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Progosopher 
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 Posted: May 01 2011 at 15:07 |
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Prog lyrics are not worse than in other genres, and frequently better than most. I think this is a misconception possibly because prog fans tend to salivate over technical instrumental prowess than lyric content.
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The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"
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Isa
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 26 2009
Location: California
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 15:19 |
It's pretty plain to me that (in general) most prog lyrics beat (in general) most pop/rock lyrics. "Back in black, I hit the sack it's been too long I'm glad to be back..." some would say this is superior to: "To stand within the pleasure dome, decreed by Kubla Kahn to taste anew the fruits of life, the last immortal man!" ... are you f***ing kidding me?  |
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The human heart instrinsically longs for that which is true, good, and beautiful. This is why timeless music is never without these qualities.
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TheLionOfPrague
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 16:06 |
Well, Waters, Hammil, Anderson (Ian, of course).
There are some awesome lyricists.
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I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place
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twosteves
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 19:10 |
 1791 Overture wrote:
Fish's lyrics are great; very visual and at times very political. It's Fish's vocal histrionics that get very tired  Now Jon Anderson's lyrics in my opinion are just plain awful at times! |
Jon Anderson pretty much pioneered his own style of lyric-writing, though, what with the 'word painting.' And it's not just about the words, it's how you can match the phrasing and vowel sounds to create something interesting. Every time I hear
Faster moment spent spread tales of change within the sound,Counting form through rhythm electric freedom
Moves to counterbalance stars expound our conscience
All to know and see the look in your eyes |
I can't help but think 'wow, that's really cool.' It describes the music so perfectly, and nobody else could do that like Yes did. |
I AGREE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.
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prog058
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:01 |
The Truth wrote:
What's wrong with Fish? His lyrics fit the themes he's writing about perfectly. |
I meant Fish is an exception. He's my favourite lyricist :)
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The Dark Elf
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:06 |
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I think Peter Gabriel and Ian Anderson are fine lyricists with a poetic flair, adept at wordplay and, in the case of Anderson, offered some of the best double entendres ever written in the rock idiom. They are certainly on a higher literary level than many crasser rock acts who Spinal Tap so wickedly satirized in songs such as "Lick My Love Pump" (in D minor).
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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prog058
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:12 |
Bonnek wrote:
I usually ignore lyrics, that's why I probably listen more to instrumental music and to Prog then to singer-songwriters.
Also modern metal is a winner, as growls have the advantage that you can't understand the lyrics.
In the Prog realm, it's only Hammill's lyrics that have intrigued me somewhat over the years.
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I agree. I tend to listen to the lyrics more in other genres than in prog because I'm mainly interested in the music above all else.
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prog058
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:16 |
Alitare wrote:
Yes, because Rush's adaptation of Ayn Rand's Anthem in 2112 was quite the poetic masterwork that rivaled the original in depth and intellectual intrigue. :P Didn't Rush write the song 'I Think I'm Going Bald'? I never assume that the lyrics to prog are more intricate than the lyrics to non-prog on the whole. Most folks can agree that Nick Cave isn't prog, but as a lyricist he veritably trumps Rush, any era of Genesis, Yes (my word) or the like. I detest most prog lyrics. The Moody Blues? That awful poetry? Days of Future Passed is one of my all time favorite albums, but that 'cold-hearted orb...we decide which is right and which is an illusion' tripe gives me gas.
That doesn't mean that some prog bands don't have superb lyrics. Until he 'jumped the shark', so to speak, Ian Anderson was absolutely a brilliant lyricist in most rights. My question is, though, to do a few comparisons:
(lyrically, only)
King Crimson vs. Leonard Cohen
Yes vs. Bob Dylan (this one made me giggle a little)
Rush vs. Nick Cave
Emerson, Lake, and Palmer vs. Tom Waits. |
The way most people seem to be handling this is singling out one or two prog bands with great lyrics and saying, well there you go. It's like singling out a missing fossil in the evolutionary record and saying, well it mustn't be true, all the while turning your back on the mountains of evidence. I agree with what you have to say here. It's good to see people on this forum appreciating more than just the prog genre :) But Ayn Rand is a pseudo-intellectual bitch that created a cult haha
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prog058
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:23 |
The Dark Elf wrote:
I think Peter Gabriel and Ian Anderson are fine lyricists with a poetic flair, adept at wordplay and, in the case of Anderson, offered some of the best double entendres ever written in the rock idiom. They are certainly on a higher literary level than many crasser rock acts who Spinal Tap so wickedly satirized in songs such as "Lick My Love Pump" (in D minor). |
Paradoxically, these two musicians have also made a lot of music that wouldn't necessarily be called prog
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Garden of Dreams
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:23 |
Although usually lyrics aren't overly important to me, good lyrics add a whole new dimension to the song. Descent to bad lyrics don't necessarily detract from the music. However, some poor lyrics are can't be redeemed by the music.
Overall, prog lyrics aren't bad compared to other genres of music. I have heard some awful pop/rap/metal lyrics.
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The Dark Elf
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:27 |
prog058 wrote:
The Dark Elf wrote:
I think Peter Gabriel and Ian Anderson are fine lyricists with a poetic flair, adept at wordplay and, in the case of Anderson, offered some of the best double entendres ever written in the rock idiom. They are certainly on a higher literary level than many crasser rock acts who Spinal Tap so wickedly satirized in songs such as "Lick My Love Pump" (in D minor). |
Paradoxically, these two musicians have also made a lot of music that wouldn't necessarily be called prog
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Truthfully, the older I get the more confused I become about what "prog" is, or rather, what I thought it was, or perhaps the sheer amount of bands other folk have decided to pile into the genre. In fact, it's come to the point where I am ignoring the designation altogether. 
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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King Crimson776
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 20:54 |
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Peter Hammill and Peter Gabriel are fine lyricists, and in fact, I'd even take Jon Anderson's lyrics over all of the bile today.
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Slaughternalia
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 21:52 |
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Prog lyrics aren't great (ELP, I'm looking at you), but they get too much hate. They're not nearly as bad as the lyrics of today's pop music.
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Alitare
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 22:43 |
Okay, most folks say that they aren't as bad as today's pop lyrics. I can go you one further!
A pleasant faced man steps up to greet you he smiles and says he's pleased to meet you beneath his hat, the strangeness lies Take it off, he's got three eyes (hyuck!) - Twilight Zone, Rush vs. In a way I need a change from this burned-out scene Another time, another town, another everything But it's always back to you. - Shattered, OAR
And no, I am really NOT a fan of OAR (nice song, though).
Here we go!
I'll be the Round about The words will make you out and out I'll spend the day your way call it morning driving through the sound and in and out the valley! - Roundabout, Yes vs So scared of breaking it but you won't let it bend I've wrote 200 letters that I'll never send Sometimes these cuts are so much deeper than they seem You'd rather cover up I'd rather let them be - Misery, Maroon 5.
Again, definitely not the biggest M5 fan (nice song), hell, I'd take Yes over them, musically...but I can't really say that the typical prog rock lyrics are my cup of tea. It seems like their sole purpose is to be as far removed from humanity and emotional resonance as possible. Again, I cite my love of Ian Anderson, Devin Townsend, (some) Peter Gabriel, Hammill, and such, lyrically, but...come on...how many silly space battles and (misguided) philosophy quotes will it take before they stop being little nerds who get boners to swordfights and laser guns and WWII horsefights and sh*t?
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Henry Plainview
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 23:10 |
Almost all rock lyrics are terrible and prog is no exception. That's why you shouldn't listen to rock music.  I don't know how you can say that prog musicians aren't interested in literature, though.
Alitare wrote:
If a man quotes Atlas Shrugged, the Hippie counterculture, Nietzsche's Beyond Good and Evil, Edgar Alan Poe, 1984, the bible, and Tolkien all in one song,does it make the lyrics well written? For example: |
Er, no.
Alitare wrote:
come on...how many silly space battles and (misguided) philosophy quotes will it take before they stop being little nerds who get boners to swordfights and laser guns and WWII horsefights and sh*t? |
I can't think of any prog songs with space battles, laser guns, and whatever the hell a "WWII horsefight" is. Can you? That is an accusation people frequently make but I've never seen it backed up. You're right about the pseudo-philosophy, though.
Those OAR and Maroon 5 lyrics are pretty terrible, by the way.
Edited by Henry Plainview - May 01 2011 at 23:12
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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Harry Hood
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 23:14 |
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"Oh, Stanley Snail. Beauty begins at the foot of you!"
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Alitare
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 23:26 |
Henry Plainview wrote:
Almost all rock lyrics are terrible and prog is no exception. That's why you shouldn't listen to rock music.
I don't know how you can say that prog musicians aren't interested in literature, though.
Alitare wrote:
If a man quotes Atlas Shrugged, the Hippie counterculture, Nietzsche's Beyond Good and Evil, Edgar Alan Poe, 1984, the bible, and Tolkien all in one song,does it make the lyrics well written? For example: |
Er, no.
Alitare wrote:
come on...how many silly space battles and (misguided) philosophy quotes will it take before they stop being little nerds who get boners to swordfights and laser guns and WWII horsefights and sh*t? |
I can't think of any prog songs with space battles, laser guns, and whatever the hell a "WWII horsefight" is. Can you? That is an accusation people frequently make but I've never seen it backed up. You're right about the pseudo-philosophy, though.
Those OAR and Maroon 5 lyrics are pretty terrible, by the way. |
I was being all comical-like. I was speaking of Rush, Iron Maiden, Yes, and the like.
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Slaughternalia
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Posted: May 01 2011 at 23:45 |
Alitare wrote:
Okay, most folks say that they aren't as bad as today's pop lyrics. I can go you one further!
A pleasant faced man steps up to greet you he smiles and says he's pleased to meet you beneath his hat, the strangeness lies Take it off, he's got three eyes (hyuck!) - Twilight Zone, Rush vs. In a way I need a change from this burned-out scene Another time, another town, another everything But it's always back to you. - Shattered, OAR
And no, I am really NOT a fan of OAR (nice song, though).
Here we go!
I'll be the Round about The words will make you out and out I'll spend the day your way call it morning driving through the sound and in and out the valley! - Roundabout, Yes vs So scared of breaking it but you won't let it bend I've wrote 200 letters that I'll never send Sometimes these cuts are so much deeper than they seem You'd rather cover up I'd rather let them be - Misery, Maroon 5.
Again, definitely not the biggest M5 fan (nice song), hell, I'd take Yes over them, musically...but I can't really say that the typical prog rock lyrics are my cup of tea. It seems like their sole purpose is to be as far removed from humanity and emotional resonance as possible. Again, I cite my love of Ian Anderson, Devin Townsend, (some) Peter Gabriel, Hammill, and such, lyrically, but...come on...how many silly space battles and (misguided) philosophy quotes will it take before they stop being little nerds who get boners to swordfights and laser guns and WWII horsefights and sh*t? |
It's purely subjective. Personally, I prefer my lyrics to be cheesy and fantastical, or to be completely nonsensical, than to remind me of the problems of reality.
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King Crimson776
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Posted: May 02 2011 at 00:39 |
^^
Also, the lyrics "in and around the lake, mountains come out of the sky, they stand there" etc. become awesome in the context of the music (it certainly wouldn't pass as good poetry though).
Whereas those other emo lyrics are bad by themselves, *and made even worse by the context of the music*
Final verdict: Prog Rulez All
Edited by King Crimson776 - May 02 2011 at 01:41
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Harry Hood
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Posted: May 02 2011 at 01:02 |
Lyrical content is so diverse in this genre that it would be strange to generalize something as "prog lyrics". While there are some bands who just write pretty sounding nonsense to fit the music, there are others who can write lyrics that are profoundly personal. Both styles have their merits within the context of the music.
I'd love to hear a prog album with lyrics penned by John Darnielle.
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Prog often Plagued by Poor Lyrics?
