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Was Pete Sinfield essential for King Crimson? |
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RockHound 
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Joined: March 03 2013 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 664 |
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 Posted: March 10 2024 at 17:28 |
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ITCOCK as it is would not have been possible without Sinfield’s lyrics, end everything for the band flowed from there. The flow between Sinfield KC and the later material was nothing short of magical in their later tours.
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SteveG
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Joined: April 11 2014 Location: Kyiv In Spirit Status: Offline Points: 20604 |
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Posted: March 11 2024 at 06:12 |
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Yes. Sinfield was as essential as a lyricist to KC as Keith Reid was to Procol Harum and Betty Thatcher was to Renaissance.
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moshkito
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Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17510 |
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Posted: March 11 2024 at 09:17 |
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Hi,
I'm a believer in the "magic" that makes things work ... and Pete helped in many ways, that helped his name as a writer, and deservedly so. Would it be different without him? Silly question, since it happened WITH him! We've got to give credit to the resulting response ... some of the albums ended up being very well liked and enjoyed. Time to concentrate on something else other than bizarre questions?
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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Sean Trane
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Prog Folk Joined: April 29 2004 Location: Heart of Europe Status: Offline Points: 20240 |
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Posted: March 12 2024 at 03:30 |
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in the still-recent ITCOTCK rockumentary, Frippy still dismisses Sinfield's "aerie-faerie" contributions. (there is also a brutal accusation of an original member being "the ultimate cµnt") But then again, everything in that film is made to have us think that the final KC iteration is the best one ever. .
Edited by Sean Trane - November 15 2024 at 16:24 |
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
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moshkito
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Posted: March 12 2024 at 08:25 |
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Hi, I think, and RF states it, that the band was a total effort, not an individual thing, although he regrets having had issues with at least one member at the time. The thing about PS would be, more than likely, that he wasn't a musician, and why is he here? Again, I don't think the album would have been as good/great without all the folks that were in it ... you and I can see their abilities and work on various pieces of music, and how even the lyrics, "aerie-fairie" or "artsy" would not make the album look/appear any worse ... it made it better, despite folks that think that rock lyrics are better than poetry and that folks with poetic works don't belong in rock'n'roll, and should only put together Chuck Berry lyrics, or bubble gum crap lyrics that were so much a part of the radio in those days, BEFORE the American FM radio made that stuff obsolete! The time for, and of, progressive music in the early days, had a lot of what we think is "aerie-fairie" or "artsy" and eventually lost its taste because those folks did not know how to maintain a true wordsmith alive ... and even folks like Bob Dylan, while a very good poet, is pretty much "anti-poetry" and "anti-art" in the sense that he won't follow any ideas ... it's all about his feel at the moment, nothing else. Pete Sinfield, is NOT one of my "favorites" in terms of poetry, but he is a good one, and he deserves a lot more respect than the trash he is being subjected to ... even if we think it is not perfect ... it only tells you one thing ... many of those folks hate the arts, because rock music, in general is not really an art ... it's just another popular song ... and in the 21st Century ... the way the audience wants it ... regardless!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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Hrychu
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Joined: November 03 2013 Location: poland? Status: Offline Points: 5357 |
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Posted: March 19 2024 at 07:52 |
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no
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“On the day of my creation, I fell in love with education. And overcoming all frustration, a teacher I became.”
— Ernest Vong |
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Zappastolethetowels
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Posted: March 19 2024 at 13:02 |
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hardly essential... he was an additional piece who contributed light shows and fantasy surreal lyrics from their foundation until 1971. the guy could not play anything ASAIC Crimson was all about the music in the end so my answer is no, he was not essential
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Zappastolethetowels
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Posted: March 19 2024 at 13:03 |
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careful how we use the word "essential"
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richardh
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Posted: March 19 2024 at 17:04 |
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… The rusted chains of prison moons Are shattered by the sun I walk a road horizons change The tournament's begun The purple piper plays his tune The choir softly sing Three lullabies in an ancient tongue For the court of the crimson king … The keeper of the city keys Puts shutters on the dreams I wait outside the pilgrim's door With insufficient schemes The black queen chants the funeral march The cracked brass bells will ring To summon back the fire witch To the court of the crimson king … The gardener plants an evergreen Whilst trampling on a flower I chase the wind of a prism ship To taste the sweet and sour The pattern juggler lifts his hand The orchestra begin As slowly turns the grinding wheel In the court of the crimson king … On soft grey mornings widows cry The wise men share a joke I run to grasp divining signs To satisfy the hoax The yellow jester does not play But gently pulls the strings And smiles as the puppets dance In the court of the crimson king Source: LyricFind Songwriters: Greg Lake / Ian Mcdonald / Michael Rex Giles / Peter John Sinfield / Robert Fripp The Court of the Crimson King lyrics © Universal Music Publishing Group |
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RockHound
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Posted: March 19 2024 at 18:49 |
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I think that answers the question just fine.
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Zappastolethetowels
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Posted: March 19 2024 at 19:36 |
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^ please don't make me write a 4 stanza poem
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Sean Trane
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Posted: March 20 2024 at 02:45 |
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Not only he was toying with the VCS3 from the soundboard and worrying about the light show. I think he also chose the superb artworks for the first four album (the Crimson sleeves were never better than then, since). We all saw what Frippy did after he kicked Sinfield out (Earthbound). |
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
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Moyan
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Posted: March 20 2024 at 08:23 |
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Moyan
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Posted: March 20 2024 at 08:24 |
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SteveG
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Posted: April 01 2024 at 08:32 |
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Sinfield had a certain thematic vision for the 1st album and that had a great effect on the musicians. They wrote music around his lyrics, so yes he was essential.
Edited by SteveG - April 01 2024 at 08:32 |
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Heart of the Matter
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Posted: April 01 2024 at 08:54 |
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Another way for the same question: Would have ITCOTCK been that essential prog album, without PS? And the answer is...
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Steve Wyzard
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Posted: November 15 2024 at 12:08 |
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It's now November and I'm reviving this because I'm sure there will be a lot of discussion about Pete after the announcement of his passing. Just wanted to say that I agree with the above, and that my favorite of his KC lyrics is "Islands".
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stegor
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Posted: November 15 2024 at 13:03 |
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Pete was an ingredient. You can bake a cake without sugar but it wouldn't be very good. After Pete they stopped baking and started cooking.
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Valdez
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Posted: November 15 2024 at 15:29 |
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I'd say he was essential for the early success of King Crimson, Yes.
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https://bakullama1.bandcamp.com/album/sleepers-2024
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AFlowerKingCrimson
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Posted: November 15 2024 at 15:57 |
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I would say he was more important than essential. His weird lyrics certainly fit their often weird music. I don't think any other lyricist would have been a better fit than him and I prefer his lyrics over the somewhat pretentious lyrics of Richard Palmer James. RIP Pete.
Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - November 15 2024 at 15:57 |
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moshkito wrote: