| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Ivan_Melgar_M 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19535
|
 Posted: September 30 2015 at 09:38 |
For God's sake, it's a damn poll.
I don't believe Talk Talk is Prog...But what the hell.
If Talk Talk wins....Hybris will continue being as good as it is, the poll won't change a bit the nature of the album.
"A Kind of Blue" was in the top albums of the site and it's not remotely Prog, but that ranking didn't changed the natiure of the album.
Let it be Svetonio.
|
|
|
 |
sublime220
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 21 2015
Location: Willow Farm
Status: Offline
Points: 1563
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 10:21 |
|
|
|
There is no dark side in the moon, really... Matter of fact, it's all dark...
|
|
chopper
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 20030
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 11:02 |
 Svetonio wrote:
chopper wrote:
Svetonio wrote:
Art-Rock the manner of singing is Rock manner of singing, not Prog Rock manner; |
Er 
Nope, still not getting it.
|
Ah, it had to be so pathetically predictable that the Talk Talk's fans who are pushing their fav band / one of top fav bands into Prog and rape our beloved genre with that action, will "still not getting it", although it's evidently that Talk Talk, even with their 80s art-rock effort titled Spirit of Eden, has nothing to do with Prog.
|
It's nothing to do with whether Spirit is prog or not, I just didn't understand what you meant by "Art-Rock the manner of singing is Rock manner of singing, not Prog Rock manner". I was actually interested in what you saw as the difference between the two, but if you're just going to be rude then I won't bother to ask again. It's nothing to do "raping our beloved genre" (What a ridiculous comment!). Regardless of what you think, Talk Talk are on PA under Crossover so deal with it.
|
|
GentleGiant
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 09 2006
Location: PantagrueLand
Status: Offline
Points: 445
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 13:09 |
One more vote for Hybris (stupid poll) 
|
|
BeGiantForADay
"This British band is just the cup of tea for aficionados who demand virtuosity,progress and originality in their mix."
http://rateyourmusic.com/~GentleG
|
|
dr wu23
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 22 2010
Location: Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 20623
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 16:42 |
Hmmm....imho neither album deserves to be in a final for best modern prog album......but then I mostly listen to old retro classic stuff anyway....and bands that have a similar style. So there it is.
|
|
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin
|
|
t d wombat
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 14 2007
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 504
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 18:09 |
|
Do I think either of these albums are the epitome of Prog ? Course not, but that is just the way the poll worked out. Big deal. Me I didn't know either of these two before this and now own them both so hey, I'm happy.
|
|
Andrew B
“Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” ― Julius Henry Marx
|
|
sublime220
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 21 2015
Location: Willow Farm
Status: Offline
Points: 1563
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 19:14 |
t d wombat wrote:
Do I think either of these albums are the epitome of Prog ? Course not, but that is just the way the poll worked out. Big deal. Me I didn't know either of these two before this and now own them both so hey, I'm happy.
|
Exactly what this poll was supposed to be about. Not all this bullsh*t about some albums not being prog (Svetonio, I'm looking at you) or thinking that some Moroccan band that you like deserves to be in the final.
|
|
There is no dark side in the moon, really... Matter of fact, it's all dark...
|
|
Svetonio
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 20 2010
Location: Serbia
Status: Offline
Points: 10213
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 22:35 |
chopper wrote:
Svetonio wrote:
chopper wrote:
Svetonio wrote:
Art-Rock the manner of singing is Rock manner of singing, not Prog Rock manner; |
Er
Nope, still not getting it.
|
Ah, it had to be so pathetically predictable that the Talk Talk's fans who are pushing their fav band / one of top fav bands into Prog and rape our beloved genre with that action, will "still not getting it", although it's evidently that Talk Talk, even with their 80s art-rock effort titled Spirit of Eden, has nothing to do with Prog.
|
It's nothing to do with whether Spirit is prog or not, I just didn't understand what you meant by "Art-Rock the manner of singing is Rock manner of singing, not Prog Rock manner". (...)
|
Why Tommy is a rock-opera, why it is not a prog-rock opera? Whether due to lack of odd-time signatures? Of course not, because there are the odd time signatures at Tommy. Or maybe it's because Roger Daltrey sings in Rock manner? Roger Daltrey was even left the Who in 1968 for a while because didn't want to sing Townshend' songs in prog manner and refused that the songs would be arranged in prog manner what actually was a desire of always fashionable Pete Townshend to turn The Who into prog band just because "progressive music" was something the most "IN" in the fashionable London in late 60s. However, Roger Daltrey was a hardcore fan of Elvis Presley and he didn't like prog. (I read in an article that Roger Daltrey, when Townshend showed to him his first songs for Tommy, said "do you expect me to sing this sh*t?") I'm not a music teacher nor a musician, just a fan, so I can't explain those things on that "school way" if you expected so, but I already gave some examples. For a smart person it would be enough to understand that Rock manner of singing and Prog manner of singing is not the same thing. Actually, it's very different. Why? Probably the main reason is that that in Prog the voice is way more just one of the instruments than in Rock.
Edited by Svetonio - September 30 2015 at 22:53
|
|
Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19535
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 23:39 |
Svetonio wrote:
Why Tommy is a rock-opera, why it is not a prog-rock opera? Whether due to lack of odd-time signatures? Of course not, because there are the odd time signatures at Tommy. Or maybe it's because Roger Daltrey sings in Rock manner?
Roger Daltrey was even left the Who in 1968 for a while because didn't want to sing Townshend' songs in prog manner and refused that the songs would be arranged in prog manner what actually was a desire of always fashionable Pete Townshend to turn The Who into prog band just because "progressive music" was something the most "IN" in the fashionable London in late 60s. However, Roger Daltrey was a hardcore fan of Elvis Presley and he didn't like prog. (I read in an article that Roger Daltrey, when Townshend showed to him his first songs for Tommy, said "do you expect me to sing this sh*t?")
|
What?
Overture Underture Amazing Journey 1921 Welcome We're not Gonna Take it
Are Prog tracks.
The fact that Tommy is not a full Prog Opera is because in 1968 PROG HAD'T DEVELOPED COMPLETELY.
This has no relation with the vocals
Svetonio wrote:
I'm not a music teacher nor a musician, just a fan, so I can't explain those things on that "school way" if you expected so, but I already gave some examples. For a smart person it would be enough to understand that Rock manner of singing and Prog manner of singing is not the same thing. Actually, it's very different. Why? |
It's more than obvious you're not a music teacher.
The manner of singing is a matter of personal characteristics and vocal range, if the music fits into the Prog genre, you can put Axl Rise to sing and will still be Prog.
Svetonio wrote:
Probably the main reason is that that in Prog the voice is way more just one of the instruments than in Rock. |
What?
David Byron's Uriah Heep Greg Lake's ELP Peter Gabriel's Genesis Steve Walsh's Kansas David Surkamp's Pavlov's Dog John Wetton's King Crimson Fish's Marillion Francesco di Giacomo's Banco del Mutuo Soccorso PFM Le Orme
Are bands in which vocals and lyrics are as important as any instrument.
And could mention 100 more
Have you ever heard Jesús de la Rosa from Triana?
The music is pure Prog and he was a damned cante Hondo singer.
Have you ever heard Jose Cid?
Sings like a frustrated hard rock vocalist, but 10,000 Anos Depois Entre Venus e Marte is 100% Prog
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - September 30 2015 at 23:45
|
|
|
|
Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65255
|
Posted: September 30 2015 at 23:45 |
|
Semantics, gentlemen. It's all semantics.
|
|
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
|
|
Svetonio
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 20 2010
Location: Serbia
Status: Offline
Points: 10213
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 00:29 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Svetonio wrote:
Why Tommy is a rock-opera, why it is not a prog-rock opera? Whether due to lack of odd-time signatures? Of course not, because there are the odd time signatures at Tommy. Or maybe it's because Roger Daltrey sings in Rock manner?
Roger Daltrey was even left the Who in 1968 for a while because didn't want to sing Townshend' songs in prog manner and refused that the songs would be arranged in prog manner what actually was a desire of always fashionable Pete Townshend to turn The Who into prog band just because "progressive music" was something the most "IN" in the fashionable London in late 60s. However, Roger Daltrey was a hardcore fan of Elvis Presley and he didn't like prog. (I read in an article that Roger Daltrey, when Townshend showed to him his first songs for Tommy, said "do you expect me to sing this sh*t?")
|
What?
Overture Underture Amazing Journey 1921 Welcome We're not Gonna Take it
Are Prog tracks.
(...)
|
I disagree. Only these three instrumental tracks (you forgot Sparks) are the prog parts of Tommy 1969 the original album .
p.s. Oh and I forgot that only one full-prog track at that art-rock album titled Tommy!
Edited by Svetonio - October 01 2015 at 05:31
|
|
chopper
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 20030
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 09:43 |
Svetonio wrote:
chopper wrote:
Svetonio wrote:
chopper wrote:
Svetonio wrote:
Art-Rock the manner of singing is Rock manner of singing, not Prog Rock manner; |
Er
Nope, still not getting it.
|
Ah, it had to be so pathetically predictable that the Talk Talk's fans who are pushing their fav band / one of top fav bands into Prog and rape our beloved genre with that action, will "still not getting it", although it's evidently that Talk Talk, even with their 80s art-rock effort titled Spirit of Eden, has nothing to do with Prog. |
It's nothing to do with whether Spirit is prog or not, I just didn't understand what you meant by "Art-Rock the manner of singing is Rock manner of singing, not Prog Rock manner". (...)
|
Why Tommy is a rock-opera, why it is not a prog-rock opera? Whether due to lack of odd-time signatures? Of course not, because there are the odd time signatures at Tommy. Or maybe it's because Roger Daltrey sings in Rock manner?
Roger Daltrey was even left the Who in 1968 for a while because didn't want to sing Townshend' songs in prog manner and refused that the songs would be arranged in prog manner what actually was a desire of always fashionable Pete Townshend to turn The Who into prog band just because "progressive music" was something the most "IN" in the fashionable London in late 60s. However, Roger Daltrey was a hardcore fan of Elvis Presley and he didn't like prog. (I read in an article that Roger Daltrey, when Townshend showed to him his first songs for Tommy, said "do you expect me to sing this sh*t?")
I'm not a music teacher nor a musician, just a fan, so I can't explain those things on that "school way" if you expected so, but I already gave some examples. For a smart person it would be enough to understand that Rock manner of singing and Prog manner of singing is not the same thing. Actually, it's very different. Why? Probably the main reason is that that in Prog the voice is way more just one of the instruments than in Rock. |
I'm obviously not smart enough to understand so I'll give up.
|
|
dr wu23
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 22 2010
Location: Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 20623
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 09:57 |
Uhh....what does The Who have to do with the thread topic? Leave it to Mr S to bring in an irrelevant point.
|
|
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin
|
|
Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23104
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 10:26 |
Yeah.....maybe we could get back on track here  Using up 3-4 pages worth of incomprehensible explanation of something no one other than the poster himself understands/gives a sh*t about, is perhaps pushing the envelope a bit too far.
Who cares what sticker fits best on Spirit of Eden? It is a most gorgeous album.
|
|
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
|
|
Raff
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 29 2005
Location: None
Status: Offline
Points: 24429
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 10:42 |
Guldbamsen wrote:
Yeah.....maybe we could get back on track hereUsing up 3-4 pages worth of incomprehensible explanation of something no one other than the poster himself understands/gives a sh*t about, is perhaps pushing the envelope a bit too far.
Who cares what sticker fits best on Spirit of Eden? It is a most gorgeous album.
|
*Standing ovation* 
|
|
Svetonio
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 20 2010
Location: Serbia
Status: Offline
Points: 10213
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 10:44 |
dr wu23 wrote:
Uhh....what does The Who have to do with the thread topic?Leave it to Mr S to bring in an irrelevant point. |
Actually, chopper asked me for more explanation how that manner of singing is the most noticeable difference between Prog and Art Rock. I gave some examples - The Beatles, 10cc, 80s Townshend solo stuff and The Who's rock-operas. Sadly, he's not able yet to hear the differences.
Oh and this is a forum for the music discussions if you forgot that.
Edited by Svetonio - October 01 2015 at 11:09
|
|
Svetonio
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 20 2010
Location: Serbia
Status: Offline
Points: 10213
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 10:58 |
Guldbamsen wrote:
(...)
Who cares what sticker fits best on Spirit of Eden? (...)
|
LOL! Who cares because that art-rock / ambiental album Spirit of Eden "wins" at this poll, if we (almost) all know that Anglagard's Hybris is the true winner regarding the modern (and "modern") Prog albums at this tournament.
Edited by Svetonio - October 01 2015 at 11:44
|
|
Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23104
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 11:03 |
Svetonio wrote:
(...) Who cares (...) |
No one.
|
|
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
|
|
chopper
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 20030
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 13:35 |
Svetonio wrote:
dr wu23 wrote:
Uhh....what does The Who have to do with the thread topic?Leave it to Mr S to bring in an irrelevant point. |
Actually, chopper asked me for more explanation how that manner of singing is the most noticeable difference between Prog and Art Rock. I gave some examples - The Beatles, 10cc, 80s Townshend solo stuff and The Who's rock-operas. Sadly, he's not able yet to hear the differences.
Oh and this is a forum for the music discussions if you forgot that.
|
Well I must have missed your "example" of The Beatles and 10cc but quoting Roger Daltrey and The Who doesn't give an example of the difference between singing in prog and art rock - that's just quoting band names. I can obviously see a difference between Daltrey's rock singing of something like Baba O'Reilly and Jon Anderson's more sedate style, I presume that's what you mean, however Daltrey can sing quieter songs and Anderson can rock a bit. Where would you place someone like John Wetton?
|
|
TheGazzardian
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 11 2009
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8676
|
Posted: October 01 2015 at 19:11 |
|
Kind of disappointed that the 'modern prog' final is two albums that are closer to 1970 than the current year
Edited by TheGazzardian - October 01 2015 at 19:11
|
|
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.
/PAlogo_v2.gif "Progarchives.com Homepage")
Modern album FINAL!!! Hybris v. Spirit of Eden
