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Topic ClosedTime for Indo-Prog/Raga Rock subgenre to go?

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Guldbamsen View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 02:07
If this is our rationale, then we'd better scrap Canterbury too. The one difference between the two? More people are into Canterbury, which in turn means that there are more people trying to shoohorn newer bands into a genre that really ceased to exist a couple of decades back. Sure I can spot a lot of modern acts that play in the Canterbury vein....but they are not part of the Canterbury scene. Look up the genre. It was and is a very small scene that somehow got a lot of scattered fans worldwide....which also means more people to keep the fire going...or at the very least convince everybody that Canterbury isn't really a scene as much as it is a sound. Hah! That is some risky historic backpedalling right there...to account for the whims of the fans.
Indo prog raga rock is and was never that popular....so it sadly doesn't get the same nonsensical yet heartwarming treatment.
I like it = keep it!
I don't really understand it = scrap it!

But yeah for the 10000th time: TALK TO THE SITE OWNER IF YOU WANT SOMETHING MAJOR DONE TO THE SITE!
You want half stars? Go talk to the site owner.
You want individual album tagging? Go talk to the site owner.
You want a green frontpage? Go talk to the site owner.

You want a kiss? Go treat your missus right.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 02:17
Originally posted by tempest_77 tempest_77 wrote:

Originally posted by BrufordFreak BrufordFreak wrote:

Originally posted by wiz_d_kidd wiz_d_kidd wrote:

I recently had the same thought when I submitted a Celtic-prog band, "The Moors", for possible inclusion in the database.  Someone suggested they be classified as Indo/Raga, but I disagreed, and recommended Prog Folk (althought that isn't even the best place for them).

I might suggest a more general genre called "World Fusion".  The Celtic guys can go there.  The Indo/Raga guys can go there.  I think the band Azigza (mis-classified as Jazz Rock/Fusion, IMHO) should go there.  The definition of the World Fusion sub-genre would be:

Bands that base their music on the traditional music of various parts of the world, whether it is their own native area, or some other.  The music, while based on traditional songs and motifs, exhibits the characteristics of progressive rock.  This genre include other sub-genres such as Celtic Prog, Indo/Rag Prog, Prog Gypsy, Afro-Prog, Prog Viking Metal.  Examples bands in the genre include Azigza, The Moors, Quintessence, Tir Na Nog, Huun-Huur-Tu, Beats Antique, Koraii Orom, Lumsk, and even soundtracks of Cirque du Soleil. 

I would LOVE a World Fusion category in the stead of the Indo-Prog/Raga Rock one! Great suggestion. And I LOVE the Cirque du Soleil and Blue Man Group musics! And so many film soundtracks!


I second this idea. I think it's a great solution to the issue.


This is a fantastic definition/solution, and I support it entirely.


Edited by Frenetic Zetetic - February 08 2018 at 02:17

"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 03:37
+1 for 'World Fusion', though such a tag may be harder to properly justify as part of a prog site. Still, a number of artists under Indo/Raga (like Abstract Truth or Satwa) are already not really inspired by Indian music but just by local folk in general.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 05:03
Just to be clear: I was being facetious with my earlier post. I don't want to see the Canterbury sub go because it is a good "sticker" for the music found underneath...just like the acts featured under Indo/Raga is tbh. Sure we could probably file most of those artists under prog folk, Kraut, psych or in the odd case avant, but my point was actually that if you look into the different subs a little closer, you'll fairly quickly be able to pick them apart. They're imperfect boxes put there to better locate the music we dig. That is all really.
Hell every band found in Canterbury can either be moved to fusion, psych or avant.
The Indo/Raga sub is only a soar thumb to an otherwise imperfect system. Album tagging has always been the way forth with perhaps fewer "big" subs like fx Psike, Zart, Symph and Modern. Underneath you'd get various stickers with all the small scenes and endemic sounds.
Again there is no one on this board other than M@X who can do anything about it...and we can't reach him, so there you go.
Great ideas often crave keys to the cockpit.

Edited by Guldbamsen - February 08 2018 at 05:09
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 11:10
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:


But yeah for the 10000th time: TALK TO THE SITE OWNER IF YOU WANT SOMETHING MAJOR DONE TO THE SITE!
You want half stars? Go talk to the site owner.
You want individual album tagging? Go talk to the site owner.
You want a green frontpage? Go talk to the site owner.


I sent a private message to M@X.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 11:27
Good luck. I really mean that
Just an fyi: I don't think I can remember the last time anyone got a mail back from him.
If you do get through to him then be a champ and ask him about the infinitely more important subject of removing those infernal captchas.
A new subgenre is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down the list of things to improve on PA. Way down. Personally I'd get rid of katjas, get a full system reboot and implement album tagging. The last thing takes care of any and all problems pertaining to subgenres and such.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 14:53
Persoanally i'm not for getting rid of any categories here. I'm on the side of creating even more. I was a biology major so i have a thang for nomenclature LOL

In reality i really love creating categories for nuances and there are an extraordinary amount within the huge umbrella term "progressive rock." 

Tags i would see helpful on this site would be firstly the splitting of post and math rock. At least for tagging. Andalusian prog is considered by many to be valid. Brutal prog is en vogue as of late reserved for the most unrelenting avant-proggers out there. Maybe even prog pop for some of the crossover acts. Classical progressive for artists who utilize extreme classical features. 

In a perfect world i would love a way to address the contuing fusion effect of the styles. For examples Krautrock should also have Kraut-fusion for bands like Embryo that seem equally Kraut-rock and jazz-fusion. Bands that utilize avant-prog and jazz-fusion could be avant-jazz-fusion or something.

Yes, i'm aware of all these ideas going nowhere but since Drew started us down this rabbithole, i may as well share my proggy doggy dreams LOL

Dreams and Goals



Edited by siLLy puPPy - February 08 2018 at 14:54

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2018 at 15:37
Just a note of caution that World Fusion is a very broad term and everything I have heard of that style over the years is not related to prog or progressive rock. The term tends to denote experimental folk music (in VERY broad terms).


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2018 at 17:38
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Persoanally i'm not for getting rid of any categories here. I'm on the side of creating even more. I was a biology major so i have a thang for nomenclature LOL

In reality i really love creating categories for nuances and there are an extraordinary amount within the huge umbrella term "progressive rock." 

Tags i would see helpful on this site would be firstly the splitting of post and math rock. At least for tagging. Andalusian prog is considered by many to be valid. Brutal prog is en vogue as of late reserved for the most unrelenting avant-proggers out there. Maybe even prog pop for some of the crossover acts. Classical progressive for artists who utilize extreme classical features. 

In a perfect world i would love a way to address the contuing fusion effect of the styles. For examples Krautrock should also have Kraut-fusion for bands like Embryo that seem equally Kraut-rock and jazz-fusion. Bands that utilize avant-prog and jazz-fusion could be avant-jazz-fusion or something.

Yes, i'm aware of all these ideas going nowhere but since Drew started us down this rabbithole, i may as well share my proggy doggy dreams LOL


I guess this is where I've come out after all this: let's really shake things up by expanding with some mitosis. We'll call it "progress" (or, at least, evolution).

Drew Fisher
https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2018 at 17:40
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

If this is our rationale, then we'd better scrap Canterbury too. The one difference between the two? More people are into Canterbury, which in turn means that there are more people trying to shoohorn newer bands into a genre that really ceased to exist a couple of decades back. Sure I can spot a lot of modern acts that play in the Canterbury vein....but they are not part of the Canterbury scene. Look up the genre. It was and is a very small scene that somehow got a lot of scattered fans worldwide....which also means more people to keep the fire going...or at the very least convince everybody that Canterbury isn't really a scene as much as it is a sound. Hah! That is some risky historic backpedalling right there...to account for the whims of the fans.
Indo prog raga rock is and was never that popular....so it sadly doesn't get the same nonsensical yet heartwarming treatment.
I like it = keep it!
I don't really understand it = scrap it!

But yeah for the 10000th time: TALK TO THE SITE OWNER IF YOU WANT SOMETHING MAJOR DONE TO THE SITE!
You want half stars? Go talk to the site owner.
You want individual album tagging? Go talk to the site owner.
You want a green frontpage? Go talk to the site owner.

You want a kiss? Go treat your missus right.

DAVID! You sound like a disgruntled, burned out, underpaid ex-employee! What has gotten into you?Hug
Drew Fisher
https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2018 at 19:52
^ That wasn't the only post I made;-)
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

Just to be clear: I was being facetious with my earlier post. I don't want to see the Canterbury sub go because it is a good "sticker" for the music found underneath...just like the acts featured under Indo/Raga is tbh. Sure we could probably file most of those artists under prog folk, Kraut, psych or in the odd case avant, but my point was actually that if you look into the different subs a little closer, you'll fairly quickly be able to pick them apart. They're imperfect boxes put there to better locate the music we dig. That is all really.
Hell every band found in Canterbury can either be moved to fusion, psych or avant.
The Indo/Raga sub is only a soar thumb to an otherwise imperfect system. Album tagging has always been the way forth with perhaps fewer "big" subs like fx Psike, Zart, Symph and Modern. Underneath you'd get various stickers with all the small scenes and endemic sounds.
Again there is no one on this board other than M@X who can do anything about it...and we can't reach him, so there you go.
Great ideas often crave keys to the cockpit.
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2018 at 20:32
Uh....this is off topic  but if we can't reach [email protected] happens if something happens to the board or it glitches or crashes or ...? Is that the end then...?

?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2018 at 20:42
^That would indeed be one way to get rid of the Indo-raga category, but obviously not the preferred method LOL

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2018 at 07:28
Shouldn't there be a back up 'moderator' who has power to fix things here if M@X takes a powder..?
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2018 at 07:57
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Uh....this is off topic  but if we can't reach [email protected] happens if something happens to the board or it glitches or crashes or ...? Is that the end then...?

?


I always email Max when any of his sites crash, he's always pretty quick to fix those kind of things.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2018 at 08:07
yeah.. in hindsight I should have sent my killer offer via email.. not in a thread he likely never read.. an offer he wouldn't have been able to refuse (sex crazed redheads rule.. especially satanic ones).. perhaps that is why he still owns the site.. and it continues to flounder... rather than Micky and Raff making Prog Archives great again hahah
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2018 at 08:13
Never too late - send that email right away, will you, and count me in (redheads can make ME great again...eventually)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2018 at 08:30
I like you too much to torture you with her. Becks ate lesser men for breakfast.. which is why I have no problem with M@X losing his mind, soul, being physically abused with flying pots and pans and being emasculated.. though always with a smile on one's face.

You don't want a part of that trainwreck.. only macho sadists and tough guy live by the seat of pants freaks like me enjoy airline crashes with that.  However you know second thing I do after getting rid of Captcha is making you and Eugene co-admins. Mick and Raff (ie fire and ice) would be surprisingly hands off (the days of us being active day to day on the site really are over)... we do know who on this site is engaged and cares about the damn site and wants to see it improve. Those are teh people we would empower to make the changes the site needs to grow.. and perhaps regain the fun and passion of the old days.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2018 at 08:46
*** spits lemon tea with honey over old valve monitor ***

Noooooo, no more work, I want my readhead and to be like you !!!! LOL
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