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Close to the Edge question
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richardh View Drop Down
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Points: 29593 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 15 2019 at 03:12
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by Spacegod87 Spacegod87 wrote:

I like Relayer a little better as well. Only because I'm not as big a fan of Siberian Khatru as everyone else seems to be..

This is my thinking .... so don't get any ideas that I believe this to be true.

In the past 20 years, most of the fans, progressive or not, have heard a lot of music in rock, from prog to a lot of other things, that included a lot of guitar thrashing, and it made the mode and the idea of it much more viable as a true instrument and a compositional item.

Thus, a much younger fan, that has heard a lot of things like Dream Theater, Iron Maiden and many other bands that love to guitar loud and play so many notes and scales, would (more than likely), enjoy RELAYER a lot more and better than they would the more melodic and classical minded CTTE, and then the compositional design of TFTO ... something that RELAYER appears to not have, and gives away to a more ... let it all hang out ... kind of thing.

In terms of "better", that is so subjective and crazy that I am not sure that any opinion is representative or the right thought or context, specially within the band's canon and history. It all becomes a part of the ensemble called YES and its music history. 

For me, the better album is trivial ... I would tell you in 1.2 seconds that TFTO is the album I love the most, and not name a 2nd or 3rd album from that group at all ... but that would be a bit on the preference side. Composition-ally, I find that they had their best work with Rick Wakeman in those early days, but sadly, he has trashed and talked too much crap about too much of it, and his work on the solo side, has not even half the design and ability that the band showed, including the talent it takes to help define something so different and valuable, which his solo albums did not do ... even past the first solo album, that while nice, was a mess in terms of pure design and composition!

And all the rest, is just fan fiction and some money laundering for the fans who suck it all up!
 

I love Judas Iscariot and actually much of the Criminal Record album. I put that album and also Six Wives above much of Yes work including TFTO and Relayer but accepting that CTTE is virtually untouchable. A lot of this is taste of course but Wakeman elevated Yes although Moraz was a very capable replacement indeed. There are maybe only a small handful of keyboard players that could have filled that position and Jobson and Emerson were probably the only other two!
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patrickq View Drop Down
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Points: 508 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 15 2019 at 04:01
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

This forum loves to debate endlessly in circles

Yeah, that’s how I knew I was in the right place.

Edited by patrickq - June 15 2019 at 04:03
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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It's more like a Möbius loop.
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Originally posted by Jaketejas Jaketejas wrote:

It's more like a Möbius loop.

You mean kinda saying something, but nothing at the same time?
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Comic relief!
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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... or a Klein Bottle.
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miamiscot View Drop Down
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Both Relayer and Close To The Edge make my Top Ten list.

They are both perfect. Obviously Relayer is the more daring record, CTTE the more melodic one.

They are siblings. Separated only by my favorite LP of all time - Tales From Topographic Oceans.
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Frenetic Zetetic View Drop Down
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Originally posted by patrickq patrickq wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

This forum loves to debate endlessly in circles

Yeah, that’s how I knew I was in the right place.

Hey, I'll be the Roundabout Cool.

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Originally posted by miamiscot miamiscot wrote:

Both Relayer and Close To The Edge make my Top Ten list.

They are both perfect. Obviously Relayer is the more daring record, CTTE the more melodic one.

They are siblings. Separated only by my favorite LP of all time - Tales From Topographic Oceans.

So then wouldn't that mean that Relayer, CTTE AND Tales from Topographic Oceans all make your top ten? WinkWhich Genesis and KC albums make your top ten?
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And You and I.
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Points: 6052 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jamesbaldwin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 24 2019 at 19:35
Originally posted by patrickq patrickq wrote:

Originally posted by jamesbaldwin jamesbaldwin wrote:

Isn't the last minute of AYAI a wasted moment?
In my opinion AYAI should finish after 6 minutes.

“And You And I” is a bit drawn out. I think it works as part of the album, but yeah, they could’ve accomplished the song in six minutes. It’d be interesting to see what they would’ve done with an extra 3 or 4 minutes on Close to the Edge.

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I prefer by far CTTE for the use of syncopation, contrasting parts, agility through different moods, juggling with effects, harmonies and sequences, between very uptight and very quiet; the sound feels more like open air – Relayer has more of a "studio" feel and esp Howe's playing feels akward, while he delivers superbly in CTTE
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patrickq View Drop Down
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/\
Close to the Edge is definitely smoother, Relayer is more “angular” as they say. Sounds corny, but each is great in its own way...
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micky View Drop Down
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Points: 46838 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2019 at 20:41
Originally posted by patrickq patrickq wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

This forum loves to debate endlessly in circles

Yeah, that’s how I knew I was in the right place.


hahaha
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kenethlevine View Drop Down
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micky View Drop Down
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^ fail....   find one with a cat next time.. they are cuter...
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^Micky, you know I prefer cats but they are too dignified to chase their tail, at least when the camera is on them
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micky View Drop Down
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bah..  yeah I suppose you have the right of it. Fail revoked...
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miamiscot View Drop Down
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by miamiscot miamiscot wrote:

Both Relayer and Close To The Edge make my Top Ten list.

They are both perfect. Obviously Relayer is the more daring record, CTTE the more melodic one.

They are siblings. Separated only by my favorite LP of all time - Tales From Topographic Oceans.

So then wouldn't that mean that Relayer, CTTE AND Tales from Topographic Oceans all make your top ten? WinkWhich Genesis and KC albums make your top ten?

1. Tales From Topographic Oceans
2. The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway
3. Fragile
4. Foxtrot
5. Close To The Edge
6. Larks' Tongues In Aspic
7. Thick As A Brick
8. Relayer
9. Brain Salad Surgery
10. Red

This is probably as close as I can get to determining my true and authentic Top Ten.
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richardh View Drop Down
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Points: 29593 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 01 2019 at 23:59
^ if you flip that ten then it wouldn't be far off my own symph prog top ten. Larks and Tales would have to go and would be replaced by Trick and the Refugee album (which I like more than Relayer) .
I would probably want to stick some VDGG in there as well.
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