El Dorado or Face the Music.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: August 16 2011 at 18:58 |
ghost_of_morphy wrote:
DiamondDog wrote:
I like ELO, but I wouldn't personally call them a Prog band. |
I might, maybe up until El Dorado or Face the Music. |
That seems to be the general consensus. Anyone here who was a fan of the commercial Journey and left them behind, surprised to see them here? Kind of like ELO in having prog origins but moving away.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 18063
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Posted: August 25 2011 at 18:13 |
Hi,
I kinda thought the thread was more about things that were/might have been considered prog that ... we don't listen to much anymore ... and I have a large list.
As stated before, I do not listen to "prog" or to any description of music whatsoever ... I listen to artists and their work.
And yes, lately I have listened again to some older things ... and they were still good after all these years and beers and comments! And I still don't care if they were prog or not!
Third Ear Band
Spontaneous Combustion (Triad album)
Kevin Ayers (Early stuff)
Roy Harper (very early stuff)
Edgar Broughton Band (still sounds magnificent after all these year! It is what punk couldn't do and meen it!)
Kingdom Come (Arthur Brown)
Colin Townes
Spooky Tooth (still love that Season of the Witch!)
Black Widow
Byzantium (both albums are awesome!)
Greenslade
Stackridge
XTC
Paul Butterfield Blues Band
Al Kooper
Marc Almond
Jack Nietzche - St. Giles Cripplegate
Ides of March
Lighthouse
Gil Scott Heron (... I doubt many here saw him, and realized who he was in the "performance" film ... and to boot, listen to those lyrics, to realize how insipid most rap lyrics are today compared to what he was doing!)
... and a few of the albums that did not excite me (again) just like they didn't then ...
Uriah Heep
Kansas
Deep Purple
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11420
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Posted: August 26 2011 at 08:03 |
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^ Glad to see you are once again at large Mosh
BUT
Ok you state disingenuously that you don't listen to 'Prog' but just 'artists' yet post such an assertion on a progressive rock forum? You have already made the demarcation that you deny exists.
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2755
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Posted: August 26 2011 at 09:29 |
Slartibartfast wrote:
ghost_of_morphy wrote:
DiamondDog wrote:
I like ELO, but I wouldn't personally call them a Prog band. |
I might, maybe up until El Dorado or Face the Music. |
That seems to be the general consensus.
Anyone here who was a fan of the commercial Journey and left them behind, surprised to see them here? Kind of like ELO in having prog origins but moving away.
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Journey is here? My God every band is prog related except for Boston (who really are prog related, btw.)
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 18063
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Posted: August 26 2011 at 15:36 |
ExittheLemming wrote:
^ Glad to see you are once again at large Mosh
BUT
Ok you state disingenuously that you don't listen to 'Prog' but just 'artists' yet post such an assertion on a progressive rock forum? You have already made the demarcation that you deny exists.
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That would be incorrect.
I post here because there are more people that have heard a lot of the music that I happen to love ... that "YOU", call it this or that is meaningless to me ... and remember ... that as long as the music lives ... is, the goal that you, or I, have for all this art ... isn't it?
Edited by moshkito - August 26 2011 at 15:39
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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