UEFA EURO 2024 |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi, France has not played well since Mbappe got hurt, but I think the coach has put together a defensive plan to ensure that the other teams do not score a goal, if at all. The issue with this is that Mbappe is kinda wasted up front, and when he is used, he is almost alone and easier to mark. I think Spain is playing too well to not win this one, probably 1-0, or 2-0. The England game I don't know that I want to even watch it ... I think that Harry Kane is hurt and is playing because he cares, but if he can no longer run hard and forward, he needs to be removed, although I might like to see him for a half ... because he has a knack for the ball in the end, that is very scary. The defense has been strong, and sadly, it makes for games that are difficult to watch and I hope that UEFA addresses that in the future ... the stonewalling in many the last games of the groups, and then the Quarters, is a sad statement about how the game is getting better. If England scores, I think the Netherlands could be in trouble, but I'm not sure they will be trying to break the stonewall by the English. Likely take their chances on penalties. But a lot depends on the English and if they can score first. I would not pick or bet on this game!
Edited by moshkito - July 08 2024 at 06:56 |
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King of Loss
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 21 2005 Location: Boston, MA Status: Offline Points: 16442 |
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Not going to happen. He will never drop Kane. It took a lot of guts from him to drop Maguire from the squad.
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28028 |
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It's either that or take a risk and go for a system where he gets more support. Kane wants to drop back when he should be trying to hold the ball up. When he played deep for Spurs at least they had Son running past him. Netherlands will not be that commital though although in Van Dyk they have a player who can run the game if he gets too much space to go into midfield. Expect another very cagey game. As a sideline I can't believe that UEFA have put a German referee in charge with a betting scandal behind him. It might end up being absolute chaos!
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi, Kane up front playing the hold up is NOT his game, and my guess is that he is getting hit hard by the defense, and it slows him down. But if he is even "trying" to hold up, someone should be running up like Son did with the Spurs ... the folks sitting back and waiting to see what he does is bad ... he will have 2 or 3 defenders on him, and his ankles are going to be hurting by half time! Not sure at all if this is the issue or not ... but I don't see Kane as a hold up guy ... a poacher definitely ... but hold up?
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28028 |
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^ yep for sure and there in lies the problem. With the type of player England has in midfield, Ivan Toney provides a great focal point. It would be brave to start Toney though for such a game. Massive gamble and Southgate is not the gambling man.
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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HI,
There is a precedent for what I said about Harry Kane and his possibly being a hold up man ... by getting hit in his legs and ankles. This happened many years ago when Czechoslovakia played Brazil and they were afraid that Pele would take over the game. And right away they started hammering him on his legs and ankles, and eventually he had to be subbed off right after the start of the 2nd half because his ankles were all swollen. And this was a World Cup game! The rules, immediately went after that, however, with almost no TV at the time, only radio, the visual side of it was not very clear, but the majority of that strategy still survived for many years, and ... as another example ... Altidore of the American team, in the Premier League was used to ge a hold up man, and he ended up getting hurt a lot because of it. Nowadays, however, with broadcasters and the VAR calls, folks will get caught playing the kick your leg/ankle thing, with one exception ... if you hit the ball first, then it is considered a fair challenge, and that might have to be addressed in the future. But, in my book, any coach setting up a statue for punishment and bird poop, I doubt he/she will be around for long ... he will lose too many players to injury because of it. And you can't win without the players! This is what made the Spain stuff a few years back so famous ... the passes were made BEFORE the defense was setup and always to the uneven side of the pitch, and this took away the statue of punishment play ... and teams that were physical were the ones that Pep feasted on the most for the longest time, until a coach could figure out how to play Pep's teams ... well, guess what ... he's still ahead of the curve with Manchester City! I would love to see him do a World Cup team, either Spain, or someone else ... what is weird for me, is seeing coaches that were not good enough for the Premier League coaching teams in the World Cup ... I think that some teams just didn't know what they were doing or gave a darn about a coach ... specially an American!
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi, This game is sooooo uncertain for me ... I keep thinking 0-0 for 120 minutes and maybe a shootout. Or 1-1 .... I don't think that the Netherlands is going to sit back and wait for England to score ... it's more likely that England will play back and have the Netherlands try their luck, and get caught on a long run, with their defense too far up ... but I'm not sure that England is a good long ball team at all! ... but I still do not think it will matter ... this is one game I do not have a feel for at all ....
Edited by moshkito - July 10 2024 at 12:38 |
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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King of Loss
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 21 2005 Location: Boston, MA Status: Offline Points: 16442 |
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Watkins in the 90th minute! England into the final!
I see a Spanish victory though...
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi, It will be an interesting game for sure, but we know for sure that England can find a score ... and this might be the difference in it all ... I have to agree that Spain looks better all around, but some England individual "brilliance" as one broadcaster stated, might be enough to make a difference. But yeah .... I'm sure the oddsmakers will be thinking that Spain has already won this game ... but all of a sudden the English manager does things "right" ... and the team wins!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Lewian
Prog Reviewer Joined: August 09 2015 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 14727 |
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England can't rely on a last minute goal or penalties all the time. OK they played mostly well against the Netherlands but really neither in this game we got the impression that they could control the game. Maybe it was just about deserved, maybe not, but if this is the best they can come up with, I don't see them as a danger for Spain. (I don't think the Dutch were among the best 5 teams of this tournament.)
I remember many tournaments in which the best team won in the final against another team that somehow scraped through and nobody understood how (the Germans got some second places in this way). You've got to give to Southgate though that he has proved that it makes some sense what they do... at least that... By the way the Americans have listened to you Pedro - Berhalter is out.
Edited by Lewian - July 11 2024 at 11:07 |
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28028 |
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England actually play well shocker. Still needed a great Jordan Pickford save and a very dodgy VAR decision to get England over the line. Still way too much space at times for the Netherlands to run into and if Spain are given that much room on Sunday we will be murdered. Luckily I no longer have to work Mondays so I can 'enjoy' the game and have a few beers!
Edited by richardh - July 11 2024 at 11:08 |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi,
I watched the highlights, and I thought it was cool. And that Watkins goal was outstanding. The penalty ... the rules need to get cleaned up more, but as stated, that would be a penalty and VAR was right, though many didn't like it, but the players, ALL OF THEM, are aware of the rules and how they can come into force, so a player taking what appeared to be a shot at the player, is going to get a closer look ... I just am not a fan of the game turning over a 50/50 foul ... but too many players on defense and midfield play for that these days. Can they beat Spain? ... I'll throw the Tarot, then go to the Golden Nothing and check the Oracles, and then send a prayer to the moon, and then ... look at a beer (I can't drink!) ... and then take a gulf of iced tea, or water. Maybe I'll find a result in that ... weirdness! PS aside: Berhalter needed to go ... and Klinsmann made the point on his comments ... he wanted the team to do more Copa Americas and difficult tournaments, so the players would get "tougher". Berhalter only wanted to play the mid-table level teams, probably because he (obviously) did not think his team had enough of guts and gumption to go learn from the better teams ... I kept saying all these years, do a tour of European teams every year with tough games ... but it never really happened. You can't get better if you do not have a tougher opponent to learn from. I'm only surprised that Uruguay only played for 1-0 ... and I think they were being "NICE" and "GENEROUS" the whole game, knowing damn well they could score whenever they wanted. That all aside, the next coach, is not going to be a great one ... I doubt the USA can get Klopp or Tuchel. And the folks running the game are the problem, and they will end up selecting a home person ... and then say that the luck of the draw for the better managers available was not "there". Both Klopp and Tuchel will want more control than the US soccer turkeys at the top don't want to give up or away.
Edited by moshkito - July 11 2024 at 11:46 |
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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King of Loss
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 21 2005 Location: Boston, MA Status: Offline Points: 16442 |
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The best team won and I applaud them for beating 4 former World Cup winners in route to the Euro 2024 title!
I'm sorry for England, but they were second best for most of the match.
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Nogbad_The_Bad
Forum & Site Admin Group RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Online Points: 20847 |
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Agreed but still pissed off
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28028 |
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Kane should have been taken off at half time. As usual Southgate was behind the curve. After Watkins and Palmer came on it was a different game and then it got very interesting. Spain dominated possession generally but struggled to break down a very well organised England. I agree they were the better team overall and the 2-1 was a result I expected. England can take heart that in Bellingham, Foden and Palmer we have a trio of outstanding creative talent that few can match. We need to harness this in the next few years and hopefully find a coach who can fully exploit their potential. England are here to stay as a force in major competitions.
Edited by richardh - July 14 2024 at 21:24 |
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28028 |
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Following the resignation of Southgate, I would gladly take Eddie Howe. Very tactically adept and someone who is able to manage top players. Not sure about Graham Potter, failed to get to grips with Chelsea although Pochettino (another candidate) didn't do much better there either. We can dream of Klopp or Guardiola. Unlikely but might be worth the gamble of putting Lee Carsley in charge for a year and then seeing how the ground lies. Pep will just about be done at Man City by then but I suspect he will have his eyes on the Spanish job. Likewise Klopp is more likely to be the German choice once he finishes his sabbatical.
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Nogbad_The_Bad
Forum & Site Admin Group RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Online Points: 20847 |
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Eddie earns double what Southgate did and the club has a huge release clause the FA would have to pay.
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi, This was visible against Spain as well ... I think that the strategy from England was to clutter the middle of the field to prevent passes to an open area ... but Spain used the open spaces really well ... What is interesting is that this Spanish team is likely the same one that is going to the WC ... and I would think they are, already, the favorites. Brazil has lost its ability to stay together and organize to make themselves better ... the continuing saga of the fights over the manager, is the most boring movie ever! And then, the media upset that the coach wants to make use of the other 9 players on the pitch, instead of just one! No wonder they ... stink, these days. Colombia, will be interesting ... we'll see how they do in the WC trials for South America. I think Argentina is not going to be #2 this time, probably #4 or #5 in the region and still make it wo the WC, but not sure they will go very far without some of the great players they have had. Venezuela, is wanting to make it to the WC for the first time, and they might just squeeze in ... should be an interesting zone to keep track of which will tell us how strong the teams really were at Copa America.
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Hi, There was a cartoon, by an Australian guy that was very with it ... he had several folks talking while laying down on the ground camping. At they all had a blurb on them about their dreams. And all of them, had the usual requests ... except one. On the edge was a very skinny, and likely hungry guy and he goes ... "I dream of chicken". What you want, what you need, and what you get, are 3 very different things and ideas. The bigger issue in England, like the one in America, is deciding to turn left, or turn right ... here they know they have to be able to stay with European and South American teams, but they don't want someone from the "outside" and will endup with another MLS retread ... hoping for something that is not there, and it won't be there. Unless you play in Europe, a lot, an American team with Berhalter or a MLS coach is always going to look bad ... I'm not sure that England would ever pick a 2nd level or minor coach for the job, although I think they need something new and something that they don't have and need. We, as a MLS coaching turkey, do not have the tactical acumen to make things better, and we can't improve those on the chalkboard, or our minds ... we have to go there, and learn it step by step ... which the USA is not willing to do, otherwise they would have given Berhalter more games in Europe, which, btw, would likely get him removed sooner than the way it happened. Again, we don't get it! Guts! I'm of the opinion that MLS still has about 20 years to get better, however, I'm not sure they understand or give a darn about getting bigger or better with small time stadia. Heck, there are teams in the leagues below the English Championship that have bigger stadia! I kinda think that the league has this idea that the commercial side will gain more traction than the numbers at the door. Oh well ... so much wondering and thinking ... I need an aspirin!
Edited by moshkito - July 18 2024 at 07:19 |
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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