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Topic ClosedSo We Really Can't Criticise Admin?
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Negoba View Drop Down
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Points: 5208 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 20:44
Once you've spent some time as one of the real human individuals making decisions for groups of people, you'll get a little bit of what's going on. 

It's quite difficult to be even handed and generous when those you're making decisions for are petty and adolescent. Much easier if they are simply friendly adults. Common courtesy is common for a reason.

Keeping dirty laundry private is more to protect folks like you than those in charge.
You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
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Textbook View Drop Down
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Points: 3281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 20:14
SD: I believe in transparent government and so I refuse to handle things like this in PM. What are we hiding from people? Here I am, here's the things I say, like them or don't. That's how things should be handled.

If someone says something relevant in a PM, it should be revealed so the dialogue can continue in public.
 
However, as you noted it was sent to me as a PM and so I am not naming the person who said it to respect their wish to be anonymous. But I'm not going to pretend it wasn't said.
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Points: 3595 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 18:15
Admins are people too, is what the general consensus is. If I knew Dean in person I'd probably develop a contemporary respect for the man. As it stands, I only know him as well as I know most folks on this site. 'Tis a shame, 'cause I imagine I'd have a really good time hanging out with more than a couple people here. 

And yeah - comin' straight from da underground.
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Points: 32995 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 17:10
Originally posted by Angelo Angelo wrote:

Noticed what?

That you were no longer Admin of course.
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Points: 32995 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 17:09
^I really think I'd better avoid making a comment. Not sure you should reveal a PM but as you didn;t say who its from itsd probably ok
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Textbook View Drop Down
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Points: 3281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 16:51
I got a private message from a higher up saying "thanks for that Textbook, why don't we just let people destroy the site".
 
This is what I'm talking about. It's a massive over-reaction. Does anyone that the censored posts were, or are capable of, destroying the site?


Edited by Textbook - May 02 2012 at 17:06
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Angelo View Drop Down
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Points: 13244 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 15:01
Noticed what?
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I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected]
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Points: 32995 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 14:08
Originally posted by Angelo Angelo wrote:

Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

First of all I hate when people use "the admins" as some general term that makes it ok to treat the individuals like crap. It's Dean, Angelo, h.ro, and maybe some others. These are folks we interact with in forum and they have choices to make. Their job is to maintain the integrity of the site, not to make you feel like you can exercise your freedom. They make judgment calls.
 
Here's some reality. If you poke someone with a stick, they're less likely to do you any favors. Some will bite back. It has nothing to do with justice. Just friggin common sense. You poke alot of folks with sticks around here. Don't be surprised if you don't get touchy feely in return.

Actually, that is a pretty good summary of what I was thinking about writing when I read the above posts. As admin/moderator one has to make judgement calls, and judgement will include looking at the content of the post, the choice of words, the reputation of the author and the context/time in which the post is written. Looking at recent history, in terms of threads started and discussions had, as well as the whole lot of flack received by the admins in a certain thread (which was closed by me on the public forum, but which lasted for quite a while in the collaborators zone), it's obvious that one of the admins decided to not let Textbook's thread run it's course. 
As to why this one is not closed I can only guess, but I reckon the relatively civil manner in which this issue is being discussed here.

The reason I can only guess is related to the only flaw in your post: since last week, I am no longer on the admin team and I don't have access to the admin zone anymore.

^Wow. Just never noticed that.
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Angelo View Drop Down
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Points: 13244 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 14:04
Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

First of all I hate when people use "the admins" as some general term that makes it ok to treat the individuals like crap. It's Dean, Angelo, h.ro, and maybe some others. These are folks we interact with in forum and they have choices to make. Their job is to maintain the integrity of the site, not to make you feel like you can exercise your freedom. They make judgment calls.
 
Here's some reality. If you poke someone with a stick, they're less likely to do you any favors. Some will bite back. It has nothing to do with justice. Just friggin common sense. You poke alot of folks with sticks around here. Don't be surprised if you don't get touchy feely in return.

Actually, that is a pretty good summary of what I was thinking about writing when I read the above posts. As admin/moderator one has to make judgement calls, and judgement will include looking at the content of the post, the choice of words, the reputation of the author and the context/time in which the post is written. Looking at recent history, in terms of threads started and discussions had, as well as the whole lot of flack received by the admins in a certain thread (which was closed by me on the public forum, but which lasted for quite a while in the collaborators zone), it's obvious that one of the admins decided to not let Textbook's thread run it's course. 
As to why this one is not closed I can only guess, but I reckon the relatively civil manner in which this issue is being discussed here.

The reason I can only guess is related to the only flaw in your post: since last week, I am no longer on the admin team and I don't have access to the admin zone anymore.
ISKC Rock Radio
I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected]
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lazland View Drop Down
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Points: 13635 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 13:22
^ Absolutely.
Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org

Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time!
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Negoba View Drop Down
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Points: 5208 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 10:00
First of all I hate when people use "the admins" as some general term that makes it ok to treat the individuals like crap. It's Dean, Angelo, h.ro, and maybe some others. These are folks we interact with in forum and they have choices to make. Their job is to maintain the integrity of the site, not to make you feel like you can exercise your freedom. They make judgment calls.
 
Here's some reality. If you poke someone with a stick, they're less likely to do you any favors. Some will bite back. It has nothing to do with justice. Just friggin common sense. You poke alot of folks with sticks around here. Don't be surprised if you don't get touchy feely in return.
 
 
 
 
You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
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Smurph View Drop Down
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Points: 3167 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 09:45
I hate the cops. Btw I actually am retarded but we prefer the term mentally handicapable. Because we're better than everyone.
 
 
The mentally handicapable revolution is at hand soon, and you won't see it coming. For we will be coming, ON YOU.
 
 
Btw I don't think the mods are out of touch. They are doing their best job to keep this place enjoyable for everyone. I know it might stifle some things but I don't think they are trying to be jerks to any specific person. I think its safe to say that political leaders, policemen, and the upper crusted elite people of the world are out of touch.
 
Honestly this is just a forum on the web. If anyone gets super bothered by it they need to take a step back and just do something else. We are all just trying to enjoy ourselves. If a post if deleted, find another way to word it or just move on to the next topic. Nothing we say on progarchives is THAT important. The only important things on here is helping each other find amazing music. Everything else is just silly good times. :-)


Edited by Smurph - May 02 2012 at 09:50
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 09:39
Ok so they have basically allowed the discussion to be had after all. This thread hasn't been closed, it's in the right area of the forum, and contains the original post in all its glory, plus it actually deals with your original subject, admin criticism. 

And remember I'm one of the notorious "cop haters" around here...  
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Snow Dog View Drop Down
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Points: 32995 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2012 at 04:01
I'm too scared to criticize them. I'm already hanging by a thread.

But personally, I see nothing wrong with any of the posts that you had censored. If one member of the Admin team decide to do something though, they all pull together and hold the line. They don't criticise each other. Once a decision by one  has been made however wrong or misjudged it was, they will all publicly support it.
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Alitare View Drop Down
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Points: 3595 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 01 2012 at 18:21
EDIT: My head hurts

Maybe nobody should be listening to me for advice.


Edited by Alitare - May 01 2012 at 18:33
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Textbook View Drop Down
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Points: 3281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 01 2012 at 18:00
Alitare: As with Robert's previous post, this is a strange tack to take. It's like you're actually saying I'm correct but it's OK to flout authority when you feel like it which I'm pretty sure you don't really mean.
 
Robert: I think the place would be better if the mods weren't so out of touch. By drawing attention to it, change may (or may not of course) eventually come about.
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dreadpirateroberts View Drop Down
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Points: 952 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 01 2012 at 17:27
Originally posted by Textbook Textbook wrote:

Dreadpirate: That's a hugely suspicious tactic. It's like you can't disagree with what I'm saying so you're flying off in another direction, specifically ad hominem.
 
Epig: We've had those threads. By all means start one. Just expect return fire ;)
 
Let me re-phrase. What is a post like your OP contributing to this forum? (and by extension, several of your other posts, past and future)


Edited by dreadpirateroberts - May 01 2012 at 17:29
We are men of action. Lies do not become us.
JazzMusicArchives.
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Alitare View Drop Down
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Points: 3595 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 01 2012 at 17:25
Textbook, you are not special enough for this. You are not the master of a coveted, secret knowledge which we mere intellectually-deprived peons are not, nor will ever be, privy to. You are not the sole possessor of a mythic power granting you certitude and indefatigable verisimilitude in all things. 

I see you as this upstart, mock-revolutionary. "Maybe I'm onto something! Hey guys, we're being oppressed! These authority figures hide behind their power! They censor me because they know I'm right!" Prog-Archives isn't Tienanmen Square, nor is it the hill atop Golgotha. You can play-pretend at being a martyr with your tiny plastic cross, but nobody is impressed.

I don't take offense at your condemnation of PA's...ahem...'upper class'. I've been very close to being banned numerous times. I merely find it humorous that you seem to think yourself a mighty special case. What ideas have you truly conceived that nobody else could've possibly hit upon? 

Not that I disagree. You're probably being targeted due to your reputation. I see insults being flung around this place all the time. I don't think the admins are afraid of being criticized. I think they simply don't like you because you seem like an obnoxious punk child. I could care less if you're 43 with two children and a harem of wives, you seem like an obnoxious punk child. 

Now for the truly important question: How much wood could a wood-chuck chuck if a wood-chuck could chuck Raspberries!?
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Points: 22774 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 01 2012 at 17:19
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

I would be more interested in a thread critical of all the young people here who are more crotchety than all the geezers I know combined.  Are kids already that cynical, pissed off, and easily offended?  Ermm

I'd contribute to that thread with my cynicism and pissiness.
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Textbook View Drop Down
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Points: 3281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 01 2012 at 17:14
Dreadpirate: That's a hugely suspicious tactic. It's like you can't disagree with what I'm saying so you're flying off in another direction, specifically ad hominem.
 
Epig: We've had those threads. By all means start one. Just expect return fire ;)
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