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Toaster Mantis View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2015 at 15:24
Originally posted by Lear'sFool Lear'sFool wrote:

On the acid rock divide, what history I've gathered about it starts with calling the psych-leaning proto-metal bands "acid rock", including Sabbath, but is often given now to really long, and ridiculously psych drenched, works of psych rock, and in either case almost always owes a debt going back to the Texas bands.


This kind of confuses me even further, because weren't Black Sabbath gradually moving away from psychedelia towards something different - i. e. from emphasis on atmosphere built up around using guitar distortion to develop the textures of the sounds towards more well-defined heavy riffing and linear constructed narrative songwriting? That's how I'd describe the evolution from psychedelic hard rock to early heavy metal in terms of just music composition, at least.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2015 at 15:34
^In my opinion, Sabbath were not acid rock but simply hard rock. The acid rock groups were mainly U.S. west coast groups like Jefferson Airplane, The Grateful Dead and, as someone stated, Moby Grape. Very standard guitar rock arrangements with no heavy elements, except for Hendrix who was in a world of his own, and was  consciously transferring himself out of Acid rock into Blues rock and R&B inspired material like the Band Of Gypsys.

Edited by SteveG - February 18 2015 at 15:37
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2015 at 15:52
^Btw, the music press did mislabel groups like Iron Butterfly, Sabbath and even Led Zeppelin as Acid Rock because they thought it was all about the heavy sound. The heavy sound was not necessary for the label  Acid Rock. Later on these bands would be mislabeled as Heavy Metal, but they were just heavy Blues Rock or Pre-metal pioneers in the 60's.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2015 at 16:01
I dislike the acid rock label in general. None of the definitions I've seen for it work. At best, they are redundant.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2015 at 16:06
And absolutely confusing! WackoLOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 19 2015 at 09:37
On the lighter side of Psych:
With much of the psych scene having negative consequences such as the deaths of Jimi, Morrison and Janis along with the acid casualties like Syd, Roky, and Brian Wilson, it's nice to have this non threatening and truly a "family fun" movie like 1968's The Beatles: Yellow Submarine.
 
A movie that's close to being an animated classic, that you can actually enjoy watching with your grand kids without being stoned out of your mind. Groovy.


Edited by SteveG - February 19 2015 at 10:58
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 20 2015 at 12:11
^ Definitely. If someone asked me "What is psychedelia?", I would point them to that.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 21 2015 at 08:36
A Tale of Two albums: The Beat Goes On and Renaissance by Vanilla Fudge.
 
The Beat Goes On. 1968. Sundazed Records remastered expanded edition.
The sixties album that's seen as merely a bizarre psychedelic music "cult' oddity as opposed to releases by other nascent psych albums like the first two albums released by both the 13th Floor Elevators  and The Red Crayola. The Beat Goes On convoluted history is better told in this album review from Allmusic that also references Vanilla Fudge's quickly recorded follow up album Renaissance, which featured original compositions by the group for the first time as has been hailed as a Proto Prog favorite.
I feel that The Beat Goes On has a Zappaesque undercurrent to it that music media album reviews never touch upon. Perhaps that they were not to familiar with Zappa's output at that time.
 
 
"The expanded CD release of this second Vanilla Fudge album is much more accessible than the original vinyl version because of the inclusion of a number of cover tunes, most notably Beatles songs. The revealing liner notes that Sundazed project manager Tim Livingston adds to the reissues of these Atco albums helps put this influential band in a better light. The Beat Goes On is a difficult record, especially after the explosion that was their debut. The single from their previous album, Vanilla Fudge, originally charted in the Top 100 in the U.S. in 1967. (Britain was more hip to the group.) They finally hit in America in the summer of 1968, but had already begun to influence Deep Purple and the Rotary Connection, among others. The problem with this project is that they failed to influence themselves. Bassist Tim Bogert notes that "The Beat Goes On was the album that killed the band," while guitarist Vinny Martell adds "we had already started our second album when Shadow (Morton) had this other concept idea for The Beat Goes On." Morton had produced the Shangri Las, not the Beatles, and this creative effort was by a group with only two hit singles arriving on the scene around the time of Sgt. Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band. Morton set before the boys a daunting task which needed much, much better execution. Renaissance, which they were recording simultaneous with this, at least included a Donovan tune, "Season of the Witch." The exotic wandering would have been better served by a reworking of "Strawberry Fields Forever" across a side of the disc instead of the keyboard notes which reference the tune. Even a killer guitar version of "The Beat Goes On" would have been more exciting than "18th Century Variations on a Theme by Mozart" or noodlings that can't decide if they are "Chatanooga Choo Choo" or "Theme to the Match Game." For a group of impressionable young kids out of high school, as referenced in the liners, this must've been extremely rough. The expanded CD has jam session versions of Elvis Presley's "Hound Dog" and the Beatles' "I Feel Fine," "She Loves You," "Day Tripper," "I Want to Hold Your Hand," and "You Can't Do That." Any of these extended à la "Eleanor Rigby" from their debut would be more desirable than the interview-type questions about sex; the Beatles' interest in "Indian meditation" (sitar enters here, and how would the VF know?); audio newsclips of John F. Kennedy, Hitler, and others, all a very strong argument against artistic control for some producers. Exploring the initial ideas that brought them fame was what was expected of Vanilla Fudge. What would you rather hear, readings from The Bible or the single from January 1968, "The Look of Love" b/w "Where Is My Mind"? Thankfully, Sundazed has included the Bacharach/David tune and two additional Mark Stein titles, "All in Your Mind" and the aforementioned B side, "Where Is My Mind," on the expanded Renaissance album, the real follow-up to the Vanilla Fudge debut. Historically important, listening to this archive piece is truly a labor of love, with the emphasis on labor."  (exerted from the Allmusic record guide website) 
 
 
Renaissance. 1968  Sundazed Rcords remastered edition.              
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Edited by SteveG - February 21 2015 at 09:49
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 05:38
On the subject of Scorpions' beginning as a psychedelic hard rock group before evolving into more streamlined heavy metal they are famous for now, their sophomore Fly to the Rainbow can be as recommended as bridging the gap between Lonesome Crow and that:



This is a very curious album, in that it shows off both the long stretched-out Hendrix-gone-Krautrock psychedelic space on downer epics and the harder riff-driven fast songs that would come to define heavy metal soon following its 1974 release date. The weird thing is that the two kind of influence each other, the surreal and colourful cover art is misleading as the long epics are significantly heavier and darker than those on Lonesome Crow. At the same time, the songs that predict newer metal styles have a lot of psychedelic playing around with guitar textures going on... which gives them a rather different feel from the more neoclassical Ritchie Blackmore-type approach to hard rock guitar playing that'd prevail eventually.





There are also more ballad-type songs, that I frankly find more interesting than most metal groups' since the psychedelic influences are still there to keep them from getting too monotonous.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 11:35

Another punk band gone all psychedelly for an album. Meat Puppets built off of the psych leanings of the track "Aurora Borealis" from their seminal second album to craft a whole album of Cowpunk Floyd.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 12:31
^Seems like everybody's has some Psych in their closets. Amazing!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 12:56
The first concert I ever saw was Alice Cooper with Jo Jo Gunne and...Captain Beyond. Two really good albums from the good Captain, but they went nowhere, and to my knowledge they are now currently available for keg parties at the local VFW Hall. Anyone care for their Psych/hard rock style?
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 12:59
^Absolutely! kind of like a real heavy version of Hawkwind at times. Good stuff.
 
Btw, I remember that two members were ex Iron Butterfly. If that doesn't confirm their heavy Psych Rock status, nothing will! LOL
 


Edited by SteveG - February 22 2015 at 13:04
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 13:06
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

^Absolutely! kind of like a real heavy version of Hawkwind at times. Good stuff.
 
Btw, I remember that two members were ex Iron Butterfly. If that doesn't confirm their heavy Psych Rock status, nothing will! LOL
 
 
Yes, now that you mention it, there is a resemblance -- except the vocals are better.Wink
 
Not that it has to do anything with the conversation, but I am currently listening to Donovan's "Intergalactic Laxative", which I guess adds a new dimension to "space rock".
 
 
 


Edited by The Dark Elf - February 22 2015 at 13:06
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 13:13
^Yes, I've only heard the album Cosmic Wheels a few times so I guess it's time to give it another spin.
 
I guess you could call it Psychedelic Space Folk Rock. Whew, that's a mouthful!


Edited by SteveG - February 22 2015 at 13:14
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 13:22
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

^Yes, I've only heard the album Cosmic Wheels a few times so I guess it's time to give it another spin.
 
I guess you could call it Psychedelic Space Folk Rock. Whew, that's a mouthful!
I think Donovan was virtually spent by the time this album came out (1973 I think). His earlier albums with influence by Bert Jansch were really nice.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 13:49
Very much so.
No one - not even Donovan - can keep on a roll forever.

"Cosmic Wheels" was his first fall.
Much of this lp is just embarrassingly bad.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 16:47
Hmm....I never thought of Captain Beyond as being' Psych rock' but then it is all subjective in the end.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2015 at 17:23
The first Capt Beyond ,like the first Scorpions , can likely safely be considered proto-metal.No way I see the first lp as being psych.It has also been compared to the self-titled Armaggedon lp.

"Sufficiently Breathless " was a completely different (but I think, better) kettle of fish: acoustic guitar, more mellow.

Between the 2nd lp and "Dawn Explosion" passed nigh four years. I'd say the 3rd lp has elements of protoprog (only you would have to clarify its being protoprogISH due to the late date of '77). One thing for sure its a patchy lp.




For those interested ,here is a list of the known live sets:

4-30-72 Montreaux Jazz & Blues Festival, Montreaux, Switzerland (DVD) 1st gig EVER.
5-6-72 Bickershaw Festival, Lancashire, England
7-19-72 Galic Park, The Bronx, New York City, N.Y.
8-19-72 "unknown venue" Miami, Florida
10-6-73 University Of Texas, Arlington, Texas (opening for King Crimson, this is the best known live)
5-26-77 Night Gallery, Chicago, Illinois (FM Broadcast)
6-12-99 Karlshamn Rock Festival, Karlshamn, Sweden (Soundboard)
7-18-99 "Unknown Venue" Orlando, Florida (DVD)
10-15-99 Hustler Bar, Indiatlantic, Florida


Edited by Kayleur - February 22 2015 at 17:31
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 23 2015 at 11:02
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Hmm....I never thought of Captain Beyond as being' Psych rock' but then it is all subjective in the end.
It's also down to their lyrics Doc, and even their name implies something not of this word! LOL

Edited by SteveG - February 23 2015 at 11:02
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